Optima Yellow Tops/Power Inverter

[Sasquatch]

I'm replacing my 3 month old OEM batteries before the snow starts flying, and I'm going with Optima Yellow Top, "deep cycle" batteries. The OEM batteries are basically (like the OEM tires) intended to move your truck from the dealership to your home driveway, and, after that, don't expect much.

Temperatures in this valley (Roaring Fork, Colorado) routinely drop to 20 below, and I'm often on the road, spending the night in places where it's impractical to plug in a block-heater. Batteries lose about 60% of their "cold-cranking power," when temperatures drop below zero. Couple this fact with the gelling properties of diesel fuel, the compression of the Cummins, and the long distances between "civilization" in this part of the world, and you don't want to rely on sub-par batteries.

The last set of Optimas I purchased (also Yellow Tops) for my '97 2500 CTD where fantastic, but they didn't fit the battery trays, and had to be "bungie-corded" into submission. I put about 75,000 miles on the truck with the batteries improperly secured, and it always made me a little nervous. I've learned, too, (the hard way) that Optima Yellow Tops are the ONLY battery that's really suited for use in combination with extended, cold-weather WARN winch operation. Winch-use will toast an OEM battery very quickly.

There is no information regarding correct replacement battery size in my owner's manual (it's a "POS," as you all know by now), so I'd appreciate any information that TDR members might have regarding the correct battery "Group Size," (case dimension and battery terminal location) for selecting an Optima battery. It'd be easy enough, I suppose, to remove one of the OEM batteries and trudge into a store with it but A) There are no stores that sell Opitmas nearby, and B) I'm way too lazy for that drill...

All of the sites I've visited on-line (the few that sell batteries w/truck model and year reference charts) don't yet have a table that includes the '07. 5, 6. 7 Dodge Ram.

Have any of you purchased Optima replacement batteries for your Rams, and, if so, do you have an Optima Part#?

12v POWER INVERTER...

Next question: Have any of you installed power inverters in your trucks? When I had my Leer 120cc commercial top installed, I had the installer provide separate 12v outlets (intended to accept male, cigarette-lighter-style plugs) in the rear of the truck (in the tool bins) on both driver and passenger side. I use these, occasionally, to power a small, tire-inflating compressor, but I'd love to be able to plug into these outlets, in an emergency, and supply "juice" to job-site power tools.

I'd like to purchase a 12v power-inverter that converts DC power to AC power, and is adequate, at a minimum, to run small power tools or charge, say, a DeWalt 18v cordless drill battery.

Dunno much about this topic, so any advice (or a link to an appropriate internet site) would be appreciated.

 

[JFaughn]

I would not through money away on replacing 3 mth old batteries , but buying deep cycle batteries is some thing els , have been into the alt energy for 30 yrs , what your talking about is 2/3rds of a system , storage & inverters , since you are building system , I would say that putting components together requires some design , to get the best performance for the money spent , like our trucks .
When I look a building someone a system , I start at the work end , what is it your trying to do , you mentioned power tools , anything with a motor or making heat is a high current draw , as apposed to charging up rechargeable batteries , they can end up the same , a short term high load[ drill motor ect ] can be equal to a long term low draw [ charging ] .
Those are 2 different design issues high current draw & the extended use ,
both are from AC voltage , so what ever your highest draw needs to match the inverter , motors can take at least double the draw to start , then you get into sine wave inverters , more efficient & some devices require sine wave inverters to operate .
This may or not be bigger than what your looking for , but with out the spec. s I'm going with what I have done , you can spend enough to equal an 2500-3500 watt generator very easy .
Keep the original batteries [ get your money out of them , put in a battery idolater , this will allow your to use all of the battery [ 80% max discharge for deepcycles ] and still have eng. starting , but charge the deepcycles off the alt , then an inverter that matches your max draw , guessing at least 1,000 watts , if not a 2,500 watt inverter .
As for the deep cycles , its all about volume [ size & weight ] if you need to use a fare amount of power for some extended time then the would not be enough , just weigh 2 deep cycle golf cart batteries against 2 optima , less weight = less available power , my current system uses Trojan 225 6v batteries , weighing 135 lbs before adding about 20 lbs of acid .


Backwoods Solar Electric Systems



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[mhenon]

I got rid of my OEM batteries and went with one group 31 mounted in the bed. Boy... the engine bay looks empty!

This DieHard Marine battery was very exspensive but looks it will do the job. So far the engine starts like it did with two batteries.

DieHard PM-1 Marine Battery, Platinum PM-1 - Group Size 31M at Sears.com

Mike

 

[Sasquatch]

Hey, John,

Thanks for the reply.

The main problem with my current (no pun intended) batteries, is that they won't crank my truck in extreme cold temperatures. At least, in my experience, they won't crank it for long. In other words, they're not dependable.

Where I live (high desert), we have un-Godly extremes of temperature: It can be over 90 degrees during the day and in the high-thirties at night. I have been (recently) in Grand Junction and seen temperatures close to 120 degrees. Conversely, in the wintertime, it can get so cold that a hammer-blow will shatter a trailer-hitch.

Normal OEM batteries simply won't hold up to this sort of abuse, unless you regularly garage your vehicle, and my truck is parked under the stars at night.

My experience with Optima Yellow Tops is that they will get my truck running, and they seem to be able to manage the extremes of temperature that others won't. The other reason that i want to replace the OEMs is that I use my winch a lot, and the deep-cycles are much better suited to that sort of duty.

I hear what you're saying about a job-site generator (which I also own), but I'm really looking for something "light-duty," that i can use (while driving, say) to recharge a power-tool battery. I'd also like to have something that I can plug a regular radio into, or other sorts of light appliances.

I also am familiar with the concept of "surge/peak" power draw vs. running power requirements, but I don't think I'd ever anticipate needing more power than a small hand tool would require. If I anticipate setting up my framing crew (and can't get the electricians to set a temporary power feed from the municipal utility), I'd use my Honda 5000 watt generator.

I'm looking for the freedom to occasionally plug small stuff into the rear of my truck without firing up a loud, gas-powered generator.

I figured that -- with two Optima Yellow Tops hooked up, in series -- I ought to be able to buy an inverter that would do the job.

 

[MStrain]

I have been wanting to do something similiar, I want an invertor in the truck mainly for charging power tool batteries and my laptop, I think with a $200 dollar invertor this is doable with no worries, I can probably even run power tools. Most inverters will shut down when the voltage gets too low like 10. 5 or 11 volts.

 

[JFaughn]

The problem still remains , that your are drawing down your starter batteries , so a 2 battery system[ I'm not saying 2 starter batteries , but what ever your chose for starting & then a separate battery/system for other use ] is the way to go , using a battery isolator [ this box allows 2 battery systems to get charged off of one alt , with out drawing down the starting batteries ] .
I am familiar with extreme temps , the high heat is not that big of an issue , but cold is [ the average starting battery loses 80% at 0* F ] I am in Minnesota now , in the past I've seen here 113* F & -63* F , there are a bunch of good battery brands that do just fine in these temps , Opitma has some advantages , but with a good brand & a well maintained system , there is no problem getting 5-7 yrs out of batteries .
I just look at the cost /time issue with Opitams , I chose not to spend twice the money to get twice the life [ 10 yrs ] I would rather spend that extra money ten times as often the the ten yrs .
Then your also talking about using a battery for other then its design , deep cycle for both deep & start , your may not get the 10 yrs out of using a battery out side of its design .
Its really just all about the numbers specs against use , & what the bottom line is .
For your use , 2 golf cart batteries [ about $45 ea. ] a basic 600 watt inverter [ about $35 ] & the battery 30 amp idolater [ about $30 ] , thats less than 1 Opitma , then spend the cost of the other Optima on 2 Interstates batteries , now you have spent about the same money as the 2 Optima's and have ten times the performance .

 

[BHolm]

You seem pretty convinced that the Optimas are the way to go. I personally think they are absolute JUNK. I have tried yellow tops in my RV, junk! I have tried red tops in two different cars, junk again.



You seem to think it gets pretty cold here in CO but I moved several years ago from northern Minnesota which has winters that make Colorados look like a spring picnic. Both of my '03's sat outside, in the wide open, in temps down as far as -50F. I never tried to start them below -40F but NEVER had trouble in three winter with the stock batteries, outside, not plugged in.



I would take even the cheapest lead acid batteries over Optimas any day of the week. If you want a truely superior dry cell battery, check out the Odyssey line. They are military spec, last for ten years, have much better reserves and cranking power than Optimas. They are so heavy duty, and extreme condition oriented that they can be had in steel belted cases. I have run winches with them, and started my old diesel Unimog at -20 completely unaided with Odyssey's. There is nothing better. No offense but Optimas are a complete joke by comparison.

 

[Sasquatch]

bholm:

You seem to think it's cold in Minnesota: I did a stint at Fort Wainwright in Alaska, and the temps up there (blah, blah, blah-bitty blah... )

I've never had a problem with my Optima Yellow Tops, but your experience has apparently been different.

I like them for all the reasons listed above, and I appreciate, too, that they lose only 1% of their charge per month (if not used/driven), where normal "wet batteries" lose 10% or more. I've never worried about trickle-charging the Optimas, and they've never let me down.

Yellow Tops are $135 at Costco, and that's a pretty good deal. I checked out the price on the Odysseys, and they're substantially more expensive.

No matter what product a person references, somebody's going to come along, spout a horror story, and proclaim it "junk". In my experience, the higher the product profile -- and more expensive it is -- the greater the likelihood that there will be naysayers going all red in the race, and ranting about how awful it is.

Each to his own, I guess.

 

[Sasquatch]

MStrain:

I'm going to keep looking for a decent inverter. I've seen some on Amazon that look promising. I don't think the "draw down" problem would really be an issue for me, since i'd be using the inverter for recharging batteries (with the truck motor running, while traveling), or I'd be using it, very sparingly, while camping to plug in a radio, small appliance, etc.

 

[BHolm]

bholm:



You seem to think it's cold in Minnesota: I did a stint at Fort Wainwright in Alaska, and the temps up there (blah, blah, blah-bitty blah... )



I've never had a problem with my Optima Yellow Tops, but your experience has apparently been different.



I like them for all the reasons listed above, and I appreciate, too, that they lose only 1% of their charge per month (if not used/driven), where normal "wet batteries" lose 10% or more. I've never worried about trickle-charging the Optimas, and they've never let me down.



Yellow Tops are $135 at Costco, and that's a pretty good deal. I checked out the price on the Odysseys, and they're substantially more expensive.



No matter what product a person references, somebody's going to come along, spout a horror story, and proclaim it "junk". In my experience, the higher the product profile -- and more expensive it is -- the greater the likelihood that there will be naysayers going all red in the race, and ranting about how awful it is.



Each to his own, I guess.

I guess mostly I don't see any reason to replace perfetly good batteries on the guess that they wont perform. I am on my sixth third gen truck and have yet to have to replace a battery. I have used them in cold remote locations and never had an issue. Like you say though, to each his own



I am also far from alone in regards to having problems with Optimas. I think the best thing they offer is a misleading advertising campaign. I have at leats a half dozen friends that, along with myself fell for the hype initially but were burned and wont go back. I certainly hope you have better luck.



I just wouldn't want others to read the thread, think Optimas were the best thing since sliced bread and then have the problems I have seen with this product. There is another side to the story. Again, glad they worked for you, hope they work again.

 

[hsmith]

I just got tired of lead acid batteries in my truck. Had no real problem, except the constant leakage causing terminal corrosion. Went with the Odyssey, and boy, do they have the power. Expensive, but difinitely a good investment as I have no desire to upgrade my truck for a few more years.

 

[Tspanos]

I second taking a look at the Odyssey Batteries, you'll more than likly have to do custom brackets just like with the Optimas but they have far more capacity in a given size envelope.

Jfaghn made a couple very good suggestions, just maybe overkill for your situation but then again your trying to bullet proof your truck and add some functionality so it may not be so overkill. Good luck and I'm glad it doesn't get that cold here.

 

[DShore]

Optima batteries may not be junk, but they do not perform as advertised. I have had 8 of them... 4 red top; 4 yellow top and haven't had a good one yet. They claim that you can leave the vehicle set for an extended amount of time and there will be minimal power loss. NOT SO. Tried them in some show vehicles that get very little use, and after 3 months they would not light my test light. Manufacturer shipped me another round of batteries, after they arrived set them on a bench for 3 months, nothing attached, guess what?? When I tried my test light again, the batteries were dead. Have talked to many individuals who have had the same problem. In fact, when I tried to put a charge in the batteries, you couldn't charge them. Tried slow charge and fast charge. . 60 amps, still no go. From what I understand, you either get good ones or bad ones. And good ones are in the minority. If you do a little preventive maintenance on a lead-acid battery, keep everything clean and tight, they will give you good service without breakng the bank. I agree with BHolm... Optima batteries are a joke.

 

[Sasquatch]

So, it looks like we're all pretty much in agreement: Optimas are top notch batteries, and everybody should order some tomorrow.

Glad we cleared that up.

 

[Sasquatch]

Check out these bad boyz...

Lifeline Marine Batteries - AGM Marine Battery & AGM RV Battery

 

[Sasquatch]

DShore

"... Optima batteries may not be junk, but they do not perform as advertised. I have had 8 of them... 4 red top; 4 yellow top and haven't had a good one yet... "

You're due for eight good ones, now: Put your order in early tomorrow.

 

[Sasquatch]

Reminds me of the disappointing results I've had with Odysseys: The first two dozen I ordered just sat on my bench, sullenly, and wouldn't illuminate my test light at all.

It was a heart-breaker, I can tell you.

 

[BHolm]

What was the point of your post? You come on like some sort of expert, smarter than the rest of us, "I'm gonna buy Optimas for my brand new truck cause the stock batteries are no good". Then you start to get conflicting opinions on your plan and the sarcasm starts in earnest. If you want to put Optimas in because YOU had good luck with them, then more power to ya bud. Like I mentioned, and the thread seems to be bearing this out, there are a LOT of people out there that haven't had good luck with them, in fact really bad luck. So you take some sort of personal offense to it, grow up man, people are just trying to help. Instead of the snide remarks, maybe consider learing from others experiences a little, or not, but whats the point in being a smart ***** about it? This is supposed to be about helping others. If a better performing battery is what you truely NEED, maybe you should think twice about what you plan to do. It might be hard for you to accept but every once in a great while, we all have notions of the perfect scenario knocked by reality. Is it so bad to listen to others advice? Are you that much smarter and more experienced than everybody else? If so, great, then you wont need advice anymore, you can just post here to teach as all as your infinite battery wisdom reigns supreme:-laf

 

[Sasquatch]

Bholm:

Man, you've got a serious case of cranial/rectal inversion, if you can't recognize humor when it nips you in the backside.

I never represented myself as an "expert": Far from it; I asked for advice.

What I got, instead, was hyperbolic silliness characterizing a proven product which many TDR members have used for years as "Junk".

Optima batteries are like any other retailed product you can buy: No company manufactures its products and experiences a 100% customer satisfaction quotient. There are going to be defective examples; that's true of any battery manufacturer, any "widget" manufacturer, and it's even true of the company that manufactures your Viagra -- you've occasionally gotten a bad batch, am I right?

To come in here and slam a product that many have relied upon as "Junk" -- and then recommend an alternative which is twice as expensive in its stead -- is adolescent.

I tried to illustrate that via humor, and you couldn't deal with it.

More's the pity.

 

[RRees]

For what its' worth.



I just came back from the 4x4 Blast in Pittsfield, IL. Temps near 95-100 degrees while I was there.



I have an ARB Fridge/Freezer in the back of my truck and ran it off a 12volt receptable I wired in the truck bed. Ran the cooler from Wednesday morning until Sunday morning when I packed up and headed out.



I did start the truck everyday and high-idled for about 15 minutes a day.

No problem starting the truck and keeping the beverages well chilled.



I also had a spare Yellow top that I used for running a 20 inch box fan (low speed), via a cheap 500 watt invertor. Ran the fan for over 4 hours before the invertor started beeping.



I also have two spare Optima Red Tops mounted on my trailer to run invertors and lights. When I say "spare", they are old ones that I used on my Jeep. The newest battery is over 7 years old. I do trickle charge them when I'm at home.



Note: My batteries in my truck are still the factory originals.