2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission That infamous "CLUNK" in the steering wheel!

[rmrc]

Ya know,,,, I've searched these forums high and wide regarding that annoying "clunk", that evidently so many of us get at low speeds. You can feel it mainly through the steering wheel. God it's annoying!!!!!!!!



Well, I had the entire front end checked out by a very reputable alignment shop. I needed a lower right ball joint. That was replaced and still the clunk persists! No other front end parts show any need for replacement. The track bar is OK. Shocks have been checked. The intermediate steering shaft doesn't have any play in it. The truck doesn't wander and I have a DSS on order from Rip. An so on,,,,,.



By chance, do any of you have any other suggestions as to finding this noise/vibration?



It just makes the truck feel cheap having that loose feeling in the steering. How about wearing extremely padded foam gloves so you won't feel the vibration when holding the wheel??????



We have one fantastic engine,,,,, which, IMHO, is surrounded by an inferior shell!!! We definitely shouldn't have to deal with chronic problems as this crazy,,, clunking in the front end, in a supposed HEAVY DUTY TRUCK! This is an evident flaw in the design, among other annoyances that seem to plague these trucks! It's as if the truck slowly turns itself into a leach which slowly bleeds your wallet with continual problems that have you replacing various parts in an effort to chase the problem hoping that one of the new parts will finally correct the symptoms!!!



I really love this truck! Mainly because of the CUMMINS! I definitely cannot afford to buy a new one, so I'm destined to either continue to,,, chase these damn problems or raise the white flag an sell the truck, reverting back to my car that hasn't caused ANY problems what-so-ever!



To the Dodge engineering staff,,,,,,... . You s$%*! Go back to school and learn how to design properly!!!!!!!

 

[big barney]

I have the same problem. Just last week I also had the front end checked out. The tech told me everything is as tight as can be. I replaced my steering shaft about

1 1/2 years ago. It made the clunk less pronounced but I could still feel it a little bit. About a month ago the clunk feeling starting getting worse. There was a post in the DTR website about drilling a 1/8" hole on both sides on the shaft and installing little sheet metal screws. I think this might be my next step. Nothing to lose at this point. The front end on my truck absolutly sucks. I'm with you all the way on the quality on these things. The sad part about it is I really love my truck.

 

[jtisdale]

Other possibilities may include (but not limited to)...

bearings inside the column

loose steering column

the universal joint inside the tilt

the slip joint or the joint for the steering shaft

 

[cap-n-cray]

Something you might try.



Get under the front of the truck and have someone turn the steering wheel. Look at the ball joint on the top end of the track bar on the chassis. If it moves up and down it could be the problem. I have the clunk and found the ball joint on the track bar was moving up and down, but not all the time. It is intermittent. I am replacing the my '01 bar with a '03 bar and a bracket from DSS. I have not heard of any clunks with the newer trucks.



Cary

 

[rmrc]

Thanks for all of the possible things to check. I'll start this week.



Like others have also said, most, if not all of us really like these trucks! It's just so damn frustrating that Dodge "skimped" on so many areas with these trucks! Kinda gives Cummins a bad rap having a superior diesel in a body that just doesn't measure up in equal quality!

 

[dresslered]

Another thought that happens on occassion is that the Rancho 9000's come with the wrong bushings. Make sure that they are tight and not sliding around. I need to check mine as this 'clunk' has just started to happen to me as well. I recently just replaced the entire front end as well so I know everything is tight (track bar, ball joints, tie-rod ends, steering dampner, DSS).

 

[vssman]

... There was a post in the DTR website about drilling a 1/8" hole on both sides on the shaft and installing little sheet metal screws. I think this might be my next step. Nothing to lose at this point... QUOTE]



Be very careful. The steering intermediate shaft is has a collapsing feature in it to keep you from being poked in the chest with the steering wheel if you get in a crash.

 

[big barney]

I emailed the guy that suggested drilling the shaft. He told me to drill the outer shaft on both sides and use a 1/8" sheet metal screw to tighen against the inner shaft. Any impact at all I would think the shaft would still collapse. I'm going to try it this weekend.

 

[vssman]

BB,



I'm not trying to be a wise guy, but I work for the company that makes these things for DC. I'm responsible for manufacturing the 3rd gen shaft and can say that the littlest piece of scrap can cause the shaft to bind up solid. (read: I've seen it happen) The clearances are not much between the double "D" slider and tube. 2nd gen shafts are built here in service volumes only. Take it for what it's worth, but the I-shaft is a pretty important part. Make sure you think it through before you 'alter' it.



Just my $0. 02

 

[dresslered]

So vssman, I appreciate your insight to the issue, but is this really what we are hearing? What exactly has prematurely deteriorated in the assembly to cause this noise? If something has, I'm sure that it could be fixed properly and you guys would already have a remedy for the flaw. I am still going to check my shocks as this has been a past issue.

 

[DF5152]

its probably the slip shaft in the column what i did to fix mine was take a flat peice if metal stock 1/2"x 1/8". i made it long enough to bendt 2 short tabs on either end and hose clamped it above and below where the 2 shafts meet this should get rid of the problem and still allow the shaft to collapse in the event of an accident

 

[vssman]

The design of the 2nd gen i-shaft utilizes an outer tube that has been formed by pressing it into a die. The shaft that slips inside the tube is broached and then has plastic overmolded on it. Material thickness variation of the tube, shrinkage of the plastic, etc... gives the differences in "slop" - or lash. The slider has to move with less than a certain amount of force to allow for body flexing and not stress the rest of the steering components or firewall. Was it a poor design??? Well, that's the technology that was available at the time for what DCX wanted to pay for. The other weak links in the front end contribute to the loose feeling too, i. e. front end flex. Darrin's steering stabilizer helps that. The 3rd gen is a completely different design and uses a spline shaft/tube. Its much, much stiffer. Unfortunately due to the redesigned cab & column, it doesn't fit earlier model trucks.



I only chimed in about the sheet metal screws because I have personally seen shaft lock ups due to grit, etc... I can only imagine what would happen in an accident due to the steering box being WAY out in front.

 

[dresslered]

After re-reading the symptoms, my clunk sounds more like a loose shock absorber. My front end has been completely replaced, I have a new Rancho steering dampner, and a DSS. It is extremely tight! I definitely don't feel anything through the column.

 

[Andy Redmond]

Go wiggle your shocks are they floppy at the bottom? If so get Rancho to order you a smaller bushing to eliminate the chatter and clunk.



Worn track/new track bars will do this too.



Listen to VSSMAN, he has a good point!



Good luck

Andy

 

[RMarlar]

Hey guys, let me join in your frustrations with this problem. My '02 has been plagued with it for about 10,000 miles. I to have checked everything under the truck several times. Do y'all feel the clunk in your pedals as well? I have had the truck to two different dealers here and have had two service managers, three technicians, and two service writers drive it. None of them could feel it. They told me when it got more consistent to bring it back. Since I feel it everytime I drive it, I felt like that was consistent enough but maybe not. I have the RS5000 shocks, DSS, and Luke's links on track bar and pitman shaft tie rod end. Like y'all I'm in search of a fix and I will find it. I will keep a close eye on this thread and input any findings I come up with.



One more thing. I thought I found the answer when I noticed that the thick piece of rubber on the left motor mount was loose. I haven't had a chance to investigate further but the dealer told me that this piece being loose would not cause a problem and that it was merely "cosmetic". Has anyone seen this and investigated. Eventually I will remove the mount myself just to satisfy my mind.

Thanks guys!

 

[rmrc]

Two related ""Clunk"" Questions!!!!

Two questions related to the CLUNK.



1. How much play, if any, should there be in the intermediate shaft? When i grab it in the middle, I can feel it move back and forth slightly. Hardly a measureable amount but, I think, enough that it might be causing, or adding to the CLUNK symptoms.



2. How do you test your track bar to see if it needs to be replaced? The front end shop said that everything was OK. But I'd like to test some of the possible causes of the CLUNK for myself.



Thanks in advance!

 

[JGK]

rmrc,



First, I'll answer your second question. An easy way to test the track bar is to get under the front bumper and have someone work the steering wheel back and forth (engine off) while you watch the driver's side end of the bar. If it's shot, it will move in the direction of the centerline of the ball joint shaft. I believe the maximum movement is slightly over 2 mm. If it's more than that, it's due for replacement.



As for the other end, if it moves at all, it needs to be addressed (repaired/replaced).



Now for my issue. I, too, have been experiencing the "clunk". So this evening I reach in and grab the shaft and start wiggling to see what moves. As many of you have experienced, the center part inside the rubber boot where the two halves slide together is a little loose.



But I also noticed some movement at the u-joint end. Between the u-joint X and the end of the shaft itself is an assembly of at least 2 pieces that seem to be riveted together. When I wiggle the shaft I am seeing some play or movement between these 2 pieces. It's like the fasteners that hold them together are getting loose. Is this normal or is this contributing to the clunk? I've tried all evening to include an annotated picture but have had no success.



Thanks,

-Jay

 

[John - K5AWO]

Hey Jay,



Try this on your photo. make it smaller and see if that helps out...



http://www.showyourphotos.com/photoresizer_free.html

 

[JGK]

John,



Thanks for the link, and I'll look into it. I don't want to redirect this thread, but, in short, the picture seems to have some sort of incompatable internal format. I can size it properly, I just get some sort of cryptic error about an internal problem when I try to upload it. Its a JPEG file, which is quite common. I even used a freeware program recommended in the FAQ here to try to get it formatted correctly. No luck. Maybe I'll fiddle with it over the weekend.



Please PM me if you or anyone else has some recommendations, and I'll also provide more details of the issue.



Thanks,

-Jay

 

[JGK]

I think I have the picture thing worked out - at least a link to it in my reader's rigs.



Here's the annotated photo showing where I'm seeing play. Is play at the point indicated normal?



#ad




Thanks!

-Jay