Competition Porting

[Buck88]

Well, I'm getting my head fire-ringed pretty soon, so I've been calling around. I figured while the head is off I would have some porting done as well. After searching around, and getting prices, I am questioning whether or not to have it done. Does it make a noticeable difference? Will my egts be lower? should I buy a charger first and wait on the porting? - Thanks, Buck

 

[COMP461]

Port the head only if you want to make power, airflow is the most important part of any high performance engine, the second , third and forth are all air flow!!!

 

[keimmmo]

You can add boost as a "bandaid" to make power. However, there are limits there. You can get more air into the cylinders with less pressure if the ports flow well.

More Air Flow+Enough Fuel=POWER!!!



Like said above, port the head ONLY if you want to make power!



Steve Keim

 

[Bobcat698]

Might as well have the valves done while you are in there.

 

[drury]

I'm interested in porting, but no one is telling me exactly how much power they were able to make with it. Has anybody that's done it measured the HP/TQ increase relative to a stock head? Where's the best place to have it done? How much does it cost?

 

[Bobcat698]

Not sure on power numbers.



PDR Diesel does porting, as well as other vendors.



I got a head for a customer. . here is a link to a thread with some pictures:

http://www.dieseltruckresource.com/dev/showthread.php?t=125711

The head isn't done yet though, thats only the start.

 

[Buck88]

Might as well have the valves done while you are in there.

What do you mean, replace the valves? PDR told me that when they do their stage 3 port they do larger valves... is that what you mean?

 

[zstroken]

Porting is a good thing, but it would be low on my list of things to do. I would do cam, better charger etc etc first. After you have done all of that and still need more then go to porting.

 

[Forrest Nearing]

I'd just have the stock valves backcut.



I agree, cam, turbo, etc. before porting, but if the head is already going to be off and at the machine shop, might as well do it once

 

[Bobcat698]

What do you mean, replace the valves? PDR told me that when they do their stage 3 port they do larger valves... is that what you mean?

I mean backcut the stock valves.

 

[zstroken]

Yea if it is off, and you have money to put at it, it won't hurt.

 

[COMP461]

Porting, cam timing, and air flow managements systems are fundamental component of any total package program. Remember that a basic concept of any internal combustion engine is nothing more then an air pump.



The fuel system is only there to heat the air and cause expansion in the combustion chamber, driving the piston down producing usable rotating energy. Fuel must be introduced in the right amount, and at the proper time to produce the most efficient use of combustion expansion.



On a side note, initiate this process to soon for the given RPM and nothing can hold the combustion in, IE head gaskets, rings, and pistons. Start the process too late and you give up the potential power, and have residuals burning as the gasses go out the exhaust valve, giving some big EGT numbers. These optimal timing points change significantly with different acceleration rates, Pro Stock or Competition eliminator applications , go to the extreme of having a different tune for each gear and corresponding acceleration rate. REV GAIN



Cylinder Head porting dramatically reduce restriction in the intake track, and lowers temperature that go with excessive boost. . Big boost numbers are like watering the grass with a garden hose, put you finger over the end of the hose, and the pressure goes up and actual quantity of flow goes down. To achieve the same flow you have to raise pressure significantly. Creating heat and load on the turbocharger, and restriction on the exhaust track.



Over the last 10 years I have taught Fire flow hydraulics in fire fighters rookie school. This is a critical element for any firefighter; involving flow of water thru fire hose and other fire appliances. A critical part of fire hydraulics is friction loss. Air is a fluid also. There come a point where 150 lbs of boost doesn’t really move any more lbs of air then 75 lbs of boost, when you take in to consideration that the air in the intake track is closing in on 1000 degrees, Remember that an internal combustion engine, runs on the expansion of combustion gasses in the combustion chamber. Start these gases out at 1000 degrees, and you have less opportunity to let them expand even farther.





A good Example is my Cummins, it made big power on 35 to 40 lbs of boost; reason is that the cylinder head flowed almost twice the cfm of air as a stock head. Ray Little at RayMac racing engines, did extensive port work, and R&D on that cylinder head. The heads he is now turning out show even more improvement. Ray has had to hire an additional cylinder head flow specialist. This specialist came with a enthusiast attitude, and spends 10 hours a day 5 to 6 days a week developing their cylinder head programs



Again if you really don’t want big power don’t port.

 

[EHarvey]

Porting, cam timing, and air flow managements systems are fundamental component of any total package program. Remember that a basic concept of any internal combustion engine is nothing more then an air pump.



The fuel system is only there to heat the air and cause expansion in the combustion chamber, driving the piston down producing usable rotating energy. Fuel must be introduced in the right amount, and at the proper time to produce the most efficient use of combustion expansion.



On a side note, initiate this process to soon for the given RPM and nothing can hold the combustion in, IE head gaskets, rings, and pistons. Start the process too late and you give up the potential power, and have residuals burning as the gasses go out the exhaust valve, giving some big EGT numbers. These optimal timing points change significantly with different acceleration rates, Pro Stock or Competition eliminator applications , go to the extreme of having a different tune for each gear and corresponding acceleration rate. REV GAIN



Cylinder Head porting dramatically reduce restriction in the intake track, and lowers temperature that go with excessive boost. . Big boost numbers are like watering the grass with a garden hose, put you finger over the end of the hose, and the pressure goes up and actual quantity of flow goes down. To achieve the same flow you have to raise pressure significantly. Creating heat and load on the turbocharger, and restriction on the exhaust track.



Over the last 10 years I have taught Fire flow hydraulics in fire fighters rookie school. This is a critical element for any firefighter; involving flow of water thru fire hose and other fire appliances. A critical part of fire hydraulics is friction loss. Air is a fluid also. There come a point where 150 lbs of boost doesn’t really move any more lbs of air then 75 lbs of boost, when you take in to consideration that the air in the intake track is closing in on 1000 degrees, Remember that an internal combustion engine, runs on the expansion of combustion gasses in the combustion chamber. Start these gases out at 1000 degrees, and you have less opportunity to let them expand even farther.





A good Example is my Cummins, it made big power on 35 to 40 lbs of boost; reason is that the cylinder head flowed almost twice the cfm of air as a stock head. Ray Little at RayMac racing engines, did extensive port work, and R&D on that cylinder head. The heads he is now turning out show even more improvement. Ray has had to hire an additional cylinder head flow specialist. This specialist came with a enthusiast attitude, and spends 10 hours a day 5 to 6 days a week developing their cylinder head programs



Again if you really don’t want big power don’t port.

yeah what he said lol

 

[Devan Manis]

if only comp would post like that more often people would stop hating him

 

[Buck88]

First of all, thanks comp. it's obvious you took some time for that post, and I appreciate it. Alright, well I do want big power (who doesn't?) but my pockets aren't that deep. The guy I talked to about porting wants about $1k to do about what Piers does on their stage 3 port. Now, I got to thinking... thats $1k I could put towards a charger, or upgrading my pump. So I guess it's just a question of what I should do first. I guess for now, I'm aiming for 500-600 hp. Is that do-able w/o porting?

 

[zstroken]

Comp on your head was the intake cut off??

 

[RacinDuallie]

Keep in mind there are major differences in a street port job and an all out race effort port job.

 

[DF5152]

also all port jobs are not created equal!!! make sure you use someone who has done there R&D or you might wind up with a boat anchor. It would also seem to me to do it right you need to cut off the intake and make a custom manifold. i understand there is a lot of power to be gotten with a good intake manifold.

 

[RacinDuallie]

When the topic of Diesel cylinder head porting comes to discussion- only one name comes to mind as a true innovator in this arena John Russin of BUDDHA POWER... ... . and you will get the experience he has in R&D with developmental projects in cylinder port design and valve timing. -I. e. cams.

A real quality port job is totally worthless without the proper camshaft design to meet the demands of the enlarged port. It all plays together. Keep in mind these are all out efforts, not street performance port work- entirely different..... For an "all out" effort, seek the help of the mighty Buddha.

 

[BJMarshall]

Buddhapower's website must be down.

Make sure that whoever does your work has a flow bench and will give you the actual flow numbers per cylinder at different valve lifts. Cylinder to cylinder balance is very important.

Also, don't be awfully concerned about how the job looks when finished. I have seen many port jobs that looked nice, but flowed like crap and were very unbalanced, and I have also seen some that looked like my son did it with a drill and it flowed great.