underboost code with new charger

[Mike B.]

For those who own an 06 truck AND have installed a larger turbo charger I have a question.

What did you do with the electronic waste gate gizmo from the stock charger? Last weekend I installed an Edge BB turbo and I decided to just zip tie it out of the way. I didn't have any problems until a few days later. Twice now I set a code for "super charger under boost". As near as I can tell the code was set just after start up or as soon as I started to pull out of my driveway. The computer completely de-fuels the engine so it makes no power at all. You can floor the truck and 25 mph is all it will muster. Shutting down and restarting doesn't help at all. Of course I keep my scan tool in the back seat for just such an occasion. Once the code is cleared the power is back.



This has happened twice since I installed the turbo. Once after sitting over night and once after sitting for 30 minutes. At first I thought something was wrong with the turbo but now I'm' thinking it has to do with "electronic waste gate gizmo.



So, what exactly is that thing on the front of the stock charger for? I know it's some sort of boost sensor but for what? does it need to be grounded??



thanks



Mike

 

[rjohnson916]

Mike unfortunately I don't have an answer for you in this dept, but I am keeping an eye on this topic as I am interested in the Turbo set/up you've got and would like to know what the fix is for this issue. I hope someone will chime in soon withthe answer.



Good Luck



-Ryan

 

[jwilliams3]

There is no fix for this problem as of yet.

This started with aftermarket turbo's on 2004. 5 and up trucks (the ones with the command valve wastegate).

 

[RCC]

I have seen this occur after a twins install on a 06. I cant remember what fixed it , but I seem to think it had something to do with the boost fooling built into the tst. You might contact www.relentlessdiesel.com , Chris found the problem and fixed it on one of his customers trucks.

 

[Mike B.]

I'll give them a call tomorrow as well as Diesel Dynamics.



thanks for the help.



Does this happen on all of the 600 engines or is it one of those hit or miss issues?



Other than this issue the tubo rocks.



Mike

 

[Mike B.]

Update:

I spoke with keith at DD about this issue. In the past two years he has seen this problem twice. Mine being the second. The first one was an 05 running and Edge module. The fix for this truck was changing over to a TST box. I guess that wasn't the real problem because I'm already running a TST pmcr. I've sent the entire PMCR back to TST to be checked out. I'm also having them install the twins program , adjustable timing and the cool down timer.



For now the truck is stock again (other than the turbo) so if I still have a problem I'll know it's not the TST.



I still don't know what the boost sensor on the turbo did. I have a feeling I will have to plumb that to the turbo so it will see some psi. I'll have to rig up some adapters and some hose to hook it up. I'm going to drive for a while like it is for and see what happens.



Mike

 

[WUnderwood]

definately keep us updated on what happens with your truck

 

[KLockliear]

Mike, here's Bills' original thread: https://www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/showthread.php?t=134319



Looks like, in the end, the code that was putting the truck into limp wasn't actually being cleared, just placated to get it out of limp mode. He bought a BDPP which has code clearing capability in it, cleared the code and didn't have any more problems (that he reported). Take a read of that thread.

 

[chrleb1]

We have started to have this problem on my brothers 06. I think the reason why is the wastegate control. We took the solenoid out of the stock turbo and plugged it in and tied it off to the side. The truck went into limp mode when that code came up. Once we cleared the code it would run very hard. The triple dogs will clear trouble codes. I'm not sure if the solenoid is a sensor too. We will find out shortly though.

 

[BILLUA]

It was me

Update:

I spoke with Keith at DD about this issue. In the past two years he has seen this problem twice. Mine being the second. The first one was an 05 running and Edge module. The fix for this truck was changing over to a TST box.



Mike

I am that person... I got one of the first BB chargers and got about 90 miles into a 500 mile road trip when I got the Check engine/ defuel crap. . Anyway, It was an unknown, I go to the dealer and naturally get the jerk service manager and mechanic that tell me I will blow this engine with this turbo...



My reply to them was "Just reset the code"... Anway, about every 90 miles I got the light. . The only way I found to reset it without the scan tool was to restart the truck 40 times. . Yes, 40 times and then the limp mode would reset... I naturally was on the phone with EDGE and they were great about changing out my box etc... that was no fix. . I sold it and got the TST...



Now, I also bought a Bully Dog Power pup in the mean time to reset the code.....



With the TST box, I had this issue come up 1 more in 20,000 miles...



I honestly feel that the 05 electronic waste gate caught Edge off guard...



Maybe the code in the 06 is not quite figured out yet either...



Just keep the scanner handy and have fun!



Cheers, Bill

 

[Mike B.]

Billua,



Did you ever try plumbing a little pressure to the sensor you removed from the oem turbo? If it happens again with or without the TST that's what I'm going to do. It's going to be a PIA so I am not in any hurry to do it. I though about welding a nut to the air tube leading to the intercooler and installing the sensor.



Do you know what that sensor really does? From looking at and the waste gate I don't see how the waste gate is electronically controlled. It may be that sensors sole job to defuel the truck for lack of boost. know I just ******* in the wind here but it's something to think about.





Have you spoken with Mark at TST about this?



edit:

Just read your thread on this issue. Did you ever plumb the sensor like you mentioned?

FWIW, I now have 250 miles the truck since removing the TST with no codes. I am using an Actron model whatever to clear the codes.





Mike

 

[KLockliear]

Mike, how much boost does the truck make without the TST? Perhaps not enough to upset the ECM?

 

[Mike B.]

Keith, that's a good question but I haven't installed a manual gauge yet. The display on the TST (before I removed it) showed mid to upper 20s' at stock power and on 5x5 it would max out the map sensor at 39 pounds. This isn't a problem of too much boost. The code is set without any load or boost on the engine.

 

[Mike B.]

OK.



The MIL light came on twice today and of course the truck de-fueled both times. Each time I viewed the freeze frame data on the scanner and both time is showed the MIL came on at a speed of 70. 3 mph. I was going less than 35 mph each time. This morning it showed 8 hours of run time before the code was set. The afternoon when it happened for the second time it showed 96 minutes of clean run time. Both of those run times see to be correct but the speed is wrong. The scan tool does display the correct speed when you view the data while driving down the road.

Today is the first time this has happened when I was actually driving down the road. The first two time I had just started to pull out of my driveway.



So, here's what I know so far.



1). the MIL still comes on with or without the TST installed on the truck.

2). I never had this problem until the day after I installed the new charger.

3). The scan tool may not be clearing the original error code.

4). just hooking up the sensor and securing it out of the way doesn't work.



This is what I think:

1). the sensor needs to see pressure.

2). it may need to be grounded but I'm not sure because it may be made of plastic.

3). even though the title of the error code doesn't suggest this I think part of the problem could be the difference in psi seen between the map sensor and the one on the OEM turbo.



4). I need to get some pressure to the sensor and see if that helps. As long as it sees the same psi as the map sensor (and it will) I don't see how the computer would know the charger has been changed.



The other thought I had was to fabricate a chamber that could be filled with air (maybe 5-10 psi) and screw the sensor in to it. That way the sensor would always see some boost (engine running or not) and the computer would never know the turbo is a little slow to spool up. That's right, I am also thinking that somehow the computer knows how fast the OEM charger should spool.



Boy, I am just full of ideas to day huh... .



Mike

 

[chrleb1]

That sensor is just straight AN threads. It might be easy to just tap it into the manifold.

 

[Mike B.]

yeah, I am planning to get a boost signal off of the turbo charger. The Edge turbos have a port (for lack of a better word) on the pressure side of the charger I can use. I just need some adaptors so I can connect the sensor to some hose.



Mike

 

[Bob4x4]

It is not a sensor... ... it is only a solenoid. When the ecm wants more boost it is powered up to open a passage internal to the the turbo to not allow the boost signal to reach the wastegate actuator. This will allow the boost to rise. With a larger turbo and perhaps some boost fooling the ecm can no longer control the boost . The ecm thinks since the boost is too low for the conditions (apps,mph,etc),to protect against high egts it will defuel.



Bob

 

[Mike B.]

interesting,,, so then it doesn't or should care if it's no longer connected to the turbo. I wonder it if needs to be grounded if it's just zip tied out of the way. One thing I did notice last is that if the sensor (or whatever it is) is unplugged two codes pop up as soon as the key is turned on. One is ambient air temp cirket fault and the other is barometric pressure circiut fault.



What harm would come if the boost fooler could be set to never show 0 psi of boost? I'm thinking maybe have it show no lower than 1-2 pounds of boost all the time.

 

[Bob4x4]

That won't work either. The ecm expects to see 0 boost at idle.



Bob

 

[Mike B.]

Thanks Bob,



I was thinking the same thing this afternoon. I did speak with TST about this today. It may be possible to modify the program so that the ECM will see 0 psi at idle and no less than some other value at speed. Although I think after some discussion I am not properly grounding the thing.



I guess worst case I put the OEM charger back on and use the Edge charger for a paper weight. :{





Mike