Possible injector problems ? ? ?

[TJMIV]

My truck has about 111,000 - 112,000 miles on it now & it has not been abused by any means. About 3 months ago after getting about 2 miles from my home, my truck acted like it had a miss & engine light started flashing as I picked up throttle after slowing down to 35 mph going into town. I pulled over & called dealer & told service guy that it felt like a gas engine that someone had yanked half the plug wires off of. He told me to get it hauled in just in case I had an injector stuck open, to keep from trashing the engine due to cylinder getting washed down. They drove it for about 3 days with no problems & did not find any codes stored in system. Have driven it with no problems until last Monday the 8th & it done same thing within a mile from my business. Had AAA haul it in again & next afternoon the service writer called & said it did same thing with them 1 time in a 28 mile loop. This time it shows that an injector did miss on bank one , which he says is for cylinders 1,2,& 3. Have done mechanic work on boats since 1983 & took diesel mechanics in tech school in 1980, but they were not like these diesels, it was all mechanical back then. Am I better off doing all of the injectors myself instead of them doing 1, because I feel like the money I can save on labor plus what I can save on parts by getting them somewhere other than the dealer would be better spent doing them all for the simple reason that they all have the same duty cycles on them. I`m not a drag racer & don`t care about tons of smoke , but I do like a little get up & go. Stock or aftermarket & who are some good suppliers to deal with ? Don`t like back pedaling if I have a problem with a part. I do have a smarty jr. & usually run it in level 2, but did not have it loaded into system this last time. The first time it occurred I did have it loaded but left it out since then to see if it was something to do with the smarty jr. Thanks, all & any suggestions welcomed.

 

[PWong]

it shows that an injector did miss on bank one , which he says is for cylinders 1,2,& 3.
I would check resistance of the wiring harness for bank 1 and resistance of injector solenoid first.

 

[Joseph Donnelly]

It is common for HPCR injectors to need replacement at that mileage. The factory fuel filter was originally 10 micron, later a 7 micron was available. The HPCR system needs 4 micron or better according to Bosch to prevent injector wear. I have seen many cases where there were no DTC's but one or more injectors were bad.

 

[Joseph Donnelly]

You can find procedures for replacing the injectors in the TDR, such as Issue 51 but it isn't as easy as prior models, pre-HPCR, so be meticulous especially about dirt and torque specifications. I would replace all six injectors.

 

[p-Bar]

Joe should he install new cross tubes? also I would recommend some better fuel filtration.

 

[cerberusiam]

That mileage is pretty low for physical problems with the injectors. Given some care is taken in selecting fuel and normal maintenance to filter 200-250k is the usual mileage for physical failure. That type of failure will almost always be accompanied by other symptoms, hard starting, white smoke at times, hazing while driving, and a mileage drop.

The sypmtoms indicate you have 1 cylinder that is showing a problem with the solenoid. It could be the injector or it could be the harness thru the VC gasket. If it is not telling you which cylinder positively is misfiring then the ECU is just reading some out of range values on that bank. It is probably not completely failing but enough that a miss is felt and the electronics are seeing a voltage problem.

The solenoids will start going bad and show high resistance causing problems. Usually after they arer warmed up and working for a bit. At that point you should be able to ohm the solenoid and see high resistance. Since it is bank 1 star with those 3 and look for one that is higher than the others. The reading will depend on the sensitivity of the meter used. A decent DVOM will read with a .5 ohm accuracy. All the solenoids should be checked with the wires disconnected and should read .5 ohms or lower. One reading even 1 ohm warm is a potential problem.

The harness thru the VC gaskets can also cause the same problem. You really have to isolate the harness from the injector and check both, or, replace the VC gasket\harness combo.

The solenoids are no available from Ebay and other places for just a bad solenoid. If you care to do the leg work and the actual changing you can save yourself a lot of $$. Search here for the thread on changing the solenoids.

Do not buy injectors from the dealer! It is likely you will get some really bad remans that will haunt you forever. The injectors are available from many places at a much better price than the dealer for NEW injectors not remans.

Swapping injectors is not hard, just a little time consuming. There is a good thread here on the steps to remove an install CR injectors. Before considering that I would do some diagnostic work to see if the issue can be found. I think you just a have a solenoid going bad and unless you have several other issues that go along with bad injectors, or you just want to upgrade, you can probably fix what you have pretty reasonably.

 

[Bob V]

Bank one has a common wire harness. I would start by looking there first.

 

[Joseph Donnelly]

The only bad cross tubes I have seen either were rusted from wet fuel or damaged from dropping them, etc.

 

[TJMIV]

Thanks for all of your responses with my problem, & I have run the 7 micron fro Geno`s every since they have offered it. I change my filter usually @ the 10,000 mile mark & have bought my fuel at the same location since 1991 when I purchased my first diesel. I drain my fuel into a container every time I change the filter just so I can check for water or trash & that has never been an issue. Only time I buy fuel some where else is if I can`t back from one of my vacation destinations without stopping & that is very rare. I have maintained this truck myself since it was new & I`m a firm believer in PM work & torque specs. Dealership has only seen this truck 1 time til this happened. If I need to install a system like the Fass titanium fuel pump double filter system to get to that 3 micron filtration, then that`s what I`ll do. Gonna get my truck back to my shop & start checking every thing that all of you have suggested starting with the least expensive up to the most expensive. Thanks again to all who gave a response, this is why I renew my membership with the TDR year after year. It`s people helping people & that`s the way it should be & it`s the way I was raised up as a kid.

 

[cerberusiam]

If you jsut want better filtration you do not need a FASS. Just get the GDP kit that puts a 3 um filter between the CP-3 and the OE filter and you are good. The stock pump will handle extra filters so it is not a big deal to add them.

If you have never had issues with fuel before then it is likely there is a solenoid on an injector on bank 1 that is getting bad. Get the engine up to operaitng temp and ohm the solenoids frist and pretty sure you will find the problem easily.

 

[TJMIV]

Don`t know what a GDP kit is but will try to research that, also have not found injector solenoids for sale by anyone, but I will admit I`m not a computer person.Can I check them using the connector going through the head, or do i have to pull the valve cover off & check it @ the injector terminals with the wires disconnected ? Dealer told me their next step would be to pull valve cover off before they could test any further before they could determine which injector is going bad. On the outboards we work on, we can test & cycle injectors, oil injection pump, ignition components, the whole nine yards. Obviously the 03 & newer trucks are not like that.

 

[cerberusiam]

The wiring harness for the injectors is embedded in the valve cover gasket, that can go bad. The solenoids can go bad. You have to pull the valve cover and isolate the injector from the harness to find out which one is the problem. The solenoids are for sale on Ebay and othe rplaces. There is a thread right here on replacing them and where to buy.

You can look at injector duty cycle with software scanners that do that but ultimately you need to test the solenoid to see if it is showing bad.

GDP is Glacier Diesel Power and they have filter kits, http://www.glacierdieselpower.com/dept.aspx?dept_id=08-002.

 

[TJMIV]

Thank you cerberusiam, didn`t know the harness was made in the valve cover gasket, & after I responded to your e-mail last night ,I found those filter kits. I had no idea that was available & do I need to leave original filter assembly on the engine , or delete it with the part that GDP offers. I noticed you can actually see the starter in the pics on the GDP web-site without getting under the truck. I need to update my truck signature as I have since installed mag-hytec differential covers & double-deep trans pan, BD steering box stabilizer, fab fours front bumper, FS-2500 by-pass filter kit, & edge insight to monitor

 

[cerberusiam]

Leave the OE fitler housing and add the GDP kit in front of the air horn. The filters that go in the OE housing are really good water spearators and you don't want to lose that ability.

 

[HerbW]

There are but six bolts that hold the valve cover on. 10 MM socket size. These engines can be ran with the valve cover off if you want to test it before putting it back together after replacing solenoid. I've written on TDR how to change them out easily. Get an OHM meter. The one that doesn't test the same as the others at X1 setting is your baddie! Good luck, Herb

 

[g_dog1]

If it felt like the engine was missing under load, with no other symptoms of bad injectors (such as long starts, or oil dilution) and if there were no codes, I suspect a plugged fuel filter. I added an extra fuel filter on my frame, and in the winter it would start "missing" under load. Cold viscous diesel fuel doesn't flow well through a plugged-up fuel filter very well, and I think my FCA was responding by bouncing all over the place.

 

[cerberusiam]

Ony way to test that theory is put a gauge at the CP-3 inlet an monitor pressure. Generally a miss under load is an injector problem, not fuel. Low fuel delivery gets distributed to all the cylinders not just one and the truck falls on its face. A single injector with possible a solenoid on the way out, scored pintle, bad seat, or just sticky\worn can show as a miss under load. Finding it gets to be the exercise if there is no codes.

 

[Prairie Dog]

The one time I got a bad batch of fuel and it clogged the FF (3 times), the truck would miss under load just like a gasser with a bad or broken spark plug. It would run fine until moderate throttle with a trailer and then it stumbled and fell on its face.
I think a good rule of thumb is to replace the FF first anytime it doesn't run right, even if it has only be a few miles since the last change.

Scott