Questions on HuGe injectors

[Hohn]

OK, I did a search and I couldn't really find the information I was looking for.



With the DD injectors, after DD3, they call them "race" injectors. Bully dog makes no such distinction. BD doesn't have much info on big injectors on their website.



I would like to install bigger injectors, and only do it once. I don't want to upgrade the turbo just yet. How big can I go on injectors before you can't stop the smoking? It's sounds like even a DD3 is pretty manageable with no fuel box if you drive gently.



So, if I am willing to watch the pyro, how big can I go with injectors before I ALWAYS have bad smoke?? I don't mind off-boost smoke, and I don't mind a little trail when the boost is on, but I don't want to have uncontrollable belching smoke. I know some of you like it-- I don't.



Are SuperMentals street driveable? i don't mind avoiding idling to prevent washdown. I want to have an engine that will still idle, even though I won't subject it to that often. I don't want to stall easily.



I guess my theory is that you can always reduce fuel to a larger injector easier than you can add fuel to a small one. How about atomization? IS it really that bad with the big injectors?



I think the DD3's are what I am looking for, but I don't want to buy them and then think they are tamer than I tought, and I should have gone bigger.....



How about you guys running a stage 4 or higher injector? I am thinking Bully Dog or BD 5, 6, 7, and up. . What say you guys with the monster injectors????



HOHN

 

[CUMINNTSTRKN]

if you still have your stock turbo dd3's are as big as i would go. my favorite street injectors are the super mentals, they smoke a lot less than bd4's and make the same power.



jim

 

[Jetpilot]

I have to agree with Jim on this one, I wouldn't go above 3's with the stock turbo. If you upgrade the charger then bigger injectors would be OK. What do you want to do with the truck? If max power without regard to egt's or you are not towing anything then you can go about as big as you want. But be aware that not only will you need a bigger charger for egt issues but with the increased fuel from really large injectors you need the oxygen from the bigger charger to burn the fuel. With the B-1 I make about the same HP with stage 6, 7, or 8s. Also I ran DD super mentals and absolutley loved them for street injectors!



Doug

 

[Hohn]

I don't tow, and it's likely that if I ever do, then it will be light (<5K)



I guess that DD3s are what i want... Will they spool the stock turbo faster? With stock injectors, the turbo won't spool until almost 2K rpm, then I only have about 700 rpm to play with. Even then, it only seems to kick in 3rd and 4th. 700 rpm and only two gears isn't exactly a funfest.



Would DD3s and a PDR40 spool about as well as stock? The stock level of lag is about all I am willing to tolerate. I wouldn't mind the lag so much if I had more then 700 rpm to play with once it came in... .



HOHN

 

[TxDieselKid]

Even with only DD3's your goign to want to upgrade the turbo after a while. They will spool the turbo in the blink of an eye.



If your REALLY getting into bigger injectors then look into EDM's. There are several people doing this, but JR Adkins is the ones I would buy from.



Andrew

 

[TomGolden]

Hohn,



One thing that I'm sure you are already aware of - if you go with *any* aftermarket injectors, you will need some sort of boost module or otherwise when you nail the go pedal, and get 20+ PSI of boost, you will likely set engine codes like crazy. Not to mention the ECM will defuel you:-{}



Edge makes a simple boost module that does ONLY that, no fueling or timing alterations.



I had DD3's and this boost module on my stock HX35 for about 2 months until I got my (bone stock) HX40 installed a couple years ago. Yes, dd3's on a stock turbo will spool it mighty quick, and believe me, that combo is quite awesome compared to stock injectors. But you NEED a boost module.



Also, my stock HX40 has ugly lag when drag racing :{ When I bought mine, it was in the days of the Majestic modified HX40's blowing themselves to pieces, so I wanted no part of that picture, and Piers didn't have any modified turbos out yet. I really want one of his new HX50 hybrids and a set of Bully Dog 7 or 8's for drag racing



Tom

 

[Hohn]

Thanks, Tom. I was aware of the boost module requirement. If I am not mistaken, only stage 2 or higher injectors need one, though. DD1s and 275s don't need one, if I remember correctly.



Is there a boost module out there cheaper than the Practical Solutions one? That's still a good chunk of change.



For that cost, I should just buy a Comp and get the boost module for free. Not to mention better control over big injectors. .



HOHN

 

[CUMINNTSTRKN]

imo



you would be better off going with the comp and go from there.



jim

 

[overfueled]

Hohn I started of with the DDII's and the hx35 then a year latter I go to the HX40 and the BD #5's. What I should of done went to the 40 and #5's first. Then I wouldent be looking at the $1,000. 00 loss I took . I am having a hard time getting 1/2 of what they cost me. By the way not much smoke with the #5's and alot more fun Overvuled

 

[JR2]

Try it my way, I bought 275's and said that would be enought. Then I bough DD3's and a PDRHX35 and thougth I would be happy. Then I bough a PDRHX40 and everyting was cool. Now just two days ago I got a good deal on a used set of super mentals... . I think I will still be happy.



If I where doing it again and using all the info I know have I would buy DD3's and HX40 and an edge comp. You just can not go wrong with that combo. The only disclaimer is to have gauges, get the fuel system upgraded and take care of the intake side of things.





JR2

 

[BFC]

JR,



Guess we can't blame the slow economy on you!



Glenn

 

[Bigstick]

Hohn,

Pull your skirt up and act like you got a pair. I started with a stock truck and said wow. Then cut the muffler off and added a K&N filter and said COOL! Then I added an Edge EZ that was cool for a while. then came the 275's that was a great safe setup. Then I had a guy here in town that runs a diesel performance shop make me a set of 475's and I bought an Edge Drag Comp also added the JVD anti-defueling device. Now this thing is starting to run a little. Eventually I would like to port and polish, triangle valve grind, cam, and a PDRHX40 but for now I have to settle with this. If I had it to do all over again I would... ... ..... LEAVE IT STOCK!! Oops sorry sometimes my conscience takes over or maybe that was my turrets coming out. Make sure you add a pusher pump also.

Bigstick

I promise that frying my injection pump and blowing my head gasket had nothing to do with the upgrades... .

 

[LSMITH]

I would recommend against the Comp or any other wire tap box for starter upgrades. EGT is out of control without big $$$ to fight EGT, and the massive torque gains in the low end are REALLY hard on clutches and auto trannies. Throttle sensitivity is hard to get used to as well as the "hit" of the power when the box starts fueling.



I would recommend that you get some DD2's or 3's and a boost module for a start. Injectors provide SMOOTH power over the entire powerband and drivability is actually enhanced. The gain of power is awesome, but without throttle sensitivity or surging. EGT is easily controlled with all but the HY turbos, making it a LOT cheaper when you don't need a turbo and intake and exhuast and.....



Go for the injectors and leave the wire taps for when you need a fix BAD and either don't care about EGT or have the money to fight it.

 

[TomGolden]

Hohn, If I remember right, I paid like $300 or thereabout for my Edge boost module 2 yeasr ago, got it from HVAC. If you could find a used DD TTPM (True Torque Power Module) or Edge EZ box, those should go used for ~$300 also, and they have the boost module built in.



Tom

 

[Chipstien]

I would call Don M. and ask about having him make you a set of EDM 4's. I ran DD3 and a drag comp on the stock HY for almost a year so I would say you can run larger injectors with your turbo. Just be ready to back out of the throttle when your EGT's start to get out of hand. Remember that EDM injectors smoke less than extrude honed injectors so you can get more injector. However they do cost more too.

 

[CFAR]

How much power do you want?

How much do you want to pay for power?

How much are you willing to pay to keep egt's in check?

How soon do you want to replace your clutch?

How much are you willing to pay for a new clutch?

How long do you want your truck to last?

How many questions can I ask in this reply?

Where did you get a Limited Slip Diff that works?





I have the Bully Dog III's, love em, need a new clutch, I have a comp, not installed need clutch.



I do NOT have a boost fooler installed, I don't set codes nor are my egt's uncontrollable. I have one in the comp, which will get installed but I need a clutch.



If you are gentle (ha, ha) your clutch can survive a long time. I don't tow much either. But if your clutch is like mine? you will be alble to slip it with III's.



The smoke on III's, at least mine is very manageable, they are very driveable, and the power is very nice.



approx hp with III's will be 300hp +-. If you then upgrade the clutch $1000. 00 and add a comp or similar box you will be right at 400-425. And you can always turn the box down or even off.



Plan ahead and decide what power level you want and buy to achieve it. A lot cheaper that way.

 

[Hohn]

Originally posted by CFAR

How much power do you want?

How much do you want to pay for power?

How much are you willing to pay to keep egt's in check?

How soon do you want to replace your clutch?

How much are you willing to pay for a new clutch?

How long do you want your truck to last?

How many questions can I ask in this reply?

Where did you get a Limited Slip Diff that works?



Plan ahead and decide what power level you want and buy to achieve it. A lot cheaper that way.

Here's my answers:

1) 375HP is the goal

2) As little as i can and still do it right

3) ditto

4) baby clutch til dead, then pay whatever it costs

5) truck last? you mean these wear out?

6) a whole lot of questions...

7) LSD-- just replaced axle lube with Mobil 1, very little modifier.....



Hohn



EDIT: My LSD still spins like an open diff if I have the rear wheels on very different surfaces. If one is one pavement and the other on dirt, I can spin and spin. I am thinking about draining the diff again and going with no modifier at all.....

 

[Bigsaint]

Hohn, if it helps, I made 366 RWHP when I had the stage 3 injectors, HX40 and Edge Ez combo. Prettly close to what you are after. I have the step 5 injectors now, love 'em, but they are not for everyone. I towed a bit over 10,000 lbs. this past summer with them and no egt issues as long as I chose the right gear. Did smoke like a coal train under low boost, but that is to be expected .



Scott W.

 

[Hohn]

I wish I could be original, but the more I look at it, the more I am convinced that the combo of DD3/UFM/HX40/Con OFE is exactly what I seek.



Spoke w/ Keith at DD yesterday and he said that the UFM is good for 90hp on my ETH. That would be a good fix until I could get injectors.



I know that I really want injectors, BUT the idea of spending extra $$ on a stand-alone boost module when almost every box out there has one built in makes me choke.



I just can't see spending $500+ for an EZ when a lot more power is only marginally more expensive. IMHO a wire tap box could be just as easy on the drivetrain as any other box if you keep it at sane settings, and don't drive like a car thief.



I am really close to ordering the UFM, and then begging the wife for forgiveness... . forgiveness better than permission, right? hehe



Hohn

 

[CFAR]

I may be wrong but I don't believe you will need a boost module, with III's, as I said before I don't run one, but I don't tow heavy, nor do I have steep grades to deal with. No codes set. The only problem I see with injectors is you can't turn them off. All you can do to reduce egt's is to down shift and/or let off the go pedal.



I don't know a thing about the ufm, I know with the comp you can hook up just the ez portion by NOT tapping into the vp-44. And it comes with the boost fooler built in.



LOL