2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission Maybe Rear Drums are really better..

[hammersley]

Check this out over in DMAX land:



http://forum.thedieselpage.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=008067



"Page 106 of the September 2004 issue of Truckin magazine shows a 2003 Chevy 2500HD Duramax powered truck being fitted with aftermarket tires/wheels. On page 108, it shows the rear drums on this truck.....



So it appears at least in 2003, GM began using rear drums on at least some of its 2500HD trucks... .



I had heard a rumor a while ago that suggested that some E-brake components in the rear disk brakes were becoming a problem for their owners due to rust/corrosion in harsh environments. I suspect the midwest rust belt or a coastal area could contribute to rusting of the rear emergency brake components due to a lack of use. Unlike the emergency brake components in a drum brake equipped truck that are part of the regular brake system, the disk brake setups utilize a separate small drum and shoe components inside the rotors for the E-brake. Since many owners don't use the E-brake on a regular basis, the related components become less reliable over time.



I think there's a lesson here for those owners who have a rear disk brake equipped truck... That being to use the E-brake more often.



You can read more about this topic in the 2500HD/3500 Trucks & Drivetrain forum.



MP"

 

[EBottema]

Rear discs are nice but Drums are better. They last longer, Come on guys, if your looking for your truck to stop on a dime, go get a sports car... Remember its a truck, it is suppose to be rugged and tough, not docile... I know this is going to start a war!

lol

 

[RustyJC]

Rear discs are nice but Drums are better.

I had a 1996 3500. I have a 2002 3500. There's absolutely no comparison between the two - the disc brakes on the 2002 are head and shoulders above the disc/drum combo on the 1996.



Rusty

 

[dresslered]

I personally see advantages in either set-up. However, when you add up the "deletions list" that came out in 2001. 5 while obtaining the rear disks, I am glad that I got the "drum package" on my 2001. 0.

 

[y-knot]

I have a '97 3500 and it has rear drum brakes, they are fantastic. I replaced the wheel cylinders with larger units and switched to EGR shoes and SS lines, the difference is worth every penny I spent. Rear disk brakes are fine for people that use there trucks for commuting and light duty hauling, but when towing heavy and on very long descents, drums shine through. They have at least 10 times the surface area of disk, and that makes them stronger and more durable. Have you ever wondered why large over the road trucks all have drum drakes on the rears and on their trailers instead of disk?? Because drums are better at stooping heavy loads and they also last much longer. Disk brakes are fine on smaller vehicles, they do a very good job of stooping cars and light trucks quickly. They dissipate heat very well, and are easy to work on. Many, many of todays sports cars and even family sedans are equipped with disk brakes, there are many styles and models that can be easily switched between models making them cost efficient. Disk brakes also are very light and that reduced UN-sprung weight helps fuel economy and performance. Disk brakes are also easy to up-grade to larger more powerful units that are equipped with larger and more pistons then the stock models have. Probably the most important aspect to the car manufacturers is that disk brakes are simple to produce and to install, they save time while making a strong selling point, most find disk brakes to be better and usually that is true.

Drum brakes are old school, and most find them to be out-dated and things of the past. For most applications that is probably true, but for towing and heavy duty use there is nothing else that can compare. Braking strength, long wear, sever duty use are all traits of drum brakes, they have been around for years and will continue to be used in the heavy truck market for many more years to come. If you are having problems with your drum brakes, it is not because they are drums, rather because you have not taken the time to properly adjust, service or maintain your trucks drum brakes.

 

[RustyJC]

Rear disk brakes are fine for people that use there trucks for commuting and light duty hauling, but when towing heavy and on very long descents, drums shine through. They have at least 10 times the surface area of disk, and that makes them stronger and more durable.

Ummm... regarding towing heavy, you might want to check my signature. For a given size brake that can be installed inside a given size wheel, disc brakes have much greater heat dissipation capability - I don't see a lot of drum brakes on jet planes, Formula 1 race cars, etc - wonder why? I don't believe they would use an "inferior disc brake" just because it's cheaper and easier to work on, do you? As a matter of fact, manufacturers of high line 5th wheels offer the electric over hydraulic disk brake system as either standard equipment or as an upgrade due to its improved performance.



As I said, I've pulled heavy 5th wheels with trucks that had/have both disc/drum and all disc systems. If you're happy with your drums - fine. It's your money, your truck and your choice. As for me, the improved braking performance and fade resistance of an all disc system was one reason I went with the 2002, and I don't regret my choice for a minute.



Rusty

 

[LandShark]

Wow, I can't believe what I'm reading on this thread. Just goes to reinforce the fact that you can find any opinion on the internet.



My own experience in driving many car and trucks over the years is that disc is way better than drum. I can recall many experiences, with drum brakes, driving in wet weather in Florida in the 60's and 70' when I would go to brake and have virtually NOTHING. Even in dry weather, after 3 stops from 70mph within 5 minutes often braking was severely diminished. Vehicles with disc brakes have NEVER given me a problem in wet weather and have NEVER heated up to the point that brake fade was an issue.



In my 1/2 million miles or so of driving, I can't recall ever coming to a stop and wishing that I had drum brakes! However, hundreds of times after coming to a stop (or not) with drums I have wished for better brakes!

 

[The patriot]

I never saw disc brakes on a class 8 tractor.

I've pulled trailers that had disc's. They sucked.

As for our PU trucks, my drums work fine as long as I adjust them manually.

I'm not all that worried about brakes. I'm @ over 100K miles and still on the factory shoes and pads with plenty meat left on them.

Eric

 

[y-knot]

I never said drums were better on cars or light trucks, Dah... . they are lighter and do dissipate heat very well, also they are much cheaper to build and install on a vehicle. The benefits of disk brakes on larger, as in big trucks, 3500 and larger are less. True they still cost less to manufacture and are easier to install, but they do not have the needed surface area to continually stop very heavy loads. You might feel that your present trucks braking system is completely sufficient for your stooping needs, great. But do you see large trucks with disk brakes in the rear?? NO you do not. It's not because they do not know how to make them fit, it is because they will not last when subjected to heavy braking loads. Drums may be old school or to some dated material, and when compared to the right subject matter , yes they may be. But nothing else on the market compares to the very large surface area of a drum brakes shoe. It has the ability to stop very well, time after time, and do so while supporting very large loads. Disk brakes do not, that is why they are not used in the trucking industry.

No one here argues that the best set-up for most passenger vehicles is disk brakes. The loads are light and the issue of wear is not a big problem. And of-coarse disk brakes are considered as high performance because of the relative light weight the system offers, plus the many design differences available. Also, you don't have high performance disk brakes on your truck nor does most car owners. What they have is the illusion of high performance wrapped in a heavy cast iron system. The high performance brakes on todays super cars are anything but what most have, their you are as archaic as you think the drums to be.

 

[biggy238]

There seems to be a very large gap in opinions. I live in coal country and I have to agree that the larger friction surface of drums will help stop a heavy load consistently without excessive wear. However we aren't talking about that.

I've checked out the TSM kits for my truck and wondered if it was worth the trouble. I don't pull, and I drive faster than a truck my size should the majority of the time. Will disk brakes offer a quicker 60-0mph time on an unloaded truck than properly adjusted drums? From personal experience, i've never seen drum lock up a 44" bogger like disk brakes can. Jus keep repeating. . Unloaded truck, disks or drums?



Will disk

 

[juicedcummins]

I know of one trucking company that runs all class 8's with disc brakes. This company used to run around 25 rigs over the rockies weekly. It has worked well for over 30yrs back to glory days of the 318 detroit. These trucks were all loaded well above 80k with that little noise maker. I made several runs in these rigs and the disk worked as good as any drum. The biggest drawback was the squeling you had to put up with. They sounded like city buses when they tried to stop. [hmmm no drums on city buses either]. Sinc then I've run well over the 1million with different companys and have never had them again but I do not doubt that they work.

The reason our rear drums last so long is because they are only in proper adjusment for a very short amount of time. This would be very easy to see if we had drums on the front instead of disc. The front disc is always properly adjusted till they are worn out or a caliper binds.

 

[Sojourner]

If you've got the time to tinker with your drum brakes to keep them properly and evenly adjusted as necessary, that's what you believe in and it works for you, then that's great. I don't, that's why I prefer the rear disc. It one less thing to be concerned with. The '94 is going to get a set of rear disc before long, and at long last I will have rear brakes that work like they should without the necessary routine adjustment.

 

[hammersley]

The issue guys is not the braking capability - BUT the

parking brake setup on the rear discs... ... .

 

[Sojourner]

parking brake setup on the rear discs... ... .

What's the problem with the parking brake setup on the rear discs??? Please correct me where I'm wrong, but from what I understand the problem with the parking brake on the rear discs is a result of non-use of the parking brake. I apply the parking brake everytime I park my '01 and I've never experienced any sort of problem whatsoever.



I have noticed that those carbon/kevlar pads really clamp down hard when the parking brake is set.

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Since I've had quite a few trucks I can give my impressions. . .



'98. 5 2500 4x4, stopped fine. A 6 out of 10.

'01 2500 4x2, rear drums, stopped way better than the 98. 5. Give it a 8.

'03 3500 4x2 with discs, stopped a little better than the '01. Give it a 9.

'96 2500 4x4, stops the worst of them all, but brakes need adjusted. Give it a 5.



After having discs I don't think drums on the '00-up trucks are all that bad. The brakes were improved considerably for 2000.



Vaughn

 

[Royk]

My parking brakes SUCK! And I use them daily. If I set those brakes on anything more than a slight grade the truck will roll away. I've already tightened them once. The improvement was barely noticeable. Now they are basically useless. Life really sucks on the boat ramp, having to shut the engine down in gear anytime you need to take your foot from the brake pedal. On the rare occasion I set them with the engine running, I never let my eyes off of it. Funny this thread should appear now, since I was getting ready to start one on this subject.



What do you need to do to get these brakes to hold?!



Roy

 

[jimk]

brakes

My parking brakes SUCK! And I use them daily. If I set those brakes on anything more than a slight grade the truck will roll away. I've already tightened them once. The improvement was barely noticeable. Now they are basically useless. Life really sucks on the boat ramp, having to shut the engine down in gear anytime you need to take your foot from the brake pedal. On the rare occasion I set them with the engine running, I never let my eyes off of it. Funny this thread should appear now, since I was getting ready to start one on this subject.



What do you need to do to get these brakes to hold?!



Roy

I have several line locks that were given to me. I used one years ago in my Toyato 4x4 in the front brakes. I learned to hard way in freezing weather about using the e brake an it freezing up. I would just pull up to a gate and set the line lock. After I opened the gate and I would step on the brakes to release the brakes. It was also handy for theft control. good luck Jim

 

[Sojourner]

The line-loc is an excellent device.



Besides the parking brake cable freezing up in very cold weather, I still don't understand what the problem with the parking brake on rear discs is... ??? My parking brake has always worked better than any drum set-up I've ever had (and with a torque monster working against it too), and after installing the carbon/kevlar pads the rear discs now act like a vise grip when it is firmly set.



For someone's parking brake/disc combo to fail as described there would be something seriously wrong. Roy, have you tried getting it corrected under warranty?

 

[Ralph Heron]

parking brakes on my 1998.5

lived with the same BS on the launch ramp for quite some time (not fun... ) tried the route of adjusting the cable but found the most effective way to get the parking brake solid is to just put it into reverse, haul ass as fast as you dare and then nail the brakes (note this truck has rear drums). This engages the automatic adjusters and really does a good job at stiffening the parking brake. Needless to say, I wouldnt do this loaded (bed, hitch/saddle, or you!!)



Ralph-

 

[Tcolesanti]

You guys should take in consideration too, that pre '98 trucks had a vaccum booster while the newer ones had hydroboost. That too makes a huge difference. My 2000 stops way better than my dads '95. And my roomates '02 with rear discs stops a little better than mine. I adjust my brakes and have hauled a lot of heavy stuff and never had a problem.