upgrade from 94 to 2003?

[SDrake]

I have a 94 well maintained by me that is still running great with good body paint and has the power I need with the #10 plate to tow 8000lb tt and the fuel milage is great. Has about 280K miles. The age just slightly concerns me when I think of hitting the road this summer. Rear end go, gen go, powersteering pump and my 73 year old body will have a hard time coping with it if it is not in my garage.



I have stumbled into the inside track on a 103K mi 2003 slt 4x4 6. 5ft bed with the double doors, nurf bars and upgraded wheels. I know the owner and basically it has done nothing but look pretty for him. He has done nothing to it and has had no problems. I am not fond of the 6. 5 bed idea but could live with it. One caveat, --- if his transmission was slipping he would not know it until it came to a stand still I have not test driven it yet.



I am wondering what the chances are that i will have to go through a shake down like I went through with the 94, ---- transmission lines, fuel lines hard to start issues and upgrades, resetting of timing, steering linkage, etc all things I had to deal with to have the solid truck I have now. I can deal with just about anything that happens to it if it is at home in my garage.



When I put it to work what sort of issues am I going to deal with verses some later models. The 2003 I believe was the first year of some sort of new fuel system and it has a 48re transmission, I understand to be pretty reliable. That is about all I know. I stayed buried in my 94.



I had been thinking about making the jump to something in the 2007 or later range to get the not worn out quotient going for me and now this truck has come along for 15K.





When I put the 2003 to work, am I going to have to go through a series of issues that I could avoid with a wiser choice of model year? Sorry to be so wordy. Just hoping someone has a good feel for up or down on this one.

 

[S.Morris]

Issues that should/could be looked at from reliability standpoint for early 3rd gen if hitting the road.



1. Idler pulley bearings on most upper idler and pulley on tensioner for serpentine belt. (These are not $ and an hour gets them out of the way/off the list)

2. Replace the lift pump with one from Genos and keep the original for a spare. (again not expensive and about an hour in your garage)

3. If balljoints have not been changed they will need to be. While your there change the axle ujoints.

4. Carefully check wheel unit brgs... ..... could be good for many more miles / or not.

5. Physically remove front and rear driveshafts and check ujoints for tightness etc. (these truck get tight joints that never seem to get loose, but cause same types of vibration.

6. Check rear calipers/emergency brakes. If a salt country truck caliper pistons very likely almost siezed..... wont push back if try to install new pads.

7. Change fluids all the way through. Unless abused 48re seems up to task if engine is stock.



If you can check these off... ... ... . you should have a reliable trouble free truck.

 

[rbattelle]

When I put the 2003 to work, am I going to have to go through a series of issues that I could avoid with a wiser choice of model year? Sorry to be so wordy. Just hoping someone has a good feel for up or down on this one.

You're going to get tons of opinions on this. For whatever it's worth, here's mine.



You're not likely to beat the reliability of that old 12v p-pump engine.



However, the 2003-2004. 5 engines have proven to be pretty reliable too, particularly when left stock. The new fuel system is call "High Pressure Common Rail", which is a fancy way of saying the injection pump is now literally a dumb pump providing high pressure fuel to a reservoir which then feeds each injector. Timing is entirely at the direction of the ECM, which signals solenoids on each injector to dispense fuel.



It is generally agreed that the lift pumps are unreliable beyond roughly 60k miles and should either be changed for a Dodge-made in-tank pump, or some other aftermarket or custom frame-mounted pump. This is roughly analagous to the VP-44 lift pump issue, except that a failed lift pump won't destroy your injector pump (but it will leave you stranded).



There are varying opinions regarding the strength of the front end of these trucks. Some will tell you that everything up front (ball joints, bearings, tie rods, track bar, pitman arm, steering box, drag link) is junk and must be replaced. There are others who never have any trouble with any of it. Depending on your local environment, your front wheel bearings could be welded into the steering knuckles, making for a difficult and sometimes expensive replacement job when either they or the front axle universal joints go bad.



Speaking of universal joints, the factory versions can be expected to die around 80k, on average (this truck you're looking at obviously being an exception to that average).



Aside from the aforementioned lift pump issue, the 2003 truck will be quite reliable in terms of the possibility of leaving you stranded roadside. It also has the advantage of probably having the best fuel economy of the 3rd gen trucks, no emissions equipment, and the lowest peak torque RPM (1400).



I can't speak too much regarding the 48re, except to say that it's been my general observation over the years that it's a reliable transmission as long as the engine remains at stock power.



I'm sure many others will add to what I've written here.



-Ryan

 

[JJPage]

One of the best upgrades you could do, would be to add a 2 micron fuel filter setup with a better lift pump. There are several kits available, but I would check out Glacier Diesel Power first, Richard has some really easy applications and only the best products.



The lack of fuel filtration is really the weak link on these trucks, the injectors will last many miles if water and debris is kept at a minimum/none...



Snatch that 2003 up, you won't be sorry! The simplest of the HPCR's, no emissions hardware, and the most efficient at fuel mileage. The "cream of the crop" IMO.

 

[rscurtis]

X2 on that last sentence. Having owned both a '95 and my signature truck, I would never go back to a second generation truck. With the proper mods (see signature) there is no MPG penalty either between the two.

 

[SDrake]

Nothing much that has been mentioned scares me off and really thanks guys for all that information. Mostly you are convincing me to jump on it. Somehow I have a slight dread of having to go through all the standard stuff mentined. The moog ball joints I put on my 94 at 60K are still tight at 280K. The spicer front u-joints are tight so didn't expect to be doing those anytime soon, but now I may get to do it all over again if I trade. The t-Linkage on my 94 steering is tight. The Bielstiens are still tight. I bet the new truck will need them all in short order. Better hang on to my tools. The fuel system problem sounds like they are simple enough to nail down with the lift pump and filtration. I like the fuel milage comments with this $3+ fuel.



I have decided to draw the line at the 48re transmission. If this truck has the 47re I will make a lower offer. I still vividly recall the major drivability and performance jump when I upgraded the transmission on my 94 with a low stall tripple disk and the fuel plate. Had I known how it would turn out I would have done it the instant those options were available to me. Don't want another slushbucket transmission if I can avoid it.



I expect to close the deal this weekend if everything checks out. Most of the things you fellas mentioned would not be show stoppers unless I found that all of them are in immediate need before I can hit the road. Then I might just do another summer in the 94 with my 27' tt

 

[JJPage]

I have decided to draw the line at the 48re transmission. If this truck has the 47re I will make a lower offer.

If the truck has a 47RE, that's ok. Being an 03, it could be a California 235hp, an SO 250HP, or an HO 305hp truck. If you look on the driver's side valve cover, it will state the model. The only real difference is the software flash in the ECM. (pistons on HO modified). A simple software upgrade(smarty) will make them equal. The HO came standard with the 48RE.

Now back to the 47RE, in stock form the 48RE has upgraded components(+larger case) that can easily be duplicated to the 47RE. Bill, the owner of DTT, told me he preferred the 47RE over the 48RE, he stated "less mass" as the reason ??? idk. Do not let a 47RE be a deal breaker.

IIRC, the 8th digit in the VIN, D = 48RE.

 

[rbattelle]

Nothing much that has been mentioned scares me off and really thanks guys for all that information. Mostly you are convincing me to jump on it.

I hope you're not planning to get rid of your '94! Are you?



-Ryan

 

[sammidog]

what bothers me most about the hpcr engine is the general consensus is that the injectors are shot at 100,000 miles. That is an aweful lot of money to spend every 100,000 miles. That said my '05 has 105,000 miles and the oil anaylsis is being performed right now for the first time so we will see soon. I'm no expert but I'm expecting 200,000 out of my injectors. If I have to replace them before that I'm done with diesels. I don't pull anything that at gasser can't pull for as often as I pull anything.

 

[macdaddy]

what bothers me most about the hpcr engine is the general consensus is that the injectors are shot at 100,000 miles. That is an aweful lot of money to spend every 100,000 miles. That said my '05 has 105,000 miles and the oil anaylsis is being performed right now for the first time so we will see soon. I'm no expert but I'm expecting 200,000 out of my injectors. If I have to replace them before that I'm done with diesels. I don't pull anything that at gasser can't pull for as often as I pull anything.

I did a search on the 3rd gen injectors. I'm sure there are those that do go bad but... ...



There seems to be a connection between elevated rail pressures and injector failure brought on by after market ECM tampering.



Mac

 

[CToney]

My dad and I both have '03's but with a six speed. We have changed idler pulleys and tensioner pulleys. We have a FASS fuel system on both. Front driveshafts, rear calipers, front u-joints, have been changed. We have changed intake horns, modded the airboxes and on my truck added various things in my signature for more power. I have change the front wheel bearings out for the dynatrac freespin when I had a wheel bearing go. We have changed shocks and all fluids. I did have a problem with fuel in my oil just after I bought my truck. Just like your '94 if Dodge had a shortcoming the aftermarket comes up with a suitable fix. You will like the 4 doors but 8ft beds are few and far between. Good luck.

 

[SDrake]

Well -- forged ahead and closed the deal, almost, --- they said sold when I made the offer. Just having my son go over and check on a few things to make sure it is still in the condidion he saw a few months ago. Truck was built in July of 2003 so I expect it has the 48re. When I saw where someone saw a bargain on injectors at $1800 I about flipped especially after seeing stuff that said possibly need replacement at 100K miles. I am going to put in the 2micron filter pronto with a new pump. I will give Genos first call but only after i pick up the truck sometime this week. What I have read so far makes me leary of moding.



My 94 was rated at 160HP so boy did I see some improvement when I put in the 3k govenor and the #10 plate. Makes about 30 lb boost at 60MPH going up a steeper interstate hills with trailer but it never drops out of over drive with exaust temps bumping 1200. Gets a little scary on the temps when I rev higher in 3rd, I have to watch it. I do not know what to expect from this newer truck. If it pulls anywhere near what I am getting now I will leave it a lone, especially after hearing that injector life is being affected by modding. I hope I don't wish I had just hung on to my 12Valve mechanical monster. It has been a sometimes frustrating thing to learn of its flaws but was easy to adapt at little cost.



Yes I am gettin rid of my 94. Somebody will get a good running daily driver/tow truck. Original injectors at 278K and runs smooth and started instantly in 10 degree weather. My son will probably take it off my hands for a nominal fee

 

[SDrake]

but I would check out Glacier Diesel Power first, Richard has some really easy applications and only the best products.



The lack of fuel filtration is really the weak link on these trucks, the injectors will last many miles if water and debris is kept at a minimum/none...

I mentioned Geno's but now have made a note to contact Glacier Diesel as I get settled in with the new truck. Thanks for the input.

 

[cerberusiam]

what bothers me most about the hpcr engine is the general consensus is that the injectors are shot at 100,000 miles.

I am approaching 200k and no issues with injectors, I have friends running hotshot that have 400K+ on the originals with little or no issues. There is a direct relationship between filtration and injector life. With factory filters and good fuel they are good for 150-200k on the average. Add extra filtration and they WILL last longer. Fuel quality plays a huge part also, some places just do ot have clean enough fuel.



Compared to a jerk pump with 1 event thats 300-500k life expectancy on a CR injector. I would hazard a guess even single event injectors are going to need a tune up to maintain optimum performance in those ranges. Given the pressures are 2-3 times higher in the CR system they last pretty well for the most part.



A LOT depends on the fuel used and the filtration!

 

[SDrake]

... ... . Snatch that 2003 up, you won't be sorry! The simplest of the HPCR's, no emissions hardware, and the most efficient at fuel mileage. The "cream of the crop" IMO.

I snatched it up after I found out it is a HO engine 305 HP which has the 48re transmission. Don't know how excited to get about the HO. I am totally unfamiliar with what was done to get the extra 55 horses. Basically I as excited about that but then I do not know what it's down side quirks are.



For better or worse I drive up to Ky to pick it up thursday bnd back to Huntsville sunday in the newer truck.

 

[cerberusiam]

I am totally unfamiliar with what was done to get the extra 55 horses. Basically I as excited about that but then I do not know what it's down side quirks are.

Its all software.



No downside just pluses. The HO's have gallery cooled pistons instead of the standard splash cooling. Allows more heat tolerance in the cylinder and keeps things together longer. The 305\555's can run sustained 1300-1350 degrees EGT's with stock power.



The tune on the HO seems to be just a little better than the SO for power\mileage tradeoffs and it is the better engine. Win-win.

 

[SDrake]

... . The HO's have gallery cooled pistons instead of the standard splash cooling. Allows more heat tolerance in the cylinder and keeps things together longer. The 305\555's can run sustained 1300-1350 degrees EGT's with stock power... ... Win-win.

Sounds reassuring as I consider towing my 27'TT through Colorado and Utah this summer.

 

[rbattelle]

what bothers me most about the hpcr engine is the general consensus is that the injectors are shot at 100,000 miles.

When did we come to this consensus? Was there a meeting I missed?



-Ryan

 

[cerberusiam]

When did we come to this consensus? Was there a meeting I missed?



-Ryan

Yep, you weren't invited cuz you stir the pot too much. :-laf:-laf

 

[jjdiesel]

Don't feel bad Ryan, I wasn't there either!