Shudder

[FerranRico]

My 93 D350 4x4 5. 9L shudders upon take off, 5-10mph. . , after that it runs fine... , will not repeat if held or returned to same rpm's...

It has all the Banks accesories. . , Turbo, pyrometer, intercooler, jake brake, etc... , changed fue lfilter, oil filter and transmission was just rebuilt, also has 6 new tires. . (balanced 4 times, I don't think they are the culprit... )...

any ideas?

know of any good diesel mechanics in the Orlando, FL area?

I want to get the valves set... . or have it checked...

I'm only getting about 12mpg. . , no load... .

Not normal... . , but, just bought the truck. . , so I don't know. .

A friend convinced me that 93 was THE year for the Dodge Diesel. . , and that I would get 18-24 mpg... . , NOT.....

I'll be carrying a 2200 lb slide in camper, and pulling a 10K lb trailer... . , I hope it can do better... .



please respond to -- email address removed --



Thanks

 

[BushWakr - RIP]

You didn't say if you have the extended cab or not. If so, the shudder can be the steady bearing in the 2-piece drive shaft. It may be bad or it may require the repair which results in a spacer between the bearing holder and truck frame. There is a TSB (techinical service bulletin) on this. Also you may have a bad universal, or perhaps trans. output shaft problems. The first place I would look is the steady bearing, then universals.

Perhaps one of the guys has some other ideas on this???

As to mileage, you should be seing around 17mpg or better I would guess. I am getting about 19mpg around town/empty with the modifications shown in my 'sig' line below.

Did I understand you right?? your pulling a 10,000 lb. trailer in addition to a camper? or a 10' trailer?

My camper is about the same weight as yours, with a utility trailer about 1300 lbs. loaded and I get about 20 mpg on the highway running around 65 -70MPH.



Regards, Bush'

 

[Stefan Kondolay]

Do you have a one piece driveshaft or two piece.

 

[FerranRico]

It is a Club cab, and has a 4"lift, don't know if factory or add-on...

The transmission was just rebuilt, and a new carrier bearing to the two piece shaft was installed, also new u-joints. .

The transmission tech mentioned something about lowering the carrier bearing by means of a spacer, where do I get it?, or is it custom made?



Yes, the truck carries a Coachman Sportsman camper (2200 lbs) and pulls a tandem trailer (3100 lbs) with a Jeep CJ-8 on top (5500 lbs), GrossTrailerWeight is about 8600 lbs, tongue weight on that puppy is a whopping 1500 lbs...

The truck has a Kelderman air bag suspension kit and a Reese hitch which ties (canterlever) to the leaf springs with the air bags in between.

So far I haven't towed it for any long distance, but am planning on going cross country with the whole enchilada...

 

[Rockcrusher]

Agree with drive shaft bearing. lift could cause it.

Also check engine mounts. Loose?

 

[cullmanboy]

this has my curiosity up also, I seem to have the shudder most of the time, loaded and unloaded, but at other times it goes smooth, bought the u-joints and carrier bearing some time ago but never installed, carrier bearing finally went bad, so limped into a place and had them replace the bearing, u-joints, trans service and rear main seal, but it too seems to still be doing the same thing, was the TSB for duallys and SRW, mine is a 93 extended cab SRW

 

[FerranRico]

Haven't checked the engine mounts. . , good idea. .

I thought it would be due to the air bags, and lowered the pressure to about 10 lbs (man. recs 20 for no load) but it still does same, although muffled...

I'm having the driveshaft balanced on Friday. . , just to be sure. .

the carrier bearing seems to already have an spacer, the difference between short and long driveshafts is about 10-15 degrees inclination down from the carrier bearing... ,

weird... , would it have anything to do with engine?. . , maybe accel sensor on pump or something?

Thanks

 

[CToney]

I hope this may help.

Check the nuts that hold your tranfer case to your transmission. When I bought my truck the previous owner replace the transmission at 180,000kms at 270,000 the studs sheared off because they were loose and I was towing 15,000lbs dead pull in 4wd to get enough traction. I found this out by lifting up on the drive shaft. I also had to replace the rear yoke and slip yoke. My truck shuddered and the 4wd shifter shook bad.



Good Luck



CR Toney

 

[FerranRico]

Thanks for the advice, i'll checkthe transfer case. . , hopefully the transmission rebuilders would have noticed any loose/sheared bolts...

It's driving me nuts...

Thanks

 

[Bill Kondolay]

Shuddering on initial takeoff is often mistaken for a transmission problem. Most of the trucks i have had experience with the shuddering is related to pinion angle , the situation really boils down to checking the pinion angle, this can be done by most shops that do lowering kits or lift kits. The spacers can range anywhere from 3/8" - 1" spacer between the carrier bearing . The spacer should be made out of one piece steel, you should not simply put individual spacers in between each bolt.



While this method can be used for testing purposes simply because its quicker the final spacer should one piece.



Dont be surprised if it turns out to be a one inch spacer.

 

[FerranRico]

What about rear axle angle variation due to the Kelderman air bags... , travel up/down can vary as much as 3" (from 10 to 30 lbs bag pressure)... , I think that it all started when I filled the bags to accomodate the Coachman camper... , now that it is off. . the truck looks like a jack rabbitt... , and it is weird that it would start suddendly, while it has had the bags for years, and the previous owner says that it never shuddered for him... .

This being my first diesel and knowing nothing about them is unerving... , I've been asking and there seems to be no one around Central Florida who can work on them. .

Thanks

 

[NOMOFO]

Finally a response from the big guy! I tried to address this problem on your site Bill but I guess you've been having problems with it and imagine you're quite busy as well. My W350 does this too and I have replaced the carrier bearing and had the driveline balanced and components checked. Some improvement but not enough. So I have been aware of the TSB and just wanted to get an experienced opinion before I attacked this. As I understood it they talked about a 1/2" spacer for the carrier and a kit of wedges for the axle blocks. Sounds like it's a trial and error project. Local 4x4 shop thinks the wedges are a waste of time but encouraged trying the spacer. The local dealer wants something like $300 for the kit! I emphatically suggested they could install that kit in their collective ...

Anyway Bill, any opinion on the wedges?

Also I have a somewhat sticky throttle to AT cable (doesn't always return completely, leaves about . 250 instead of that . 180 space) that seems to reult in a harsh downshift. This is an occasional problem that is more prevalent when truck is warm. I have disconnected the cable from throttle cam and tried actuating the lever manually but can't determine whether the cable itself is going or if the transmission lever is the problem. Any thoughts?

One more if I may. From previous conversation with you about upgrading to your TC and VB I know you would prefer to upgrade to new transmission first. But if my lightly used 116K AT seems to be working fine (other than problem above) would it not be cost effective to install TC and VB in this one if I may get another 30K or more out of it? I only put on about 10K annually.

 

[Bill Kondolay]

Shudder is caused by one or two things, first driveline angularity where the pinion angle and the output shaft angle must match. This could be correrted by pinion shims and carrier shims sold through Skyjacker, Trailmaster, Beltech and Superlift. Second is the actual problem which is spring wrap. Correcting the pinion angles will help this but if it doesn't completely control it, a traction control device is necessary, again Superlift, Skyjacker, Procomp sell these devices.



This is the info I got from Herb at Kustom Truck in Yuba City, CA.

530-674-1376

 

[FerranRico]

Thanks. .

I think that the air bags have a lot to do with it. . , as they affect the angle up or down... , been playing with different pressures and it seems to change accordingly...

Anyway, have bigger fish to fry for now. . , just took a trip to N. C. , with the camper and trailer load... , the truck gave me only 9. 8 mpg on the average... , it went to it's knees on the hills of northern Georgia and N. C. , slowing down to about 35 mph and the Banks turbo could only get up to 18 lbs of pressure... , something is wrong with this puppy...

I've poured all kinds of injector cleaners and cetane additives, to no avail...

Any help on that one????...

Thanks