Smarty or nozzles????

[tadpole1065]

as for the first substantial performance upgrade, should i change the injector nozzles or just buy a shorty programmer??? I have dont quite a bit to my old 12 valves for performance and had good luck, but this is gonna be my first shot at my electronic and i dont want to spend lots of time with it. .

 

[steved]

You won't see a whole lot with nozzles alone...

 

[tadpole1065]

That is what I suspected. All these people selling nozzles are saying 40hp or 90hp and so on. I figured it was pretty much sales pitch... More than likely it will be the smarty box. As far as I know, the smarty is the only programmer that doesnt leave a footprint in the trucks computer... Do you have nozzles or a smarty Steve?

 

[subodh]

smarty alone is a nice uppgrade did that on my 05 truck but you could do some mods by your self after that like cutting out abit of your airbox. . before i did that the thing that tells you to change filter went in when i put my foot down another thing. . loos the big ****ing powerpump under your car or simply use a blowtorch and cut everything out of the cat. then you will feel alot power. . dont play around to much you will get high egt and your liftpump will be abit small on higer levels. . i use sw 3 and sometime 5 really had same good mgp with all catchers up to 5! SMARTY is the best thing i put on my truck. . and arsoson3, flux2 nozzles (100hp) and fass 150gph is in the mail

 

[AH64ID]

I would start with the Smarty, but the reasons are different based on your truck. Why dont you fill out your sig so we know what you drive.

 

[tadpole1065]

Sorry guys, I have an 05 2500 quadcab 4x4 shortbed automatic. I have a piece of straight pipe in place of the cat right now, and an AFE air filter. I am mostly concerned with a little extra when towing my 5th wheel and my milage when running around empty. . I am trying to make my stock transmission last as long as possible. HOWEVER, when it gets the treatment from Dave @ Goerend, then it will be time to turn it up some. . Should I go for the SMARTY JR OR SR???

 

[AH64ID]

You would be best suited with a Smarty Jr first. It will give you more overall improvement, especially considering how the stock tuning was designed around emissions. Neither one will be easy on your trans, but with care could last a while. For towing apps I like the Jr based on the lower tq management options. If you eventually end up with a Jr and 50 hp nozzles you can be putting about 475/900 to the ground, if you want more than that then get the Sr.

 

[steved]

I have both. I had Flux Is installed when I lost an injector, there was little difference before/after. The SmartyJR came later, and was a significant difference over stock... I like the default 70hp setting myself (best overall gains/performance).



And it would be about 325hp, 40hp, and 100hp for about 465hp at the CRANK wouldn't it???

 

[AH64ID]

I always understood nozzle ratings to be rwhp ratings, which is what the Smarty Jr is as well. I dyno'd 430-435 with the JR on SW3, so add 50 is 480.

Are F1's 25, 40, or 50's?

 

[AMcCormick]

Well to give you an idea truck in sig dyno at 411hp on STOCK tuning no Smarty, I believe this was at the wheels. Very consistant mpg at 15-16. truck weighs over 8k on a daily basis. Best I have gotten was 17mpg using Smarty Revo TNT sw1, could easily light up the tires. I am now running the most recent Smarty Revo sw5. No mpg figures yet. There is very little smoke, only when I quickly open up does she smoke and it clears up pretty quick. If you know you are going to get a new transmission why would you not get the Smarty Sr. ? Bang for the buck the smarty would be better than injectors, I would say.

 

[Regcabguy]

as for the first substantial performance upgrade, should i change the injector nozzles or just buy a shorty programmer??? I have dont quite a bit to my old 12 valves for performance and had good luck, but this is gonna be my first shot at my electronic and i dont want to spend lots of time with it. .

Smarty Jr. or Sr. You're in Cali so keep the cat inorder to pass smog. Numerous guys have posted dyno results with or without the cat. Negligible improvement without it. A freer flowing muffler and modding your stock airbox ala www.psmdiesel.com or Home Depot equivalent along with the Smarty will yield a great,cooler running truck.

 

[AMcCormick]

that is another great feature of the smarty, sw0. Absolutely no smoke at all, none zero no matter how hard you try. The smarty is also undetected during the obd portion of the smog check.

 

[tadpole1065]

Wow, all that sounds awesome!! Does the airbox mod cause you to fail the visual part of the Cali smog test?? How much drop in exhaust temp was gained by the Smarty and the airbox mod?? What muffler is the most free flowing of the aftermarket ones but is still quiet?? I am getting old enough that I dont want that roar like when I was in my 20's with my BBC and flowmasters... I have those on my camaro, and that is enough noise for me from the small amount of time I drive it. .

 

[R.Taylor]

Wow, all that sounds awesome!! Does the airbox mod cause you to fail the visual part of the Cali smog test?? How much drop in exhaust temp was gained by the Smarty and the airbox mod?? What muffler is the most free flowing of the aftermarket ones but is still quiet?? I am getting old enough that I dont want that roar like when I was in my 20's with my BBC and flowmasters... I have those on my camaro, and that is enough noise for me from the small amount of time I drive it. .

To do the airbox mod you'd have to go back to a stock air box set up. Is your AFE filter just a filter element or is it the entire Air intake kit. Stock air box with the PSM / Home Deopt mod. . A "Cool blue hose" and a TAGIII Air guide from Bryan at DPP will take care of your intake side better than any aftermarket intake kit out there.



DPP Cool Hose 03-07 5. 9L Dodge Cummins



Turbo Air Guide TAG-III 94-07 5. 9L Dodge Cummins



PSM Cold Air Intake 04. 5-07 5. 9L Dodge Cummins



Doing that exact mod to a stock airbox is $347 from Bryan and you could most likely get a deal on that. Throw in latest version tall pleat Mopar airfilter element and your good to go. Most of the aftermarket air intake kits have an open element meaning it suck air from anywhere it can... Including hot air from the engine compartment.



Air intake systems and intake manifolds are fine in Cali. . I'm running that exact airbox mod, A CFM+ Intake manifold an a HTT Polished Stainless Steel exhaust manifold... . Smog inspector said it looks nice. Clean ODB, Cat and snap test for visible smoke is all they are looking for.



Silverline make a nice muffler, Donaldson has a few as well. Injector nozzles look like quite a chore for the shade tree mechanic along with the needed special tools. I'd only consider messing with injectors if I was going full out with a dual CP3 kit, Meth/Water, Twins, Cam and springs. But then I'd need a $1200 set of ARP studs to keep the head down.



Remember... . Your transmission will take a beating mighty quick with any moderate HP increase. You could destroy it with the Smarty on SW9 and a few good wild rides.

 

[tadpole1065]

My AFE is just the filter inside the stock airbox. It is one of thier later versions. Its cone shaped in the middle with a flat urethane flange around it so it seats in the stock filters position. It is still oil/washable gauze, not the totally dry one...

 

[AH64ID]

The mods I have done to my intake are only about $340 and probably outflow anything out there.

Home Depot CAI
Airaid MIT
Glacier Intake Horn

I know for a fact that CAI's don't do anything below 450 rwhp, and that my mods have decreased spool time, lowered the rpms needed for 30 psi of boost, decreased WOT resistance, decreased IAT's, and decreased bottom end smoke.

With your 05 lower intake elbow inplace, as with a MIT, there is no need for a TAG as your lower elbow has a version of that.

 

[R.Taylor]

Ditch the oiled filter. The new version stock Mopar filter is excellent, Amsoil makes a nice dry filter and AEM also has a nice dry filter. Don't go with a full aftermarket intake / filter kit... . You'd spend more than cost of the above said mod and you would get minimal if any gains from it.

 

[tadpole1065]

Thanks for all the great info guys, I have a plan now. (As long as it fits the pocketbook) ha ha

 

[LRutigliano]

I have KAX injectors in my 2003. They are rated approx 80hp and 120 ft-lbs torque. They are stock Bosch bodies with "improved" tips. They made a NIGHT/DAY difference when towing my 11k 5er and they didn't worsen the fuel economy.



However, I still noticed it took almost full throttle to get my 5er moving from a stop. The injectors were great at highway speeds.



Smarty cured the down low issue and now I can basically just chug away from a stoplight...



I keep reading that the best injectors out there are the ones that are rated for 50hp.



Hope this helps,

Louis