Multiple DTCs P0401, P0402, P0403 & P0405

[Benito]

Looking for some input. 2014 2500 Cummins 152k miles. Does not idle much highway driving mostly. Mostly unloaded just me in it. New trans 8k miles ago. Banks Monster Ram installed 2K miles ago. Was driving the truck a few weeks ago on the highway at about 70, felt a sputter and CEL kicked on. P0403 and P0405 were the codes. Assumed it was a dirty EGR valve. Cleaned and reset. The truck seemed to run fine and was even getting better fuel mileage. 3 weeks later, another sputter and CEL came on. Same codes this time. Had to continue driving and began to notice a little rough running. Got home and checked again, now have P0401 & P0402. Again thinking it is EGR valve but this time under the hood I noticed dried coolant in the area of the Y-pipe on the upper hose and appears coolant dripping from the overflow. Not sure if one is related to the other but seems like it would be. Everything was telling be the issue was the valve but not not sure with the coolant leak. Any input is appreciated.

 

[Topzide]

Did you pull the cooler and clean that when you had EGR off? Have you replaced the CCV filter? Are you able to pressure test the cooling system? The HF pressure test kit is a good deal for the money. Has the cap to fit our trucks along with others. I've used mine many time on many different vehicles. I replaced the CCV filter and did the EGR - Cooler clean at 132K. Filter is every 67.5K. Do filter and clean every other time. The kit from Genos makes it pretty easy. I used purple power for the cleaner to soak cooler overnight. Was amazed of the dirt and soot in the cooler. The other issue is the o-ring on the cooler y-pipe.
Genos also has those o-rings. (https://www.genosgarage.com/product/oil-resistant-green-oring/gaskets-and-seals)
EGR clean kit with CCV. (https://www.genosgarage.com/product...ter-egrkit1/exhaust-gas-recirculation-service)

 

[Benito]

Sorry, di not give the rest of the history.
CCV has been changed twice- first and 65 second at 120
EGR system has not been done, (other than the valve), as it is not called for on the ‘13+ trucks since they went to DEF. When I pulled the EGR valve and pipe they had soot but it was a relatively light. The valve moved but did actually feel smoother once cleaned. I actually have the cleaner kit from Geno’s and will be doing that but was a bit hesitant because of the coolant leak now. Trying to rule out as much as possible before I get too far in. I would prefer to know if I need the EGR cooler before tearing it all down. This is my only vehicle so trying to limit down time. The pressure test was my next step- I actually saw a video about testing for a bad EGR cooler, (think it was Bullet Proof Diesel), just after I posted my question. Sounds like it what you suggested. The O-ring is not something I was aware of- I will look into that as well- that may be one of the ones that comes in the Geno’s kit? Thanks your your response.

 

[Topzide]

Even though not called for on our ('13+) trucks, I saw were it would be needed every other CCV change. I got my truck with 130K on the clock and filter was only done previous to me getting it. Yes the kit has the o-rings but I ordered extra as they are B*&^H to change and it took a couple tries to have it not leak. Keep what I need to change in toolbox on the truck! Pressure test will help you find the leak!
I added these, https://www.mishimoto.com/ram-6-7l-cummins-coolant-y-pipe-2013-2014.html . I know that the new hoses were fixed to avoid the leak issue but wanted a better mouse trap. I did all my hoses with the new Y's this past Dec when I needed to replace the turbo actuator! Wasn't a bad job, just wish I had a garage to work in as it was just before the cold spell that hit! Might be something to think about as the stock ones only last about 4K hours! The City Diesel unit is built WAY better and is DIY! It's plug and play with no core needed. Ordered from Genos. My mileage was in the 165K -170K when I did mine do to no boost or EB. Hours were mid 4K. We'll help you get it fixed. Do you have AlfaOBD for your truck? Great software to help with issues and allow changes to be made. Can also program FOBIK's and turn on the VTA (vehicle theft alarm). I've done these and turned on DTRL with the front turn signals. Standing by for updates.

 

[TRAMPLINEMAN]

Your upper y pipe is probably cracked, common problem.

 

[Benito]

Your upper y pipe is probably cracked, common problem.

Thanks- it is weeping there now but the visible dripping is back by the overflow bottle and EGR cooler

 

[Benito]

Even though not called for on our ('13+) trucks, I saw were it would be needed every other CCV change. I got my truck with 130K on the clock and filter was only done previous to me getting it. Yes the kit has the o-rings but I ordered extra as they are B*&^H to change and it took a couple tries to have it not leak. Keep what I need to change in toolbox on the truck! Pressure test will help you find the leak!
I added these, https://www.mishimoto.com/ram-6-7l-cummins-coolant-y-pipe-2013-2014.html . I know that the new hoses were fixed to avoid the leak issue but wanted a better mouse trap. I did all my hoses with the new Y's this past Dec when I needed to replace the turbo actuator! Wasn't a bad job, just wish I had a garage to work in as it was just before the cold spell that hit! Might be something to think about as the stock ones only last about 4K hours! The City Diesel unit is built WAY better and is DIY! It's plug and play with no core needed. Ordered from Genos. My mileage was in the 165K -170K when I did mine do to no boost or EB. Hours were mid 4K. We'll help you get it fixed. Do you have AlfaOBD for your truck? Great software to help with issues and allow changes to be made. Can also program FOBIK's and turn on the VTA (vehicle theft alarm). I've done these and turned on DTRL with the front turn signals. Standing by for updates.

Thanks for the additional info. I will keep that in mind with the O-rings and grab a couple extras. Will likely do a pressure test but think I will pull the crossover tube to see if any coolant, (or effects of coolant), is visible inside the EGR cooler or pipe.
I was looking at the Mishimoto Y pipe and also the Morimoto 1 piece molded radiator hoses. I like the aluminum with clamps but, like in plumbing, fewer connection points is lower chance of failure. Do not really like the look of the Morimoto but the fact it is 1 piece is interesting.
My turbo actuator when at about 122k miles, I went with a factory replacement unit but will keep the City Diesel unit in mind for the next time, (there will be a next time).
I also have Alfa OBD- great stuff. Wish there was a bit more explanation available on all the different codes and categories for the modules as I think there is way more possible to do with it just do not want to get into something I shouldn’t. I turned DRL on and opening windows with remote- helpful here in GA.
I live about 30 minutes from Geno’s great place and great people. Thinking about it now, have not been up there in a while- good reason to stop up now.

 

[sag2]

If the EGR valve had dry soot, the cooler is not leaking. No real need to look further. A leaking cooler will result in wet soot past the cooler and into the EGR valve.

 

[Benito]

Looks like it is a head gasket issue. Coolant is building pressure to the point it is pushing out from any place it can which is why the leak. Not sure why it through all those EGR codes though, may be additional trouble but looks like I was going down the wrong road. Unfortunately I do not have the time to do a head gasket job so had to take it to a diesel shop. They will confirm the issue on Monday but they are also pretty sure it is the HG based on what I saw. Disappointing to have it go at 152k especially since I am pretty easy on the truck. Has only towed about 20k miles total in its life otherwise is my commuter car and my weekend project supply hauler.

 

[sag2]

Head gasket failures on a stock truck are slim to none, and slim just left. The only exceptions might be poor coolant maintenance or overheating caused by another problem.

 

[Topzide]

@Benito, Sorry to hear it may be a pretty involved repair! Well worth doing the repair as vehicles prices are still through the roof! Keep us informed of what it was and if they found anything strange.

 

[petersonj]

Looks like it is a head gasket issue. Coolant is building pressure to the point it is pushing out from any place it can which is why the leak.

How did you suddenly arrive at, "Looks like it is a head gasket issue."? I believe the cap in the photo below is the one you have on your coolant recovery / surge tank. Relief valve is set for 21 psi. All cooling system components (including head and engine block) can handle this designed pressure. Are you losing coolant over this valve?

Fix the leaks that you know about and then pressure test the cooling system.

- John

 

[Benito]

Head gasket failures on a stock truck are slim to none, and slim just left. The only exceptions might be poor coolant maintenance or overheating caused by another problem.

Agreed it is slim but not sure what more I could have done. Coolant level was always checked and kept up with- was changed at around 80k. Oil changes are done every 7500 fuel filters every 12-15k, not saying these other things have anything to do with it just to say that I am pretty meticulous with maintenance and generally stay on top of the truck.
I will keep you posted what I hear back- I guess it could be something else but not sure what else would build pressure in the cooling system without overheating or the truck even running above normal temp.

@Benito, Sorry to hear it may be a pretty involved repair! Well worth doing the repair as vehicles prices are still through the roof! Keep us informed of what it was and if they found anything strange.

 

[Benito]

I am 95% sure it is a head gasket but I am not a mechanic. All the cake pointed to EGR but the obvious issue is with the coolant. The system was pressurized to the point that coolant was leaking from overflows and weeping from a few different areas because of the excessive pressure. I am hoping it is not the head gasket but not much else seems possible. Crazy I am getting EGR codes but not looking good for any other solution to my problem other than HG. I will certainly let everyone know what it is either way- even if I am wrong

 

[petersonj]

The pressure test was my next step

Will likely do a pressure test

Have you done a pressure test? You can use the pressure tester to find leaks, but you can also use it to monitor coolant pressure with the engine running. This could provide you with valuable information.

Make sure the installed test gauge with the engine running is visible from the driver seat, or use two people (one to monitor the test gauge reading and the other in the driver seat ready to turn off the engine) . When the tester is installed and engine is running, there is no relief protection for the coolant circuit.

- John

 

[Benito]

Ok, kind of back to square 1- shop ran through everything and came back with bad upper rad hose as the only issue. All else checked out fine. I will be picking it up tomorrow, (not able to get there today). I guess the issue is with the EGR but intermittent- they drove it 70+ miles and no issue. I am stumped but glad it is not a HG at least.

 

[cricha]

Did you pull the cooler and clean that when you had EGR off? Have you replaced the CCV filter? Are you able to pressure test the cooling system? The HF pressure test kit is a good deal for the money. Has the cap to fit our trucks along with others. I've used mine many time on many different vehicles. I replaced the CCV filter and did the EGR - Cooler clean at 132K. Filter is every 67.5K. Do filter and clean every other time. The kit from Genos makes it pretty easy. I used purple power for the cleaner to soak cooler overnight. Was amazed of the dirt and soot in the cooler. The other issue is the o-ring on the cooler y-pipe.
Genos also has those o-rings. (https://www.genosgarage.com/product/oil-resistant-green-oring/gaskets-and-seals)
EGR clean kit with CCV. (https://www.genosgarage.com/product...ter-egrkit1/exhaust-gas-recirculation-service)

Topzide - which presure test kit is this? I need to look into getting one. and does it work with the newer systems that dont have a radiator cap? THANKS!

 

[Topzide]

@cricha, Here you go; https://www.harborfreight.com/radiator-pressure-tester-kit-63862.html

 

[Benito]

OK- not sure if anyone is interested still but want to give an update. Got the truck back and seemed to run fine for about 800 miles no issues and no DTC. I have been monitoring the truck to see if/when codes come up even if they do not set a MIL. I noticed on the monitor that the EGR valve position was changing as I was driving but then noticed a MIL and then saw the EGR position was stuck at 97%. and would not change no matter what the speed or throttle position. The truck seemed to run OK but the truck did seem to sound like the valve was open, (which it was based on the gauge). I can normally tell when the valve is open or closed as you can hear it but now was not changing. What I am not sure of is if the EGR staying open is a problem with the EGR valve itself or if that stayed open because of another problem. I know it is likely an EGR issue but wondering if anyone could think of another reason. I am getting codes for under and over boost, low EGR and High EGR as well as lost communication with Gateway B. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Likely the EGR just odd that it is staying open which means the motor is getting stuck not just the valve since the sensor is built into the motor.

 

[CRHardie]

I haven’t had my 2015 long enough to study how the egr system works yet. I am a diesel tech on off road equipment so I’m familiar with how most systems work. The egr valve is usually commanded open based off what sensors are telling the ECM. I assume there’s a temperature and pressure sensor in the intake along with a pressure sensor in the exhaust. If the ECM is not seeing the pressure and temp it wants in the intake it will command the egr valve open further trying to achieve that. Eventually it gets to a point where the egr is open more than the threshold and it sets a DTC. This is usually in the 90% area. Usually the root cause is a plugged egr cooler and dirty sensors in the intake side. If it’s possible with Alfa run a EGR test and watch the valve position. If it makes a full sweep it should be good. I’ve been told not to do a egr valve value reset on a used valve because it will mess up the readings at the sensors if a new value is learned on a valve that may not close or open completely due to soot contamination. Sorry for the long vague post. I just haven’t taken the time to learn this system yet because we don’t use Cummins engines where I work.