The Last Good Year For OTR Truck Engines?

[RHestand]

Just for fun and curiosity, I've been shopping for a used Class 8 OTR truck.

From what I've read, it seems that about 2003 the Feds. raised the smog control requirements on these trucks, but I'm not sure about the year, and or what was changed or effected.

It's possible I could be in the market for a truck like this in the near future, and would like to concentrate on the latest model without all the added smog equip.

You current and former OTR guys have been very helpfull with all your ideas, opinions, and info. in responding to all my questions from my previous threads regarding OTR stuff. So if you can help me with these questions I would be forever grateful.

Thanks again,

Ray

 

[TAbbott]

The last good year for the engines was 2001. 2002 was the year the first EGR systems were mandated and things have gone downhill since, especially in regard to fuel mileage. The 20% burned exhaust gas component of the intake air charge started with those EGR engines (It increased in 2004 and then again in 2007 so its now approximately 40% "dead" air in the intake charge. ) The timing was also retarded quite a bit in 2002 and later years in order to control NOX, and heating problems, reduced fuel economy, and increased maintenance was the result.

 

[Wayne M.]

We just got some '08 Macks with the MP7 (Volvo) engines. I can't believe what is happening!

Watching from the sidelines, I think Cummins (all things TDR aside) and Detroit in the heavy market have emissions well in hand and offer good support. After that, whatever truck you can find is up to you.

 

[chuckwilson]

Thats easy, the three best are the N14 Cummins, the Series 60 Detroit (DDEC III) & the 3406B Cat, After that the emisions killed them!!!!!!

 

[MOates]

The last good year for the engines was 2001. 2002 was the year the first EGR systems were mandated and things have gone downhill since, especially in regard to fuel mileage. The 20% burned exhaust gas component of the intake air charge started with those EGR engines (It increased in 2004 and then again in 2007 so its now approximately 40% "dead" air in the intake charge. ) The timing was also retarded quite a bit in 2002 and later years in order to control NOX, and heating problems, reduced fuel economy, and increased maintenance was the result.

I work for Freightliner. What he said above.

 

[Ncostello]

From what the local Cat equipment dealership is saying... naturally... is that Cat Acert is going to be the thing that eventually works and brings the engines into compliance without all the EGR and DPF stuff we're seeing now. Supposedly Cat is investing heavily in this technology to make it the end all. Its their belief that EGR's and such are bandaids that don't address the source of the problem but rather the effects. They are targeting the source. Not my opinion... just someone elses.



What is ACERT anyhow?

 

[MOates]

From what the local Cat equipment dealership is saying... naturally... is that Cat Acert is going to be the thing that eventually works and brings the engines into compliance without all the EGR and DPF stuff we're seeing now. Supposedly Cat is investing heavily in this technology to make it the end all. Its their belief that EGR's and such are bandaids that don't address the source of the problem but rather the effects. They are targeting the source. Not my opinion... just someone elses.



What is ACERT anyhow?

Basically, it's an acronymn for their system of reducing emissions by controlling combustion inside the cylinder, instead of relying on the "band-aids" (and in that sense I agree with them) of EGR and DPF's.



Probably something similar to what's being tried on smaller diesels I've read about, using combination piezo injectors/pressure sensors to control each individual combustion event, both for better efficiency and lower emissions.



I've heard from more than one source that if the EPA would allow them to tune for max combustion efficiency (and not based on NOX production), soot would virtually be reduced to zero and they could easily aftertreat for NOX at that point without DPF's.



If you have to go for one of the '07 trucks, look at going with a Cat. On their EGR setup, which they call CGI (Cooled Gas Ingestion), the EGR return to the engine taps off DOWNSTREAM of the DPF - ie, dramatic reduction in soot sucked back into the engine, which means less frequent oil changes and longer engine life.



On the company flyer we got at work concerning the new DDC15 engine, they're planning on using urea injection to meet 2010 standards. According to that, that will allow them to reduce (but not eliminate) the use of EGR, and you'll still have DPF's as well. That's why they're saying they'll be able to bump fuel economy back up - less EGR.

 

[RHestand]

Thanks for all the info. everyone.

Re: the 01 and older trucks, most all of them I've looked at have close to or more than a million miles on them. At what point is the eng; trans; rear-ends,king-pins, steering etc. worn out?

My concern is reliability and not being able to stay ahead of break downs, and large tow-bills, etc.

What would be your thoughts about buying a truck with this kind of mileage, even if it had a recent eng. rebuild, what about the other stuff?

More info. on this would be much appreciated.

As a side note, on current smog control systems,DPF, etc.

I recently read a short article about Honda having developed a small ultra clean turbo diesel (not in production yet) that meets all the 2010 CARB requirements, and does not use EGR, DPF, or urea injection.

It will be interesting to watch this technology develope.

Thanks again for any more info. about high miles on these trucks.

Ray

 

[Ncostello]

Don't know what kind of hauling or miles you plan on... but to me 500,000 miles is the max I'd get used so at least I could get some life out of it before the major overhauls started. If were taken care of up to that point... and you took REAL good care of it after that... you might go beyond 1M miles and keep going. But expect clutches, ujoints, wheel bearings etc to need replaced upon inspection. The engine might be fine... but what I call "comsumables" wear no matter what. If the wheel's a spinnin... the bearings are wearing.

 

[MOates]

Whichever truck you choose, best wishes and good luck to you friend. Not an easy life for a trucker right now, with the economy in the crapper and fuel prices thru the roof. Just hope everything ends up working out for you.



If you ever end up passing a white Jeep Liberty diesel with NC plates, an "Abernethy CJD" tire cover, and a TDR sticker in the rear window, that'll be me.

 

[midlife crisis]

Cruising the ads in the latest "Truck Shopper", I notice some ads that you might be interested in. There are some Fleets selling off inventory (National Freight & Ryder) just to name 2.

Whats most interesting is they are claiming not only fleet maintained, but the service histories are available.

Appears to be dozens of every flavor.

Rather than buying a pig-in-a-poke, I would have to imagine these are at least getting good maintenance-regardless of how the drivers are treating them.

Good Luck--

 

[dclassens]

My vote... N14 and Series 60. Long running, high mileage engines.



Dave

 

[E7mack96]

In my fleet, we are running N14 "red heads" they are 525 hp, and are running good. We are in the 800-900 K range in miles. They have needed fan clutches in the past few months, and an injector here and there. ( these are 1999-2001 models ) The only road problems we've had, ever, are tires. Knock on wood!