The fear of the VP-44

[TORQUE THIS]

Why is it that we don't think twice about spending money on power enhancements, but when it's time to buy a VP-44, all the posts are full of...



Come on guys... it isn't that bad, is it

 

[MCummings]

I don't understand either.



I hear and see people spending $3,000 on a transsmission upgrade, and then 6 months later the VP44 is out and they are . What gives? It should always be less than $2,000 to R&R a VP44. I've got a spare in the garage. The nice thing about the VP44, is that most of the time, it fails slowly, so you have atleast a 1 week warning time before it heads for the '44 re-union in the sky.



It should be an expected upgrade/replacement after 50,000 miles, and every 50K after that. Just keep one on hand, or keep the funds set to the side for one.



Just my $. 02



Merrick Cummings Jr

 

[zachv]

Originally posted by MCummings

Just my $. 02

Actually, that is $. 04. That is what 50K miles divided into $2K comes out to. What that means is that we, as owners, should be happy (?) to put a nickle in the bank approximately every mile?? That is nuts! I am new to the CTD, but to expect to put $2K into a fuel pump every other year should not be acceptable . Definitely not expected ! Maybe I am off base, but is "everybody" having to do the VP44 that often? Is that only with mucho mods? I thought keeping a good LP in front of the VP44 makes the VP44 live much longer?? What is the deal?

 

[ToolManTimTaylor]

Heck I am not mad I am just dumbfounded that I didn't NEED one.

 

[FATCAT]

Why not upgrade ...

Instead of rebuilding or puting in a new VP44, upgrade and convert to a P7100 pump! Can't be too much more $$$, then you won't have to ever worry about it again!

 

[curatchko]

If this diesel needs a VP44 every 50k miles, then what we have here folks is a PIECE OF *****... . and I'd recommend selling the whole rig at 50...



That pump should go 500,000, not 50.

 

[MCummings]

Re: Why not upgrade ...

Originally posted by FATCAT

Instead of rebuilding or puting in a new VP44, upgrade and convert to a P7100 pump! Can't be too much more $$$, then you won't have to ever worry about it again!

The P-7100's aren't as strong as TDR makes them out to be,, neither is the Cummins motor. No doubt, both are very strong, but I know a couple people with trashed '7100's, and I have a cracked Cummins block in a 120,000 mile 24V sitting in my driveway right now.



I know of trucks at 125,000 miles that have the original LP, and Injection pump. It's not always you will have to replace it, but, might as well be prepared. I would rather have $1,800 set aside for 120,000 miles, then be trying to scrape up, and pawning stuff off to replace the pump at 50,000 miles.



Also, remember, that if you don't BOMB your truck, you have a 100,000 mile warrenty, which covers LP's, and Injection pumps.



Merrick Cummings Jr

 

[MCummings]

Originally posted by MCummings

and every 50K after that. Just keep one on hand, or keep the funds set to the side for one.

I think I was a little harsh. maybe not every 50K after that, but atleast be prepared.

My truck lost a VP44 at 75K, but was most likely caused by a dead lift pump. I don't know when the LP dies, the truck didn't have gauges, but a few miles afrer a new LP, the VP44 died, and warrenty covered both LP, and Injection pump.



Merrick Cummings Jr

 

[Ray Torresdal]

harsh?

I think you're being a little harsh - 137,000 miles on mine, 100,000 with VA box. Fuel pressure gauge lets me monitor the lift pump, and I'm on #3, but with good lift pump in place, the VP-44 is good for far more than 50,000 miles! For those who "need" 350-400 hp. and more, all bets are off!



Ray

 

[TORQUE THIS]

Does it really matter how long it lasts... nothing lasts forever!



They fail on stock trucks and BOMB'ed trucks.



For the guys w/ the auto trannies, they fail, you get them rebuilt, very few I see complain about upgrading the transmission. The biggest problem is who's transmission are you gonna go with. The same for the manual trannies also.



Injectors, dropping $500 or so, and another $500+ for a fueling box, no one thinks twice about it... It adds more power and makes it much more fun to drive.



Now that you have more power, you need more air. So, you drop $700+ for a new turbo and air filter set-up.



Now that you have $5000+ in toys, and the heart of the motor fails, it seems like the end of the world for most, and then it's

 

[Big_Daddy_T]

Maybe its because when it fails you are installing the same thing in its place. Its not an upgrade. You feel better when you believe the one you are replacing it with is superior to the one that failed. Thats why its so easy to upgrade. The truck just runs better. I love upgrading and hate maintanence. Id rather install another guage than buy another lift pump.

 

[curatchko]

Originally posted by TORQUE THIS





Now that you have $5000+ in toys, and the heart of the motor fails, it seems like the end of the world for most, and then it's

There's a big difference here though.



When we Bomb, it's our choice, and it's not because the truck won't run.



When we 'maintenance' it's because something has or is failing and now it's not a choice, it's a requirement to drive the truck again.



If I spend big bucks on my truck I want it to be because I had the extra money to do so, not because I bought a garbage truck that won't last.



What's more is that people say how great this engine is and that it will last forever. But, they will only last forever if you replace the Lift pump every 50k for 150 bucks, the Injection pump every 75k for a 2000 bucks, replace the exhaust manifold every 100k due to cracking, pray that the block doesn't crack, and a host of other issues. This is really not a good record for an engine in general, especially if you're making payments on it.



Chris

 

[ToolManTimTaylor]

Not for anything the Dodge cummins combo PALES in compairison in terms of failure rates , down time , and even lemon costs when put against the other brands. Yes there are a few problems like there have been mentioned above however there are just a FEW complaints as you mentioned a few above when you look at the 1,000,000 cummins equiped rams that are floating arround out there.



There are what 16,990 members on board here that maybe 8,000 post. Out of that 8,000 maybee 2,000 have posted problems weather they even are failures or not like the above. So maybee 250 cracked blocks (i see that as the biggest worry) and 700 cracked manifolds (Minor as the manifold is cheap) and not every lp , Vp is bad. There are tons of guys that have well over 100K on the VP. Many have over 200K and have their stock VP.

 

[78repowerwagon]

I have 187000 on my original and have a fueling box on it as well. When the VP does go out I will gladly replace it with another VP.



I tow alot at about 350 HP with minimal smoke and can unhook and turn everything up with the use of electronics and be playing with 500HP wooping ricers or ???.



Install a P pump for reliabilty reasons then tune it to make 500HP and be prepared to have soot all over anything you hook to.



I bet the furd guys would like to have a VP, they need propane to get past 400HP.

 

[Morphious]

here's my take on the VP. I currently have well over 160k miles on my original one. My stock lift pump was out somewhere before 60k miles, but I will never know how long I ran with it out since i didn't have any guages. I installed guages at 60k, along with DDIII's, a TTPM, 4" exhaust and a better clutch. When I realized I had no fuel pressure, I took it upon myself to remove the crappy design of the stock lift pump, and installed a Mallory back by the tank. With the Mallory, I ran SS braided line from the mallory to the fuel pump with all aeroquip fittings, and also went from the fuel pump on to the injection pump. Now when my mallory went out 6 months later (Driving 10k miles a month puts alot of wear on it). I replaced it with another mallory, and was thinking that this wasn't going to cut it with replacing a 200+ dollar fuel pump every six months. So I tore apart the electronics side of the pump and figured out that the brushes were out of it. I found out that I could get brushes for 15. 00 at the parts store, so now I just keep a spare set of brushes in the glove box, and when the pump starts acting up, I replace them.



Now, due to the morons at the parts store, I wasn't able to get a replacement set of brushes the last time they went out, and then basically forgot about it. In July, I took a trip with the boys to Knoxville, and the mallory went out on my about 9pm in the mountians of North Carolina. Now all the parts stores were closed, and I was trying to figure out what to do to get the truck on to knoxville. I ended up pulling the pump part of the fuel pump out, closing it back up and driving the 100 miles on to knoxville, using the injection pump to suck fuel from the tank.



Now, to me, this doesn't make the VP44 weak, as it hasn't let me down. Why am I saying 160k+ miles, well the sensor went out on my a couple of years ago and took me six months to get around to repair it, plus I've run bigger tires since about 20k miles or so.





Now what has me wondering is why noone hasn't designed a cam ring for the vp44.



Morph.

 

[Pit Bull]

Originally posted by zachv

Actually, that is $. 04. That is what 50K miles divided into $2K comes out to. What that means is that we, as owners, should be happy (?) to put a nickle in the bank approximately every mile?? That is nuts! I am new to the CTD, but to expect to put $2K into a fuel pump every other year should not be acceptable . Definitely not expected ! Maybe I am off base, but is "everybody" having to do the VP44 that often? Is that only with mucho mods? I thought keeping a good LP in front of the VP44 makes the VP44 live much longer?? What is the deal?

Don't drink the Kool aid. It's not that bad. Kind of works like this. If your out of work it's a depression. If your neighbor is out of work it's a recession. If the guy 5 miles away is out of work the economy is great. Your on a web site with people that think more about their trucks then their own kids. You will notice that things get blown out of proportion.



That is unless your VP-44 bites the dust then you will be mad unless it's still under warranty.

 

[MCummings]

Originally posted by ToolManTimTaylor

Not for anything the Dodge cummins combo PALES in compairison in terms of failure rates , down time , and even lemon costs when put against the other brands. Yes there are a few problems like there have been mentioned above however there are just a FEW complaints as you mentioned a few above when you look at the 1,000,000 cummins equiped rams that are floating arround out there.



There are what 16,990 members on board here that maybe 8,000 post. Out of that 8,000 maybee 2,000 have posted problems weather they even are failures or not like the above. So maybee 250 cracked blocks (i see that as the biggest worry) and 700 cracked manifolds (Minor as the manifold is cheap) and not every lp , Vp is bad. There are tons of guys that have well over 100K on the VP. Many have over 200K and have their stock VP.

I couldn't agree with TMTT more. We have no leaky injectors, no "dead pedal", no idle romp, no cackle, and no glow plugs .



If you are under 100K, the warrenty will pick it up, unless you modify your truck. I guess the background I come from is from a truck I have modified to run twice it's rated power. $. 04/mile is nill in comparison to money I have spent on my trucks making them faster, My trip to Thunder in Muncie cost me about $3. 00/mile, not including fuel, and I drove about 2,000 miles round trip. My reality is much different than others on this board, and by no means are my trucks, or me, "Main stream".



One thing I do know about the Cummins,, The weaknesses are known. Isn't it nice to know that an injection pump failure is on the "might-happen-soon" list,, compared to a Duramax, or PowerStroke, where you have to have the tow truck on speed dial, because anything could break at anytime?



I feel the Cummins is the most problem free motor on the market. It is way overbuilt, and that might even be a slight downfall in the long run, when it starts wearing out suspension components from the weight, and you have to park a good motor when the outside of the truck falls apart. But, it is nearly an unstoppable machine, and when it does stop,, Most DIY'ers can fix it in the driveway.



That' s my take on it. (I was scared to say $. 02 )

Merrick Cummings Jr