Steering box support?

[CScranton]

Saw a install article in Diesel Power magazine for a steering box support kit by Sinister Diesel. Looked pretty simple and cheap, (about 170 dollars). I know others also make similar type support units. My 06 3500 DRW 4x4 is stock w/wheels and tires, suspension etc. It is used mostly for hauling and towing trailers. Would this be a good preventative measure against the dreaded death wooble? Currently the truck has no such issues @ 54K. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

 

[Prairie Dog]

I have no experience with DW but I tow a lot and the brace really tightens up the feel of the truck when towing - especially down hill for some reason.
I put on the BD brace when my truck only had about 40k on it and felt a difference immediate.
I don't think it would do anything for death wobble because that is caused by other suspension components and sometimes tires.

 

[Motorhead]

The steering box brace is a real good add on. Had one on my '07, 5.9 for 70,000 miles. Steering box is still real nice and tight.

 

[cerberusiam]

Won't do a thing for DW, that is not its function. The steering brace is to stop the twist in the frame where the steering box mounts that contributes to steering deflection. For the most part, the 3rd gen frames are a lot stiffer and really don't suffer from fame twist like the earlier models did, with a caveat. Larger tires, level\lift kits, rims with the wrong back spacing, rough offroading, etc, can put additional stress on the steering that may lead to excess deflection. Running stock tires and height with a good steering box there is no discernible difference I have been able to find with multiple boxes.

 

[KATOOM]

Steering box braces are to stop deflection on the steering box shaft connected to the pitman arm, not frame flex. Take a peek under your truck at where the pitman arm is connected to the steering box and then imagine the level of stress the shaft has to go through when turning the tires. That side deflection will eventually loosen the shaft and result in excessive play when you turn the wheel. Especially with larger tires.

SB braces arent meant to "tighten" anything up in the steering either as if it does then there's a problem with the steering box and/or other steering components. Braces are supposed to be "proactive" components, not "fixes".

 

[cerberusiam]

Steering box braces are to stop deflection on the steering box shaft connected to the pitman arm, not frame flex.

Nope, frame flex was the original problem the design addressed. The 3rd gens frames were strengthened so that was not an issue any longer.

A side effect was support for the sector shaft bearing which was under sized. Doesn't mean it would not wear, just means it takes longer for it to become obvious.

The advent of the updated box has all but eliminated the need for the steering brace at this point, the sector shaft and nearing is much larger to handle the stresses.

 

[KATOOM]

I dont agree. Frame flex was negligible. Otherwise there would be no reason for DOR to create their own version of the steering box brace which mounts to only one side of the frame. Not that I have one either but that its simply a good example to combat your position.

 

[jhenderson]

The reason for DOR or any mfg to build a product is to make money. Whether a problem is real or perceived is inconsequential. In my experience Cerb is correct. There was a big difference on my 1st and 2nd gens when I installed a plow frame. No connection to the steering shaft, just 3/8 plates and a push frame tieing the frame rails together right behind the bumper. Not as much difference on my 3rd gen and absolutely none on my 4th. All trucks had Boss plows mounted.

 

[GrantP]

I was always under the impression the purpose of the braces was to stabilize the sector shaft. Either way, I'd suggest to the OP to save their money for the upgraded steering box if/when the existing one wears out. I was not impressed with the steering brace on my 97, I was on my 4th power steering box (PSC and Borgeson) by the time I sold it with just under 200k on it. I'm not convinced it doesn't do more harm than good when the truck is used off road and the frame actually does twist. The brace may stiffen the frame somewhat but it can't eliminate all of the flex and the sector shaft now being tied to the frame through the brace may actually put more strain on it when the frame twists. I think the brace that only connects to only one side of the frame is probably a better design.

FWIW I experienced DW many times with the steering stabilizer installed, it won't prevent it. Other loose steering components are generally the cause.

 

[seafish]

I'm not convinced it doesn't do more harm than good when the truck is used off road and the frame actually does twist. The brace may stiffen the frame somewhat but it can't eliminate all of the flex and the sector shaft now being tied to the frame through the brace may actually put more strain on it when the frame twists. I think the brace that only connects to only one side of the frame is probably a better design.

I have always also felt the same way and wondered whether the addition of an SBS actually might be contributing to some of the many steering box failures/leaking that many experience on 3rd gen trucks due to the additional strain placed on the box from frame flex that seems to be loaded on the pinion arm and thus by extension to the steering box itself by the aftermarket support member. This is NOT to deny the inherent weakness of the oem steering box design, but simply to acknowledge the question of whether an SBS might be detrimental despite the other benefits of a stiffer and more responsive steering that it DOES seem to offer.

Also while I did choose to run the Thuren steering box support on my 2005 specifically since it uses a folded steel plate design (versus the box beam design of most other SBS) and I felt it allowed for same frame flex while still supporting the steering box, I also left it off when I upgraded to the newer, more robust Mopar steering box. And while I recognize that the DOR design was likely inherently better then other SBS designs in that it DOES allow for frame flex while still rigidly supporting the steering box (even more so then the Thuren plate one that I used, I would never risk buying anything from DOR due to their many and ongoing manufacturing and customer service problems.

FYI-- I generally do NOT talk about this on the forums since it is a controversial idea with really no real proof either way, but since this thread is already going that way, I though that I would throw in my two cents...lol.

 

[Prairie Dog]

From what I read years ago, the brace was originally intended to protect the steering sector from damage off road. It was only a happy accident that it also provided a handling improvement as well.
Mine has been on my truck most of its life and my steering box is still tight and dry at 102,000 miles.
If you haven't installed one on your truck you can't talk about its effects - which are dramatic under the right conditions.

 

[seafish]

From what I read years ago, the brace was originally intended to protect the steering sector from damage off road. It was only a happy accident that it also provided a handling improvement as well.
Mine has been on my truck most of its life and my steering box is still tight and dry at 102,000 miles.
If you haven't installed one on your truck you can't talk about its effects - which are dramatic under the right conditions.

I did install one (the Thuren SBS that I mentioned in my post above) on my 2005 at 30k miles and the effects on handling were indeed positive. Then my steering box started leaking at about 98k and I upgraded to the more robust Mopar (thankfully under warranty) and never felt the need to reinstall the SBS. I am NOT saying that here are no benefits to adding an SBS onto a 3rd gen, but certainly it is a fair and open question as to whether there are unknown detriments in addition to the benefits due to additional stress placed on an already under built oem steering box.

 

[Bob4x4]

The original came out of Canada,the purpose was to stop the sector shafts from breaking when you lost control and hit snowbanks.They do a good job of stopping hat long unsupported sector shaft from flexing.The downside is if the frame flexes it WILL pass that on to your steering box.It also blocks access to the belt from below-the best way to get the tensioner.,The new Mopar box has a beefy enough sector shaft there is not problem with flexing even running 37's

 

[cerberusiam]

Sorry guys, but, the original DSS was built with one goal in mind. Ancillary benefits were realized by supporting that long leverage point without a doubt. However, it was still developed primarily as a response to the deflection that occurred with that design in less than perfect conditions. You want to ram hard snow banks the sector shaft is usually the last thing to break, taking out tie rods and bending control arms is much more common before the box fails. Oh it will fail eventually but they drive like crap on goat trails until the cross bracing tightens it up. The 1st and 2nd gens were terrible for the frame flex, always had to fix them and\or build braces to keep things connected. Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.

DOR is nothing but a cheap imitation addressing something that is not an issue, another placebo mod with limited benefit. Trying to use it as example for cause is laughable.

I ran the brace for over 100k and still ate the bearings and the rack up in about 180k on the stock box, got 2 adjustments out of it and it was there FOR the sector shaft support as I could never find any frame flex to worry about. Even with the box and steering worn the difference of the support on or off was not worth mentioning. The 2nd gen flex was obvious where the 3rd gen is solid. Definitely not going to hurt to run one but they block access from the bottom pretty badly. Has to be dropped to do much of anything above it easily.

Direct quote from SSI web site:

The DSS, also known as the "Darin's Steering Stabilizer" is designed to eliminate steering wander in the Dodge Ram pickups. It does this by adding an additional bearing to the bottom of the steering box sector shaft and by adding an additional cross member tying the frame rails together eliminating frame flex. In other words, takes the slop out of your steering.

 

[GrantP]

I am NOT saying that here are no benefits to adding an SBS onto a 3rd gen, but certainly it is a fair and open question as to whether there are unknown detriments in addition to the benefits due to additional stress placed on an already under built oem steering box.

Well said....

 

[KATOOM]

Sorry guys, but, the original DSS was built with one goal in mind. Ancillary benefits were realized by supporting that long leverage point without a doubt. However, it was still developed primarily as a response to the deflection that occurred with that design in less than perfect conditions. You want to ram hard snow banks the sector shaft is usually the last thing to break, taking out tie rods and bending control arms is much more common before the box fails. Oh it will fail eventually but they drive like crap on goat trails until the cross bracing tightens it up. The 1st and 2nd gens were terrible for the frame flex, always had to fix them and\or build braces to keep things connected. Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.

DOR is nothing but a cheap imitation addressing something that is not an issue, another placebo mod with limited benefit. Trying to use it as example for cause is laughable.

I ran the brace for over 100k and still ate the bearings and the rack up in about 180k on the stock box, got 2 adjustments out of it and it was there FOR the sector shaft support as I could never find any frame flex to worry about. Even with the box and steering worn the difference of the support on or off was not worth mentioning. The 2nd gen flex was obvious where the 3rd gen is solid. Definitely not going to hurt to run one but they block access from the bottom pretty badly. Has to be dropped to do much of anything above it easily.

Direct quote from SSI web site:

The DSS, also known as the "Darin's Steering Stabilizer" is designed to eliminate steering wander in the Dodge Ram pickups. It does this by adding an additional bearing to the bottom of the steering box sector shaft and by adding an additional cross member tying the frame rails together eliminating frame flex. In other words, takes the slop out of your steering.

Downplaying DOR and calling it a placebo mod is irrelevant. And since you most likely aren't holding an automotive engineering degree nor were any part of the Dodge frame design.....your opinion is just as laughable and should be take with very little consideration. I'm certainly no support of DOR since I have none of their products, but if I owned that particular business I would have case reason for assessing your response more slanderous than not.

I also have to point out where you conflict your own opinions and position on the steering stabilizer as a whole and the idea of frame flex. Again, I'm not an advocate either way but just merely to point out.

 

[cerberusiam]

Downplaying DOR and calling it a placebo mod is irrelevant.

On the face of it, a lot more relevant than you trying to use DOR's production of a support as the paint brush to whitewash the problem with. You clearly stated that since DOR produced that piece it MUST follow that that is the only reason it was made in that form.

It would seem any conflicts you have are with SSI as they have pretty much cleared up the mystery, suggest you dog them for having a differing opinion and see how far you get.

 

[KATOOM]

I guess we shall agree to disagree.....

 

[cerberusiam]

Nope, you will continue disagree in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, I will continue not caring one way or another. Your issues seem to be with SSI and it is pretty clear what they think. Let's just have that again to make sure it is clear:

The DSS, also known as the "Darin's Steering Stabilizer" is designed to eliminate steering wander in the Dodge Ram pickups. It does this by adding an additional bearing to the bottom of the steering box sector shaft and by adding an additional cross member tying the frame rails together eliminating frame flex. In other words, takes the slop out of your steering.

 

[seafish]

I guess we shall agree to disagree.....

I am still trying to figure out what you are disagreeing with ??