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The Truth About Filters – Finally

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Prime-Lok question

Since we started selling filters online, and I’ve tuned myself more into the filters market than ever before, I’ve been amazed at what I’ve read on the internet and in forums. Many of them have been about how Purolator makes MotorCraft, how Wix makes MotorCraft, how FleetGuard makes Wix, and even how nobody makes anything – that all filters are bought from one of three German companies. The last one is just plain insane – Wix, Purolator, FleetGuard, Baldwin, Fram, etc all have manufacturing facilities. Clearly they all make their own filters.



So I called Racor, Purolator, and Wix yesterday and talked to some techs about the filter business; here’s the truth confirmed by each company separately.



All filters are a hodge-podge: Wix, Purolator, Baldwin, Donaldson, FleetGuard, and Racor make their own filters, but they also buy filters from each other and box them under their own names.



Note 1: MotorCraft will buy from Purolator and box them as MC, but MC will also buy from Baldwin, Donaldson, etc. and do the same. Purolator admitted that occasionally they will close a plant and allow MotorCraft to come to their facilities and use Purolator’s equipment to make MC filters using MC employees. But MC will also buy filters from Donaldson, Baldwin, Wix, and FleetGuard and repackage them as MC. ACDelco and Mopar do the same as MotorCraft (well, AC doesn’t make anything anymore – they’re simply a re-boxer). With either MC, AC, or Mopar, there is no consistency to what filter you’re getting.



Note 2: Wix will buy filters from Baldwin, Donaldson, FleetGuard, etc. and label them Wix and put them in Wix boxes. Donaldson does the same. Baldwin does the same. FleetGuard does the same. Purolator does the same. They all mix and match from each other – they do this because each company wants a complete line of filters, and sometimes it’s more cost effective to buy from your competition than it is to make your own (such as if a re-tooling is necessary for a particular filter, or if there’s a patent on a particular filter-design). The only companies that do this type of trading are the ones that meet or exceed Original Equipment (OE) specs. They will not do this with companies that are not OE spec – Wix and Purolator said they would not and do not buy from Fram or others that are deemed non-OE.



Note 3: It is extremely possible that you could buy two filters with the same part number from the same manufacturer, and those filters may not be identical because they were made by two different companies. True for Baldwin, true for Wix, true for FleetGuard, true for Donaldson, true for Purolator. In today’s filter industry, all the filters are being shared and relabeled as their own so that company can offer a more complete line to their customers.



True, you could love Baldwin because you like the way their paper media is molded, or you could like Donaldson because their ratings for micron filtration are higher than another – but you might still end up with a Baldwin filter in a Donaldson box. In other words, you can love a certain brand, but you may not be getting that brand in the box you buy. It happens all the time in the industry, but it’s all at least OE-spec – they’re all quality filters.





PS – Feel free to call Purolator, Wix, MotorCraft, Baldwin, or any other and ask them what I asked them. They all have Tech Support numbers listed on their websites – that’s how I got their numbers. I found the techs were a joy to talk to and very honest about their industry.
 
Wait till the fleetgaurd support team gets on this thread... The funny thing is, most OIL is the same as well. Yet, you will get guys who are experts, but have never heated a test tube. I found out about gasoline back in the early 90's. In San Jose, CA there is a local fuel distribution point, and all the different Trucks where filling up from the same tank. Chevron, 76, Shell and Rotten Robbie, THE SAME tank. I guess, they ad the additives to the tanker truck, or at the station, or there is some false advertising going on.
 
Heavyweight said:
Wait till the fleetgaurd support team gets on this thread... The funny thing is, most OIL is the same as well. Yet, you will get guys who are experts, but have never heated a test tube. I found out about gasoline back in the early 90's. In San Jose, CA there is a local fuel distribution point, and all the different Trucks where filling up from the same tank. Chevron, 76, Shell and Rotten Robbie, THE SAME tank. I guess, they ad the additives to the tanker truck, or at the station, or there is some false advertising going on.



Yup

Our piping and distribution systems here in So Ca are fully integrated with the other majors.



Mac

ConocoPhillips

Los Angeles
 
If you buy a Fuel Water Seperator for a Cummins ISC 8. 3L engine from Napa... it will be labeled Napa Gold. Look at the fine print on the filter and you'll see WIX. Look even closer and you'll see "Stratapore Inside" and the Stratapore Logo on the side.



I called Napa Filter Hotline (got the number from the local store) and they confirmed that their (Wix's) blueprint of this filter does show that its a Fleetguard. So I always felt comfortable using a Napa Gold/WIX/Fleetguard equivalent when I couldn't wait for my Fleetguard FS1022.



The deal here was that the fuel filtration spec for the Cummins CAPS injection pump is so stringent... . most just rebadge the OEM filter to avoid any problems with warranty etc. I believe its a 2 micron filter. Easier and cheaper to rebadge than develop an equivalent to the FS1022.
 
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My only question is about Motorcraft FL1A's (used in inline6 and most any Ford V8 from years gone by). If you buy the equivalent in a Purolator, Wix, Fram, Fleetguard or whatever... you'll notice slight differences in hole diameters, gaskets, or whatever.



In my course of changing tons and tons of FL1A's they always appeared identical. Ford uses little oval holes instead of normal round ones. So if they are buying from a mix of manufactures... then they are buying according to their exact specs and not simply painting the standard equivalent white and printing MotorCraft on the side.
 
"Wait till the fleetgaurd support team gets on this thread... The funny thing is, most OIL is the same as well. "



While BASE STOCKS of many oils and gasolines very well MIGHT come from the same source, it's the additive packages that set one apart from another. And while *I* certainly haven't "heated a test tube", I *have* closely followed enough virgin oil samples of various oil brands, including synthetics - to see clear evidence of significant differences in content of the final product.
 
BSchneider I'm glad you posted this. It was very interesting and I'm glad to have come across this thread. Maybe this will shut up some of the Fleetguard blow-hards that float around on this site. :rolleyes:



Also appreciate your honesty being that you solely a Wix dealer. ;)
 
Gary, apples to apples, dino oil to dino oil. Not synthetic.

How much of a difference between Delo, Delvac & Rotella? Hint, 99. 9% identicle. Additive package, very good marketing. They call it "X", the other calls it "Y". The bottome line, they both result "Z".
 
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Heavyweight said:
Gary, apples to apples, dino oil to dino oil. Not synthetic.

How much of a difference between Delo, Delvac & Rotella? Hint, 99. 9% identicle. Additive package, very good marketing. They call it "X", the other calls it "Y". The bottome line, they both result "Z".



"How much of a difference between Delvac, Delo and Rotella?"



OH, about THIS much:



Wear metals:



Delvac---Delo---Rotella



Copper---0--- 2---0

Iron---2---0---1

Silver---1---0---0

Lead---1---0---0

Tin---3---0---0



NOW, the additive package:



Silicon---5---8---2

Potasium---1---10---0

Moly---3---198---0

Boron---58---118---0

Calcium---2145---3198---1326

Phos---1074---1238---1326

Zinc---1204---1295---1499



NOW, I suppose the critics will pooh-pooh the above info, taken from the "Bob is the oil guy" website, but there actually ARE pretty significant differences in the modern additive packages between the 3 above virgin oil samples - and this IS "Apples to Apples"!



Other oil brands display similar significant analysis variations - some quite dramatic in various additive categories!



"99. 9% identical"? NOT by a long shot! ;)



Face it, the largest differences between modern oils IS the additive package, and the results derived from those additives. And assuming a general basic similarity between the BASE stocks, I have no problem choosing MY oil brand based upon the additive package *I* prefer...



Now, does someone REALLY want to step up and claim there's no significant difference between the above 3 samples - OR that the difference is unimportant? :D :D



IF so, YOU are free to go ahead and make YOUR oil purchases - as well as fuel and filters - totally blindfolded. Meanwhile *I* will stick with Fleetguard filters and Delo 400 15/40...
 
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Are you there to measure? So if I buy Walgreens label asprin, how much different then bayer? Besides, all the oil manufacturers have updated their formula in the past year. Those trace metals will not hurt or reduce wear any faster between the brands. If changed proplerly they will all perform within 99. 9% of each other. We can agree to disagree. :D



Since you run Delo 400, I will run Delvac 1300. Keep me posted, and hopefully in 10 years we can compare notes. Also, I will run a K&N Oil Filter.
 
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Gary - K7GLD said:
"How much of a difference between Delvac, Delo and Rotella?"



OH, about THIS much:



Wear metals:



Delvac---Delo---Rotella



Copper---0--- 2---0

Iron---2---0---1

Silver---1---0---0

Lead---1---0---0

Tin---3---0---0



NOW, the additive package:



Silicon---5---8---2

Potasium---1---10---0

Moly---3---198---0

Boron---58---118---0

Calcium---2145---3198---1326

Phos---1074---1238---1326

Zinc---1204---1295---1499



NOW, I suppose the critics will pooh-pooh the above info, taken from the "Bob is the oil guy" website, but there actually ARE pretty significant differences in the modern additive packages between the 3 above virgin oil samples - and this IS "Apples to Apples"!



Other oil brands display similar significant analysis variations - some quite dramatic in various additive categories!



"99. 9% identical"? NOT by a long shot! ;)



Face it, the largest differences between modern oils IS the additive package, and the results derived from those additives. And assuming a general basic similarity between the BASE stocks, I have no problem choosing MY oil brand based upon the additive package *I* prefer...



Now, does someone REALLY want to step up and claim there's no significant difference between the above 3 samples - OR that the difference is unimportant? :D :D



IF so, YOU are free to go ahead and make YOUR oil purchases - as well as fuel and filters - totally blindfolded. Meanwhile *I* will stick with Fleetguard filters and Delo 400 15/40...
I have to BACK Gary on this one! There are very BIG differences in additive packages,as well as base stocks!



Wayne

amsoilman
 
I'm not sure how we got off on oil here when we started talking about filters, but I agree with Gary in the fact that there are "significant" differences in additive packages in oil. But do I think one oil is way better than another? No, I think any quality oil brand will do just as well as the other if changed properly. Oil is really a matter of preference, I always use Rotella T but it's not because I think Delo 400 or anything else is inferior.



With that said, the filters are a totally different story. It's now known that filter manufacturers often repackage other brands - but no one said that oil companies bottle each other's oil. So yes, it is comparing apples to oranges in that sense.



There are no "additives" in an oil filter and to say that you'll only use a certain brand of filter because oil companies put different additives in their oil doesn't make sense. All that was said here is people repackage oil filters. No one said that oil companies rebottle oil.
 
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