St. Louis Paint Job

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I just got off the phone with the service manager, Larry. What I did not know yesterday was that Larry's last name is MELTON. No need for a face-to-face with the owner – I was dealing with him (co-owner) from the start!

DC does not seem to have a specific objection to replacement, HOWEVER: No more Y2K Rams can be ordered. As had been posted elsewhere previously, the 2001s come out in January, and the Y2K build is essentially coming to a quick end. So that means a possible/probable price differential on a 2001. Additionally, DC will not get involved with the tax/tag issue, so I might well come out on the behind side overall.

With informative posts like those from RobbyRam and MikeR, I felt confident enough to go along with Meltons' proposal: Paint only the worst part right now (right rear quarter), and keep a careful eye on the rest of the truck. I still have almost three years to have the rest painted, too, if I feel like it needs to be done. This would also give me the opportunity to see how the paint looks over the next couple years. It’s all documented, and I have no doubt that they will take care of it if I ask. And at DC’s suggestion, DC has offered the 7yr/75K warranty to me at no cost. With my driving style, and interest in keeping this fine beast forever, I find myself quite satisfied with this resolution, as I expected I would with Meltons.

Not everyone will agree that I got treated right with this agreement, but it works for me. I sure want to thank everyone for their input!


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Y2K 2500 QC 4X4 Sport, black 3. 54 auto, every option but Cab Lights. Black brush/grille guard and bed rails (Dodge), black Westin nerfs. K&N air filter; Gauges on hand, ready for the A-pillar. More to come...

 

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Sorry Scott1
Chrysler builds some of the mini vans in Windsor, they also build the full size Ram van in Winsor. Also Canadian are all the LHS cars they are built in Bramalea Ot.
St Louis has two plants one is mini van and one of course is Dodge Ram. The Dodge Ram is also built in Saltillo and Largo Alberto Mexico.
The Dakota is built in Warren Mi.
I think the 4 has to do with export I think you know NAFTA. They are built at thier respective plants but for export.

Don #ad


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"The Shadow" 1999 Dodge Ram SLT 2500 QC 5spd 3. 55lsd, Short Bed, Sport, Black, Camel/Tan Interior, Trailer tow package, Camper package, Infinity sound.

Soon to be a BOM member with Cummins ECU, Guages, Bigger Tires, and much more as soon as I talk the wife out of the money.
Elba Twp, Michigan

 

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Now you all got me worried about the paint job because my Ram was made in St. Louis. I guess I'll find out soon, the truck just got in town by rail, and should delivered to the dealer in a few days. I sure hope that everything comes out flawless.

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Y2K 2500 SLT+, on order!

 

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I have a St Louis truck and the paint could have been much better. I think the thickness or in this case the thinness was terrible. It almost scratched by walking on it in the bed area and I have numerous scratches other places through to the primer.


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1996 Dodge Cummins Club Cab, 2500, automatic with a 3. 54, claret red pearl coat,matching bed cover, Jacobs E-brake, K&N, 18,000 miles.

 

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I'm with MikeR, although if I was Tulsa618 (with the percentage of damaged paint on his Ram) I would PREFER and demand a complete (re)paint job(even if I had to bank roll a portion of it. . which I wouldn't expect to). The factory paint job on most vehicles is not that great anyway. I have witnessed several dealerships that have had to repaint the entire vehicle under warranty (or elected to do so), even though the damaged portion of the factory paint job totaled approximately 50% of the painted surface. This was performed as a good will gesture. This will also ensure the vehicle will match when the paint ages. Both of these dealers used Sikkens paint which IS VASTLY SUPERIOR to the garbage the factories use, not to mention the greater thickness of the paint job. I could only hope I would be eligible for a warranty paint job! The one Buick "Riv" that had been repainted by the dealer was black. . that black paint job was better than any custom black laquer paint job I have ever seen! It looked like a black mirror! (at NO cost to the customer I might add, with a free "loaner" provided for the duration required). Quality preparation, quality materials and quality application are the key to an excellant paint job. I also might add that the dealership I refered to ("Riv" repaint) is very heavy into customer service, with an extremely high amount of repeat customers.

A little research prior to ordering a vehicle can make the difference in a better looking, longer lasting paint job. For example, it's been my experience that black or white on Dodge Rams have proven to (usually) be very well applied, long lasting, with fewer problems. GM on the other hand, has had a very long standing problem with black. Ford has had problems with their metallics, dating all the way back to at least the very first Mustangs although, I believe that problem has been corrected for the most part. . now if they could just correct their "orange peel" problem. I stay away from reds, as they fade terribly, ditto for yellows, both due to the increased amount of pigments required to "effectively" produce these colors. My experience has shown that "solid" colors (black, white, blue, green) will last longer than any of the metallics. DISCLAMER: I am not a painter, these are just my observations, formulated over a long period of time.

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'98. 5 2500 QC 4x4, (Black) SLT Sport, personalized license plate: BLCKOUT, ISB, LWB, 3. 54 LSD, A/T, 275 hp. injectors, Glasstite Vision II "canopy", Line-X bed liner, 285/75R16 BFG A/Ts on 16x8 M/T Challengers, Warn 4X Boards, Mopar fender flares, front and rear NW Custom stainless steel/rubber mud flaps, Mag-Hytec diff. cover and trans. pan, Edelbrock IAS shocks, VDO Vision gauges, PIAA Dual Sport 900 auxiliary lights and Super White bulbs, BD exhaust brake and TorqLoc, Prime-Loc fuel filter relocation kit, and Banks exhaust.

SVP of BOMB! heh,heh,heh

 

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After all the post on the St. Louis paint jobs I decided to check mine CAREFULLY.
I'm not a paint expert, but the job is flawless.
Not a blimish, scratch, bump or smear.
I can't tell how thick the paint is, time will tell that, but as far as I'm concerned, GREAT JOB St. Louis plant.

Ben

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2000 3500 Quad Cab, SLT+, LSD, 4x2 Auto, 3. 54, Camper Option, Trailer Option, Sports Option, Sliding Read Window, BLACK. With Power Bolt Tailgate Lock, Dodge Sill Guards.

 

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Just a comment based on john's input above. It's not really the percentage of DAMAGE, it's the percentage of the panels on the truck that have to be completely repainted to fix the TINY percentage of bad areas. As I'd posted previously, I really had to look to find the bad spots, other than the obvious mess on the right rear quarter. One single 1. 5mm spot on the hood = one complete hood repaint. That's a lot of square inches! Perhaps a 100% paint job would be the best I could get, but I'm satisfied for the time being with what my dealer came up with.

And I really do have no doubt that they will take care of the paint in the future if I ask them to. That's one of the main reasons I went with Meltons in the first place. You don't stay successful in a small town for over 50 years without taking good care of your customers - and having them come back to you when they buy their next vehicle...

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Y2K 2500 QC 4X4 Sport, black 3. 54 auto, every option but Cab Lights. Black brush/grille guard and bed rails (Dodge), black Westin nerfs. K&N air filter; Gauges on hand, ready for the A-pillar. More to come...

 

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Tulsa618, maybe I need to clarify what I meant by "approximately 50% of the vehicle" as it pertained to the warranty repaint of the Buick "Riv". The "Riv" exibited very small spot type defects such as you described, on about half the body panels, neccessitating complete panel repainting (in their assessment).

As the dealership does not use the exact same paint/clear coat the factory uses, the two panels will differ over time (especially with red, or silver and gold metallics).

I would AT THE VERY LEAST, have the problem documented in writing along with their proposed solution, AS WELL AS WHAT STEPS WILL BE TAKEN IN THEIR CONTINGENT PLAN THEY OFFERED YOU. You need something in writing to fall back on if their fix turns south. You paid a lot of money for your Ram, you should be given a first rate fix!

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'98. 5 2500 QC 4x4, (Black) SLT Sport, personalized license plate: BLCKOUT, ISB, LWB, 3. 54 LSD, A/T, 275 hp. injectors, Glasstite Vision II "canopy", Line-X bed liner, 285/75R16 BFG A/Ts on 16x8 M/T Challengers, Warn 4X Boards, Mopar fender flares, front and rear NW Custom stainless steel/rubber mud flaps, Mag-Hytec diff. cover and trans. pan, Edelbrock IAS shocks, VDO Vision gauges, PIAA Dual Sport 900 auxiliary lights and Super White bulbs, BD exhaust brake and TorqLoc, Prime-Loc fuel filter relocation kit, and Banks exhaust.

SVP of BOMB! heh,heh,heh

 

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Tulsa, I also deal with Melton`s in Claremore. The main reason is because if there is a problem with the Cummins they send the truck to Southern Plains Cummins for the warranty work. A person cannot complain about that.

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96 3/4 CC 5-speed,4x4,
anti-spin,tow,camper,3:54
B&W Turnover goose GY305r70 on Aluminum
Wheels
Brown MFG Heavy duty Front Bumper and I do mean Heavy Duty

 

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I'm with Bmann, mines 3 weeks old, Flame Red/silver and it's perfect. Sounds like St. Louis did at least TWO of them right!

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'00 2500, 4x4, QC, Cummins ETC/6spd, 3. 54, Camper, Trailer, SLT, 4ABS, Flame Red/Silver, Agate

 

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If it makes you guys fell any better - My uncle has been waiting over 4 months for a Ford Thunderbird and the dealer called him on Tuesday to tell him that it had finally came in but had to refuse shipment since the paint was so bad. I don't think he is going to reorder a thunderchicken this time. My Aunt is about to take his 93 Dodge 250 (yes with Cummins) away from him if he doesn't do something quick. Maybe I should talk him into buying a new Dodge and she can have his old one.

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99 2500, QC, SLT, 4x4 ISB, 5sp, 3. 55sld, Infiniti am/fm/cd, HDTcase, NW Running Boards and Mud flaps, Draw-Tite Front Mount Receiver Hitch, Tekonsha Brake Control, SRW and Husky Liners.

 

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Tulsa618,
You may have read a previous thread about my run in with some highway barricades and the need for a lot of new paint to repair the shrapnel damage all over my truck.

I got a lot of good advise from the folks on this board and especially from Sean, who is one of those fellows who has taken painting to a high art form and gets the big bucks for his work on Harleys.
I had the paint work done. Roof, hood, both front fenders, both rear panels and a door. This is damn near a new paint job. I am very happy, so far. The hood and roof were done under warranty due to small factory blemishes.

Some of the things I learned:
The factory paint job is not as great as we think. They use very little paint and a lot of clear coat to save money.

The clear coat scratches easily (in the west off roaders call it "desert pin stripping").

Properly applied a new paint job SHOULD be as good as a factory one as more paint and time are taken (person verses machine).

Putting tons of wax on your truck is detrimental to long life! The wax will seal the paint, burn and harm the paint... . yeah, I found this hard to believe as I am one of those guys who figures you can't wax enough. Every one from the painter to the paint shop told me this is true! The new paints and clear coats DON'T NEED IT! 3M Imperial Hand Glaze (or a similar product) was recommended to me. It has no silicones or wax and cleans the paint. Good carnuba wax can be applied AFTER cleaning with the glaze. Sean says he does this twice a year.

The guarantee on your truck is for 3 years. You can wait to have the re-paint done.
It may help to talk to the actual guy doing the job and offer him an incenitive to "watch over your baby"

My new paint looks as good as or better than the factory (Canada). I sure hope it holds up as well.

I hope this helps,
Ron


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'99 Quad Long Bed 4x4 5speed 3. 55 limited slip
Boulder City, Nevada

 

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John, Melton's has already assured me that I will have this thoroghly documented, including remediation available to me into the future. As scary as this whole thing has been, I felt like I could trust this dealer - and they certainly seem to be coming through. I'm sure I'll have some interesting reading on this when I pick up my truck next week.

And Ron Duncan, it was your thread about the close-encounters-of-the-guardrail-kind that I'd referred to in my original post on this subject. It was all the great responses you'd received that made me feel better about the possibility of having to have repainting done on my truck. Thanks!


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"Limited Edition" Y2K 2500 QC 4X4 Sport, black 3. 54 auto, EVERY option but Cab Lights. Black brush/grille guard and bed rails (Dodge), black Westin nerfs. K&N air filter; Gauges on hand, ready for the A-pillar. Kickaway Side Steps, Tailsafe and other security stuff, More to come...

 

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When I mentioned the quality of the dealer paint job, I was mainly talking about any future problems that might come up and how they would be handled. As far as the quality of my truck's paint job, I have seen some Maaco quickies that were better in the overspray department, but the overall job is not bad.
I do like the idea of what Scott did, with the warranty saying that he would get a new paint job when he wanted one. I would definitly go for that.

Dave

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94 3500 2wd E-brake, Less than 50,000 miles!! in beautiful, sunny, Sandbridge VA.

 

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I think some of us older farts think of a factory paint job as "baked on" or "electolysis" or something fancy that cannot be done in the shop.
They tell me the only difference is the factory does heat up the body to 180 degrees which the shop can not do.
Some things to check and be aware of before and after your paint job:
They hate to take off any rubber molding or chrome insignia stuff. On mine, I all ready removed all the Dodge chrome and decals but was concerned about the rubber moulding on the side. The guy wouldn't take it off unless I was willing to pay for new stuff. Being cheap I left it on and it came out great. If I wasn't paying for it I would want the mouldings and chrome stuff applied over the new paint.
Also check the finished job out real close. Rub your hand on it. If it feel "dry" it is probably over spray that was not buffed off proper. I had lots on mine and they took most of it off in a matter of minutes. It was also on the chrome bumpers and wheels.
I got some advise from Sean on how to buff the rest off but haven't had time yet.

Make them do it right!

Ron

 

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wow stlouis vs mexico???
my y2k has flawless red paint from st louis.
as i said before the dealer coordinated my replacement. they gave me a y2k for my 99
no charge for use and upgraded the truck and paid all taxes and title. yes they do do that.
i sent someone there today and they treated him the same way and he's getting a 2001.
dealer dealer people people they want repeat business. if your not satisfied with the dealer call detroit and then file the arbitration paper that's in the glove box and watch how fast the dealer responds. don't give in. i have owned and driven everything with wheels over the ##+ years. just don't give in dc has more money you and they can afford it.

 

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forgot to mention i bought a paint thickness gauge(a magnetic device)and went around measuring paint on everything from 99mbenz, volvos dodge truck and cars from early 80's
everyone had a thickness of 4 to 6 mil.
paint is just like a head, thicker isn't necessarily better. good luck

 

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If the paint is more than 6 mils thick, there a possiblity the truck has been repainted over old paint. If it is less than 4 mils, don't risk sanding. In fact, abrasive car polishes or buffing alone may cause the primer to show through.
Here's the key we used to determine your paint thickness with a magnetic gauge:
2 to 3 1/2 mils: at 2 mils, the primer is about to show through, and if it is clear coated, the clear coat is nearly gone. Even at 3 mils you would be well advised to be very careful with any polishing.
3-1/2 to 5-1/2 mils: Normal for most factory paint jobs.
5-1/2 to 7-1/2 mils: It still may be factory paint but on many cars or trucks paint that measures this thick indicates repainting has occured, probably to fix some shipment damage.
7-1/2 to 9-1/2 mils: Repainted but the finish may last if the vehicle is garaged.
9-1/2 to 12-1/2 mils: Three paint jobs at least!
Over 13 mils: Will crack,fade, or peel under constant exposure to the sun. No waythis is on a New truck, but a used is possible.
The source is Dupont for this info.
Any questions you have about paint I'll gladly try to answer.

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Bob in Sacramento
Y2K All Black 3500 ISB 4x4 4:10 LSD,Auto,QC,SLT Laramie, LB, Polished Stull Billet Grill & Fog inserts, Chrome Smitty Built Step Rails, Weatherguard 'Weekender' Ladder-rack,Rancho 9000's,Diamond Plate Tool Box, OEM U. R. Bedliner.
Fact:"The First Fords' had 'DODGE' Engines-The Last Fords' NEED THEM!"

 

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Robby,
I am no expert, but it is my understanding the mils measured on the cool little gauge show the thickness of the paint, bondo, primer, or what ever else is between the gauge and the actual metal of the vehicle.....
Are these gauges not usually used to detect bondo? I have used a borrowed one when buying a used car to detect body work. The guy I borrowed it from was a quality control guy who used it to make sure no excess bondo was used and to check OVERALL thickness... ... ...
Would lots of primer, paint and little clear coat show the same mils as little primer, little paint and a lot of clear coat?
Is paint better than clear coat?
I am not trying to be a smart ass, but would like to learn more... ... ...
Ron

 

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Not much has been said about the interiors of the St Louis rigs. While the fit and finish of mine is excellent, the agate colored interior came with a "tan" headliner and all the overhead plastic parts are tan as well. I checked at a local dealer and all the agate interiors appear to come with a light grey headliner. Anybody else get tan with agate? Is this a special deal when you order the Flame Red exterior?

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'00 2500, 4x4, QC, Cummins ETC/6spd, 3. 54, Camper, Trailer, SLT, 4ABS, Flame Red/Silver, Agate