OTRPU or other O/O questions

[Eric_77]

Well I am looking like I am going to have to renew/recertify my DOT/class A license for myself as an individual O/O. I will only need this for short trips for my biz but the rules have all changed and not working for someone else is got me in a pickle. I will rent 18 wheelers when needed for intrastate use only hauling my only product. Here is the ?'s

Do I need DOT numbers? How do you do the reporting ie what all do you have to keep, log books, maintance logs, medical records, etc, what gets sent in, who to? What about the **** tests, if you are single operation than there is no group for random testing?



If this is more of a pain than a little paperwork than I am going to blow this off and hire a trucking company.

 

[bmoeller]

I can't answer directly, I am learning slowly myself.



These sites should help. http://www.ooida.com/



http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rulesregs/fmcsrhome.htm

 

[LeeNH]

First of all, DOT states that you need all the commercial requirements if you use the vehicle "for the furtherance of a business". This means, technically, if you even have a sales job, and you drive a car, you need to comply. Thats the way it is written, but they don't bother anyone under 10KGVW, unless you vonunteer.

Therefore, if you have anything big enough that you need a big truck to haul, you will most likely have a hard time proving it is for personal use. Whether you lease or own... . YOU would be the 'business owner' and would have to have your own DOT numbers.

1-DOT numbers (ICC numbers, MCC numbers, ect. ) are available online at the FHWA website, I think it cost me a one time fee of $300. 00 fo that, then you have to get a proccessing agent (about $75. 00), and you have to have the correct amount of insurance (I foget the form number)... . all of this (except the ins. ) is a one time fee.

2-Medical card: You can pick one up at FlyingJ, TA, or anybig truck stop, take that to your local walk in and get a physical, have them fill it out, and it is good for 2 years (cost about $80. 00 for the physical). You do not have to file anything with this, just keep the card on you... . Its the first thing they ask for when pulled in.

3-Log book: Here is where they will bust your balls, make sure it is filled out correct and shows legal running time. Some states will really bust you and ask for your fuel slips, toll reciepts, ect. to make sure they match your log. Your log book should contain all of its pages of the originals, the copies should be kept in the office. You do not have to file them anywhere.

4-You will also need fuel stickers if you run interstate and weigh over 26kGVW, this requires you to keep track of miles run in each state, fuel purchases in each state, and filing (and payment) of fuel tax if it turns out you owe it)

5-You are required to stop at all weigh stations (even empty pickups) if you are using it for commercial use. Belive me, I know via the hard way.

6-If you are running a pickup, you can NOT show sleeping berth time, because unless you have a sleeper that is 25"x25"x75", you do not have a legal place to sleep, they consider it to be no sleep time, and they will park you for 8 hours minimum. Put down off duty and tell them you slept in a motel... .

7-Is it all worth it? NO WAY!! I sold my big truck, I just run my 1 ton with a gooseneck, registered 26KGCVWR, no fuel permits, no CDL, no apportioned plates. If I need something big moved, I hire it out... . big bucks, but no hassle.



There ya go... should have a few ?'s answered there.

Lee

 

[QRTRHRS]

Follow this website for a good trucking forum. Don't just gloss over the first overlay, go inside for more choices. http://roundtable. truck.net/6/ubb. x?a=cfrm&s=6456013822



Don't want to go it yourself? Use an LTL company such as http://www.odfl.com/ Even established trucking companies will use an LTL to fill in niche freight deliveries and still make money.



Re: HOS

A good site for the new rules. http://www.landstaronline.com/WebOps/HOS_2003-04/index. asp

 

[KBalzuweit]

LeeNH...



How about this..... non cdl drivers license towing a fifth wheel camper for a commercial transport company with a transport plate on the back. Under 26k. running a 1 ton dually. Some guys stop to get weighed some do not. Do you have to?? Does it all hinge on being CDL or Non-CDL?



Thanks

 

[GAmes]

Originally posted by KBalzuweit

LeeNH...



How about this..... non cdl drivers license towing a fifth wheel camper for a commercial transport company with a transport plate on the back. Under 26k. running a 1 ton dually. Some guys stop to get weighed some do not. Do you have to?? Does it all hinge on being CDL or Non-CDL?



Thanks

No difference on the type of license, just on the state you are entering. California weigh stations have "No pick-ups" signs. Oregon says "over 20,0000 pounds". Arizona hammers you at the port of entry, a fee for both truck and trailer plus I got hit for overwide because of the awning at the one on the Az/Ut line (1/2 inch over). Now I go into Az after 5 PM cuz the permit counter is closed. NM has a small fee for the trailer. Tx doesn't seem to care, Nevada weigh stations are always closed, Utah DOT asked me why I stopped, Idaho charges a flat fee of $30 per trailer. So the answer is "Do you feel LUCKY ?"

 

[KBalzuweit]

Thats what I have seen too. I have pulled into a weigh station that said 4 ton or more must weigh and got the "what are you doing in here look and the get out of here wave". I run the bare min. as far as signs, and just role on by and just figure I look like a guy on vacation with his camper. I will take the advice of GAmes about tha AZ 5pm. I also have stopped at WY and UT and asked why I stopped and told it was not needed. With the new HOS starting I think they may watch for us a little more, but I am sure that will not last long.



Karl

 

[Eric_77]

Okay I have had my class A CDL for 10 years now, I know the rules for the driver I need to know what to do with the paperwork? Sounds like all I need is a DOT number I won't do interstate so the fuel tags are not needed. I have my DOT physical card I have the log books (I assume they have not changed with the new hour rules but I will check) The biggest problem I have is the d r u g (unsure why it changed it to ****) tests where do you join a group for the random tests? I have asked at Ryder and Penske they had no clue.

 

[GAmes]

Alcohol&drug testing

Maybe this will help



http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rulesregs/fmcsr/fmcsrguide.htm



If you can't get the answer from this site you can ask directly at



http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/contactus/hq.htm

 

[QRTRHRS]

Per the Pro Drivers Road Atlas

One Stop Shopping

Texas Dept Of Trans

Commercial Motor Carrier Sevice

125 East 11th St

Austin, TX k78701-2483

800. 299. 1700



Available services: Registration, Fuel Tax, Operating Authority, Permit Sevices



Hope this helps.



Log Books remain the same.



"The biggest problem I have is the d r u g (unsure why it changed it to ****) tests where do you join a group for the random tests? I have asked at Ryder and Penske they had no clue. "



Not sure what your asking here?

 

[draymorris]

I am real curious on some of this too. But I would still like to throw in my point of view.



If you are not going interstate, I would focus on TX law. Does TX really enforce US DOT laws if you are in TX, live in TX, and clearly are not hauling across state lines.



I have a CDL, with no hazmat or air brakes endorsements. When the trooper in the pick-up pulled me over a few weeks ago, he was more concerned with who owned the hay I was hauling - I told him "me". I had no "business name" as he seemed to want, so I just kept telling him that I haul for myself. He eventually let me go. I have farm tags on my trailer, so that may be why. I am still not clear on the subject - what can I haul with farm tags?



He also was concerned with the fact that I did not have a log book or commercial inspections. He made a few phone calls and then told me that I would have to have both if I ever grossed over 48K. I don't think I will ever try that.



I plan to research more with the TX DPS first. I just have not taken the time yet.



If you find out exactly where these law are for TX. Please let me know.



Regards

 

[GAmes]

I believe (and may be wrong) that TXDOT laws supplement USDOT, not replace them. In other words, if hauling only in Tx you have to comply with both agencies. However, most of those rules are moot (like logbook, and DOT insp sticker) if you are hauling your own goods with your own rig. There is no doubt that everything is up for interpretation and arguing with a DOT officer is like wrestling a pig. You end up dirty and the pig likes it.

 

[EB]

If you have specific questions about CDL or how the laws or rules will effect what you want (plan) to do, go to your nearest drivers license office and ask for a DOT officer, there will be one there, they give the commercial driving test. Believe me, they know the rules and laws. The officers I know will answer any questions you have. If the officers there dont want to talk to you, stop at a weigh station if they aren't busy. I deal with them all the time and 99% of them are good guys and will answer questions. ( There is always that 1%)

I'm an owner-operator but I lease on to a company and let them worry about the all the numbers. They take a flat % of the load and I get the rest. Works for me, I did real good this past year.

The new rules that go into effect this month is going to make going out of state a pain in the butt because of the rest time requirement. It's different between intrastate and interstate. Texas is a big state so I can run a lot without worrying about it, but I do slip over into Louisiana, Oklahoma, and New Mexico every now and then. We are legal to run 38 states but thats about the only states other than Texas I run.

 

[QRTRHRS]

Originally posted by EB

The new rules that go into effect this month is going to make going out of state a pain in the butt because of the rest time requirement. It's different between intrastate and interstate.

What is the difference?

 

[EB]

The best way to explain that is for you to go to this website http://www.jjkeller.com/informationcenters/hos/comparison.htm It gives you a comparison of the old and new rules.

 

[QRTRHRS]

I still don't see any difference unless the Short Haul Exception/Exemption is for intrastate. The rest time is the same if you log.

 

[PatrickCampbell]

Originally posted by LeeNH

First of all, DOT states that you need all the commercial requirements if you use the vehicle "for the furtherance of a business". This means, technically, if you even have a sales job, and you drive a car, you need to comply. Thats the way it is written, but they don't bother anyone under 10KGVW, unless you vonunteer.

Therefore, if you have anything big enough that you need a big truck to haul, you will most likely have a hard time proving it is for personal use. Whether you lease or own... . YOU would be the 'business owner' and would have to have your own DOT numbers.

1-DOT numbers (ICC numbers, MCC numbers, ect. ) are available online at the FHWA website, I think it cost me a one time fee of $300. 00 fo that, then you have to get a proccessing agent (about $75. 00), and you have to have the correct amount of insurance (I foget the form number)... . all of this (except the ins. ) is a one time fee.

2-Medical card: You can pick one up at FlyingJ, TA, or anybig truck stop, take that to your local walk in and get a physical, have them fill it out, and it is good for 2 years (cost about $80. 00 for the physical). You do not have to file anything with this, just keep the card on you... . Its the first thing they ask for when pulled in.

3-Log book: Here is where they will bust your balls, make sure it is filled out correct and shows legal running time. Some states will really bust you and ask for your fuel slips, toll reciepts, ect. to make sure they match your log. Your log book should contain all of its pages of the originals, the copies should be kept in the office. You do not have to file them anywhere.

4-You will also need fuel stickers if you run interstate and weigh over 26kGVW, this requires you to keep track of miles run in each state, fuel purchases in each state, and filing (and payment) of fuel tax if it turns out you owe it)

5-You are required to stop at all weigh stations (even empty pickups) if you are using it for commercial use. Belive me, I know via the hard way.

6-If you are running a pickup, you can NOT show sleeping berth time, because unless you have a sleeper that is 25"x25"x75", you do not have a legal place to sleep, they consider it to be no sleep time, and they will park you for 8 hours minimum. Put down off duty and tell them you slept in a motel... .

7-Is it all worth it? NO WAY!! I sold my big truck, I just run my 1 ton with a gooseneck, registered 26KGCVWR, no fuel permits, no CDL, no apportioned plates. If I need something big moved, I hire it out... . big bucks, but no hassle.



There ya go... should have a few ?'s answered there.

Lee

Hey,



You do need IFTA if you run over 3 axles even if you're under 26,001.



"Qualified Motor Vehicle" means a motor vehicle used, designed or maintained for transportation of persons or property and: (1) having two axles and a gross vehicle weight exceeding 26,000 pounds or registered gross vehicle weight; or (2) having three or more axles regardless of weight; or (3) is used in combination, when the weight of such combination exceeds 26,000 pounds gross vehicle weight or registered gross vehicle weight. If a vehicle qualifies in combination, all operations must be reported for the license year. Qualified motor vehicle does not include recreational vehicles. "

 

[LeeNH]

Well,

There is further proof, that you need to check with the Federal Highway Admin. AND your state DOT, department of safety, motor vehicles, or whatever agency governs this stuff where you are... . every state is different. All New England states also say ANY trailer over 10kgvw, does not even matter on the GCW..... Anyone want to get into DOT inspection stories??? Might as well open that can of worms here too. Lets see, I have recieved tickets for:

-loose shock bolt

-missing rubber pad on clutch pedal

-having more than 40% of my truck in primer (when I was in HS), never filled out the color change on the reg.

-having a sleeper birth that was 1/2" too narrow.

-I got a ticket for having a worn out cross link in my old W250, I got the ticket in Conn. I put it in the day before in NH... . it had 250 miles on it!!

-I got written up for not having enough conspuicity (?) tape on the sides of the trailer..... the list goes on, they will get you for something if they want to.



Oh yeah... . I got stopped in NY a few weeks back because he thought my XM reciever, which I have mounted on the rear view mirror, was a radar detector..... I have never even owned a radar detector.....



Remember when driving was simple????

 

[PatrickCampbell]

Originally posted by LeeNH

Well,

There is further proof, that you need to check with the Federal Highway Admin. AND your state DOT, department of safety, motor vehicles, or whatever agency governs this stuff where you are... . every state is different. All New England states also say ANY trailer over 10kgvw, does not even matter on the GCW..... Anyone want to get into DOT inspection stories??? Might as well open that can of worms here too. Lets see, I have recieved tickets for:

-loose shock bolt

-missing rubber pad on clutch pedal

-having more than 40% of my truck in primer (when I was in HS), never filled out the color change on the reg.

-having a sleeper birth that was 1/2" too narrow.

-I got a ticket for having a worn out cross link in my old W250, I got the ticket in Conn. I put it in the day before in NH... . it had 250 miles on it!!

-I got written up for not having enough conspuicity (?) tape on the sides of the trailer..... the list goes on, they will get you for something if they want to.



Oh yeah... . I got stopped in NY a few weeks back because he thought my XM reciever, which I have mounted on the rear view mirror, was a radar detector..... I have never even owned a radar detector.....



Remember when driving was simple????

Wow. That's all I can say, wow.



How is this for a story. I got a brand new cart railer to help drive my friend to Arizona from Toronto, ON. I live in NJ and my trailer plate fell off IN MY OWN TOWN! I made it through customs twice, once with a foreign (Canadian smogged) car on the back, and even pulled over once for going too fast through the hoover dam (was going 20 MPH in a 15 MPH zone at about 3AM) and didn't even get QUESTIONED once about the fact that Ihad no trailer plate????? (KNOCKING ON FAKE WOOD PANELING THAT I DONT HAVE!)

 

[EB]

You guys need to get out of the NE and move to Texas. I've written up before, but they were all reasonable and true violations.