New Purchase

[SPoe]

Hi yall, I'm looking into purchasing a 2003 - 2007 Ram 2500/3500 with the 5. 9 HO Cummins and a manual transmission. Are there anythings I should look out for when purchasing used and what pros and cons should i expect? Any and every comment is greatly appreciated.

 

[Bernie]

I owned an 06 with the manual and loved it. I now own an 03 with an auto, and I would not go auto again. Here are my thoughts:

Whatever you buy, I would look for stock. Modified poorly is no bargain. Modified and raced / beat on is no bargain. Buy stock, and add your own toys later.

03
-Get an HO
-Simplest emissions
-I've heard of trans problems with the NV transmission
-$

04 and 05
-I don't know specifics, but electronics / emissions got more involved from the 03
-I have still heard of NV transmission problems
-$$

06
-I know the emissions and electronics were another step more complicated than the 05, but I loved the power mine made stock, and had no electronics problems in the 100k I owned it.
-Getrag G56 (big Mercedes truck transmission) was great. Overkill for the job (in my opinion). Only trans complaint was the top gear could have been higher for highway efficiency.
-$$$

07 with the 5. 9
-I've been told they are the same as the 06, with the advantage of a slightly higher top gear.
-This will be the truck I look for when my 03 is dead.
-$$$$$

 

[HBarlow]

Bernie above addressed it but I will emphasize the point about a modified used truck. If I were buying a late model Dodge-Cummins I would go to great lengths to ensure I wasn't buying one that had been modified. It is apparently very common for the youthful or uninformed to add electronic black boxes and run the truck hard for a while then when the problems begin developing (which they will), or worse, after failures have occurred, the owner dumps the truck on the used truck market. Electronic black boxes cause injector failures, at high power settings the failures seem to occur quickly. Injector problems cause piston failures, dropped valves, damaged top piston rings, and generally overstress the engines. New engines are very expensive!

Another thing to avoid very seriously is modified or aftermarket air intake boxes or aftermarket filters. They allow dirt particles to pass and cause accelerated engine wear. Yeah, I can already hear the squeals of outrage at this statement. But several recent threads prove it as did Joe Donnelly's testing reported in TDR magazine several times over the years.

If I were considering a particular truck I would pay a skilled dealer tech, one with a suspicious mind, to run the diagnostics and physically examine for evidence of tampering. I would never buy a used truck that had had aftermarket engine performance accessories installed. Never.

I disagree with Bernie's comments about the choice of transmissions in Gen III trucks. The NVG-5600 I had in my '01 behind the HO engine pulling heavy trailers held up very well until it suffered a bearing failure at 302,000 miles and was inexpensively rebuilt. The failure was encouraged or caused by my allowing the transmission lube to get a little low. Overfilling is recommended.

OTOH, the German designed Brazilian manufactured G-56 is an all aluminum case, less robust than the American made NV-5600 and is used with a trouble-prone dual mass flywheel. Early versions of the G-56 had poorly matched gear sets for the American application. They were geared too low. For model year (MY) 2007, the G-56 was delivered with slightly higher ratios in the lower and top gears. Several TDR members know how to identify the difference and have posted the two letter designation here.

I do agree with Bernie about the 2006 or 2007 being very desirable trucks. The last two MYs offered the best electronics (except for the reverse/door open alarm on 2006s), the highest power ratings, and several nice features like programmed fast idle in cold weather, slightly better styling, and improved headlights.

If you are determined to buy a manual transmission, I would prefer a 2004. 5 or 2005 with NV-5600 over the G-56 w/ dual mass flywheel/clutch assembly. My overall preference would be a 2006 or 2007 w/48RE and Jacobs exhaust brake.

 

[JBonpua]

I would go with a late model (December built) 2006 or early 2007 5. 9 with #P52104714AE G-56. if you buy the older G-56 just put a taller tire like I did and you are good to go. I agree that the DMF sucks and will self destruct really quick. However, Peter can fix that with his solid flywheel DD conversion.

 

[kowaliga]

I bought new, off the lot, an '05, 4wd, QC, longbed with a g-56. Never been in the shop and I just replaced the factory tires at 82K mi. If 6th were taller, the G-56 would be perfect for me. I drive @100 mi/day, and start it twice. I don't tow and have jittery, but not potholed roadways. A 3500 is also a rough riding beast, but I get 22 mpg at almost constant 55 mph. I am careful with oil, fuel and filters and rotation. Never had a hard start or code. Stock, period.

 

[DaveHess]

I bought my '03 brand spanking new and the only thing I would do is not get the 48RE. First through third are fine the converter lock-up and OD shift is crappy as it feels like the 48RE can't decide which way to go. Going with a Goerend in April 2010.

 

[DaveHess]

Just a quick conter-point to Mr. Barlow with whom I have a lot of respect based on his posts, I have modded mine and do routine oil samples. I just don't like being glommed into the uneducated teenage bomber dude. I did my homework and have selected mods to best suit my towing needs and then followed it up with maintenance to be sure. I also don't hotrod my truck. She has 51,000 miles on the clock, is garage kept (heated in the winter) and even modded would be an excellent truck for someone if I was so inclined to sell her. I also am an individual of high integrity. I would not hide the mods from a prospective buyer. As soon as I started bombing, I discontinued any further visits to the dealer except for social reasons. Fair is fair. Just my . 02

 

[WStephens]

I have the G56 and have not had problems with it but I do not like the duel mass flywheel and it has held up better than the one in the 90 F250 I had and when it needs a clutch I will replace the fly wheel then. It would have been nice to have a higher set of gears like the later versions but I have plenty if not more power than I need or can use even when pulling the 5th wheel over mountain passes in the Rockies and a taller set of tires would achieve better gearing. I have had the front drive shaft replaced because it did not and still does not have grease fittings in the u-joints but got it replaced before it had a chance to distroy the transfer case.

 

[HBarlow]

Just a quick conter-point to Mr. Barlow with whom I have a lot of respect based on his posts, I have modded mine and do routine oil samples. I just don't like being glommed into the uneducated teenage bomber dude. I did my homework and have selected mods to best suit my towing needs and then followed it up with maintenance to be sure. I also don't hotrod my truck. She has 51,000 miles on the clock, is garage kept (heated in the winter) and even modded would be an excellent truck for someone if I was so inclined to sell her. I also am an individual of high integrity. I would not hide the mods from a prospective buyer. As soon as I started bombing, I discontinued any further visits to the dealer except for social reasons. Fair is fair. Just my . 02

Dave,

"Fair is fair" as you stated. My broad generalization was probably not fair. Of course there are mature, responsible men of integrity who make carefully considered minor mods to their trucks and use and monitor performance and fluids very carefully. I would possibly buy such a truck from an individual if I knew him personally and knew he used his truck as you stated you do.

My warning, as I know you understood, was about buying a truck of unknown origins off a dealer lot. I am confident you would agree that in most cases it could be a very risky move.

 

[pullya]

Dave,

There are a few of us that are just like you regarding our trucks. Thanks for speaking up. Sometimes people paint with a pretty broad brush.

Jay

 

[Motorhead]

If you are looking to get the "AE trans in a 5. 9, '07, It has to have been built in December of '06. I was lucky enough to get one of those thanks to the guys here on the TDR. I bought mine new. Today it is getting a Southbend Con OFE 3400lb P. P. clutch and flywheel put in it. ALL else I have been MORE than satisfied with. I had a new '01. 5 2wd Automatic. I went and had a full DTT trans put in. The trans was strong but I didn't like the gap between Drive and O drive for towing. The G56 is a perfect towing and driving trans. Yes, It might not be as strong as the NV5600 trans but is shifts alot easier than the 5600.
Even if you don't think you want one... Buy a 4WD. My '01. 5 wasn't 4 WD and I was sorry a few times when it got stuck. My $0. 02

 

[mberry]

Just a quick conter-point to Mr. Barlow with whom I have a lot of respect based on his posts, I have modded mine and do routine oil samples. I just don't like being glommed into the uneducated teenage bomber dude. I did my homework and have selected mods to best suit my towing needs and then followed it up with maintenance to be sure. I also don't hotrod my truck. She has 51,000 miles on the clock, is garage kept (heated in the winter) and even modded would be an excellent truck for someone if I was so inclined to sell her. I also am an individual of high integrity. I would not hide the mods from a prospective buyer. As soon as I started bombing, I discontinued any further visits to the dealer except for social reasons. Fair is fair. Just my . 02

While I, too, have nothing but respect for you Harvey, I am in the same camp as DaveHess in this instance. I will not hide any mods from any prospective buyer, and I have been meticulous about maintenance. I am considering selling my truck to get a new one. I'm just getting tired of shifting gears and want a new one with the 68RFE. I am very open and honest with my dealings with people since I want the same from them. It doesn't always happen as you know. I also would be very wary of buying one from a dealer that has been modded.

 

[SPoe]

I've been researching and I really want the HO Cummins and I probably shouldn't get 4WD since I'm only 19 and I go to school at SHSU and there is a mud pit just north of Huntsville and I'm more likely than not to go and break something on my truck. I think I'll stick with a 2wd unless I find an amazing deal on the HO and it has 4WD.

 

[Regcabguy]

I would go with a late model (December built) 2006 or early 2007 5. 9 with #P52104714AE G-56. if you buy the older G-56 just put a taller tire like I did and you are good to go. I agree that the DMF sucks and will self destruct really quick. However, Peter can fix that with his solid flywheel DD conversion.

My '07 came with the lower final drive which has worked out well since I planned on increasing the tire size one notch. I've driven three NV5600's and this g-56 kills them on ease of shifting. The gates are tight and reverse is where it's supposed to be in case you get stuck and need to rock the vehicle. I agree with Harvey to look for a truck without any electronic enhancement past,but in my case I'd sell you mine because it's never seen more than sw#1 on the Smarty. With my slightly taller tires and the 2000# camper on it's back the truck would be a dog without my Smarty. It's the only electronic enhancement device I'd ever run. Zero warranty issues in 2. 5 years and this truck is mine until Obama makes it too expensive to operate,which we know he'll do his darnest to achieve. .

 

[DaveHess]

You are correct

Dave,



"Fair is fair" as you stated. My broad generalization was probably not fair. Of course there are mature, responsible men of integrity who make carefully considered minor mods to their trucks and use and monitor performance and fluids very carefully. I would possibly buy such a truck from an individual if I knew him personally and knew he used his truck as you stated you do.



My warning, as I know you understood, was about buying a truck of unknown origins off a dealer lot. I am confident you would agree that in most cases it could be a very risky move.

Mr. Barlow,



Your confidence is well placed Sir as I would wholeheartedly agree with you. There are very few people that I know that I would purchase any vehicle from let alone a diesel Ram. I get that nagging feeling in the back of my head that I am buying someone elses problem.



I do take great pride in my rig both in performance, maintenance, and looks. I love turning heads as I rumble (at idle) through a campground :-laf



Dave

 

[DaveHess]

I'm with Ya!

Dave,

There are a few of us that are just like you regarding our trucks. Thanks for speaking up. Sometimes people paint with a pretty broad brush.

Jay

You got it Jay! Is the Mopar Club still active in Austin???



Dave

 

[pullya]

Dave,

I don't know about the Mopar club. Have tried to hook up with the TDR bunch here in Austin a couple of time without much success. They don't seem to be very interested in expanding their membership. IMO

Jay