Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) USed UpGrades WhAt to BEWARE OF!!!

[rivercat]

Allot of used turbos and sticks in the classafieds and other places what are some things to look/ask for when considering these parts. boxes are not so bad cause the good ones come with good tech support and a problem can useually be fixed with a simple phonecall and or some postage (I assume)



Just looking for some input from some of the older/faster/wiser crowd on what is good :-laf and what is potentialy bad when looking at used upgades or whether they should be considered at all.





another one sliding down the slippery slope...



gauges in can't belive how dead this thing is on the boost gauge till 2200 now lets have some fun!

 

[R-N-R]

The first thing I do is check to see if the seller is a TDR member, then I do a search on their posts. I read the posts to try and get a feel for how they treat their rig and what type of person they are in general. If they are not a member or do not have posts then I move on. Assuredly I pass up some good deals from good people with this approach, but I would rather err on the safe side. If possible, I try to spot an online buddy of the seller through the threads that the seller posted in. Then I might do a search on the buddy for for extra measure. And finally, I might ask somebody that I can relate to via their posts what they think about the deal and seller. Most anybody decent on this site won't give you a load of negative on somebody, but you might just find out about problems others have had, and you will most likely find out if the dealer is straight up. Another strategy is to send the parts acquired out to a builder for inspection. Many of the turbo places will give a unit a once over and/or rebuild, and most injection builders will perform a pop test on sticks. It is a small cost added to the parts to give you some peace of mind. After all that, it is a dice roll that the seller makes good on a problem.

 

[rivercat]

Thanks RnR that all makes perfect sense inspect the individual's reputation/character and not the part.



Still saving to do things in a whole and not sure of my setup combination.



Still unsure about the catcher just because any probs come with a 2week wait (I guess) for the box to ride a boat to italy and back and its not in the best place to RnR a bunch or times either. But I like the reported results from the members that have one.

 

[rivercat]

Thanks RnR that all makes perfect sense inspect the individual's reputation/character and not the part.



Still saving to do things in a whole and not sure of my setup combination.



Still unsure about the catcher just because any probs come with a 2week wait (I guess) for the box to ride a boat to italy and back and its not in the best place to RnR a bunch or times either. But I like the reported results from the members that have one.



Anyone else im not the best judge or character rather take someones good word and then call them out with hard evidence that something is wrong...



can't wait to quit posting questions and start posting answers

I guess only time and expirence will allow that.

 

[R-N-R]

It is a bit tough, without being able to inspect the parts before hand as most sellers want their payment prior to delivery. So that is why I lean back on checking out the seller as a first protocol. In terms of combination, that has been really hard for me. The HRVP/Catcher/D-Comp is is my 1st foray out of tried and true, even though this combination has been run by several others, I would not consider it common practice. Turbo selection has been the most difficult, naturally I want to perform well on the dyno and drag strip, while and towing my TT there and back. :-laf Ask a lot of questions, a thread is a great way to get a lot of feedback, but then that can get confusing as well, so make sure and qualify your information. For example, getting advise on injectors and turbo from someone's experience in high altitude when you live in low altitude can potentially be helpful, but also can cause you to miss your mark. The TDR search engine is an excellent way to do research, unfortunately the amount of reading you are willing to do goes hand in hand with the amount of risk you are willing to take. Also, don't forget that PMs can be your best friend, and this is where most phone numbers get exchanged



Good Luck!

Bill

 

[RacinDuallie]

I'd be leary on any used part purchase... ... ... . questions come to mind like why is this being sold at such a great deal? Something wrong with it? Is there a better alternative to this part?

It's a risky thing to take part in but- sometimes the great deals are just that= Great Deals! And sometimes you get trash!!

 

[rivercat]

good points rd but. .

Aren't turbos hard to judge untill you run one with your setup?



I been posting tring to find a good combo to make around 400 with no wire tap



some say htbg some htb2 some even say don't do the b1-2 get the full b1

I think a hybrid would be good but see many in the classafieds too

I don't tow (as in big heavy stuff over 2000lbs) and am in low alltitude but do Want a wheel that spools realatively fast 18-21yet will cool ok with don's 4s to get me in that 400 range



BIG QUESTION RD: Can one buy a big charger like a full b1 and then change the ex housing to make it spool quicker an if so what is the difference in rpms heat and cfm , Explain the effects of bigger Vs smaller housings



Is it like >b1 16" then b1 14" then b1 12" then b1-2 16" then b1-2 14" ... and so fourth from great to small or what



I was surprized when I got gauges hooked up that on the rare occasion that the 35 does fully spool with street driving and cruising , only 20 on stock elbow that 20only came at 22-23 that seems late to me (even with my 4. 10 rears) for all the whisling it does from 16 up under load



So what to do if I get the full b1 its not gona spool till later and With my low rpm lugging around town 16-22 I might not ever hear it spool



My point is that Im sure there are turbos out there for sale that are bad but I think that some are like new and took off cause the purchacer didn't like the power band that it made or gave up trying to get the quick spool and cool allot of fuel and go to twins.



I whent through the same thing trying to find the perfect prop for my boat, I bought the first one new and it was wayy off. then every one that saw my ad said it must of been tore up or damaged I had the same attitude that you have and I had only run it an hour. with props you bolt it on and you make a few runs you know quick if it is what you want or not.



Then again on the flip side my friendhas a prop that is polished like new and had run it over a sandbar at highspeed and twisted the blades just enough to make it run like crap and you could not tell it from a new one.





Just thinking outload guess all that protects us on a deal like this is FAMILY HONOR the next mans good word Oh well



Sorry for the double post above THANKS for all the replys



by the way how about a flow chart and some maps for some of these mid range singles please RD you are the best!

 

[RacinDuallie]

good points rd but. .
Aren't turbos hard to judge untill you run one with your setup?

I been posting tring to find a good combo to make around 400 with no wire tap

some say htbg some htb2 some even say don't do the b1-2 get the full b1
I think a hybrid would be good but see many in the classafieds too
I don't tow (as in big heavy stuff over 2000lbs) and am in low alltitude but do Want a wheel that spools realatively fast 18-21yet will cool ok with don's 4s to get me in that 400 range

BIG QUESTION RD: Can one buy a big charger like a full b1 and then change the ex housing to make it spool quicker an if so what is the difference in rpms heat and cfm , Explain the effects of bigger Vs smaller housings

Is it like >b1 16" then b1 14" then b1 12" then b1-2 16" then b1-2 14" ... and so fourth from great to small or what

I was surprized when I got gauges hooked up that on the rare occasion that the 35 does fully spool with street driving and cruising , only 20 on stock elbow that 20only came at 22-23 that seems late to me (even with my 4. 10 rears) for all the whisling it does from 16 up under load

So what to do if I get the full b1 its not gona spool till later and With my low rpm lugging around town 16-22 I might not ever hear it spool

My point is that Im sure there are turbos out there for sale that are bad but I think that some are like new and took off cause the purchacer didn't like the power band that it made or gave up trying to get the quick spool and cool allot of fuel and go to twins.

I whent through the same thing trying to find the perfect prop for my boat, I bought the first one new and it was wayy off. then every one that saw my ad said it must of been tore up or damaged I had the same attitude that you have and I had only run it an hour. with props you bolt it on and you make a few runs you know quick if it is what you want or not.

Then again on the flip side my friendhas a prop that is polished like new and had run it over a sandbar at highspeed and twisted the blades just enough to make it run like crap and you could not tell it from a new one.


Just thinking outload guess all that protects us on a deal like this is FAMILY HONOR the next mans good word Oh well

Sorry for the double post above THANKS for all the replys

by the way how about a flow chart and some maps for some of these mid range singles please RD you are the best!

Questions-Questions!!

I'll give it a shot:

1) Not really- Turbos are not hard to judge at all when you know the spec map range for that turbo- I'd be looking for alot of play with the impeller shaft that would indicate hard milage and the bearings are shot and the shaft might be tweaked slighly from worn bearing and one burp can tweak it with a high milage bearing... ... . missing impeller blades are a tip-off to keep shopping too.

2a) The smaller the exhaust housing the qwicker it'll spool up on the bottom end- BUT at higher RPM's the EGT's will begin to creep up there... . Great off the line accelleration until the EGT's start to rise fast- then you have to get out of it.....

2b) The bigger the exhaust housing the Bottom end will suffer (lag) and you'll have raised EGT's until it spools up then the EGT's will decrease when it's spooling out of that lag point. So that turbo will have a much better top end where it spools and cools.....

I had a brand new B1-2-EX-4 and a brand new B1-EX-4 and both had the same housings- the difference was in the wheels inside... ... ... ... . The blade count difference between the two is what changes the map range between the two turbos- looked identical on the outside... .

Exactly what kind of use do you expect from the turbo your looking for? besides 400 h. p. ? A PDR HX-40 will put you at/or around 400- but the shafts in them lack beef... . Beef = Long term durability... What else have you done already to your truck?



Sometimes the cleanest looking used parts are not always what it seems- Ya takes your chances-reguardless.

But if you know what to look for then yes there ARE plenty of deals to be had- just know what to look for!

 

[rivercat]

nothing but the power puck don't even think it boost fools havn't tryed it yet

what if it don't with a elbow will it defuel back to 20 all the time?



planing on don's 4s and a reg. catcher might have to go the dodgezilla path but that seems to fall short allot of used ones and talk about them barking all the time too



I know huffing is bad but what about barking?



see my post I think this might work and help allot of people https://www.turbodieselregistry.com/forums/showthread.php?t=132809

hopefully someone that has all the paperwork on all the models will put it on there for all to see THANKS RD sorry to bug ya on old subjects

 

[RacinDuallie]

You might want to ditch that power puck... ... ... ... .

And without a doubt the KN drop in filter- throw that out!! If your keeping the stock airbox then go back to stocker filter- if not look into air intake filtration systems like AFE or make your own with a BHAF( it's a big un!) The AFE is pretty popular though- KN is plain junk!( IMHO )

You still didn't answer my question- what exactly you looking for low end power or top end power?

 

[rivercat]

mostly low end cause don't want to twist it hard all the time just for boost and I can cruise under 23 at 70 75 on interstate with the 36" tires.



I am going drug free Cause I hate smoke unless there are racing bikes in the road and to keep it kindof a sleeper good runs down the track without the big comp cloud is impressive to me. so mostly low end



either dzilla with 16cm housing or b1-2 with 14cm housing it sounds like

just guessing



how is the super40 compared to the hx40

 

[RacinDuallie]

Did you then look into the KSB-1-EX-4? It's a B1 that spools up fast! Good for stick shifters who want the good stuff down low? I believe it's the B1 designed to be used with stick transmissions... .....
What downpipe do you have stock 3" or swapped it to 4" yet?



just a thought.....

 

[rivercat]

4 inch but it necks down to 3 at the down pipe what do I do if I get the ex4 and the new down pipe do I have to have the exahust tacken off and weld a diff flange on?



this bothers me the most out of every thing I feel I can put the turbo on but what do I do if the pipe doesn't fit can't drive it the 3 miles to the muffler shop with it unhooked .



STACK KIT? also while on exhaust is the big 3pc pulse manifold a need with this or can it wait for twins, would the ksb1 be a good top for twins?



THANKS AGAIN







I been posting and postin and no one took the time to adise me so I could shut up already!



thanks RD I trust your opinon and will shut up for now



Rivercat 10-10 back to lurking and not speaking out of turn. .



catcher is on the way version 1. 0



you caught what I meant by racing bikes the tour de france looking ones with all the spandex and 1/4 tires on em they ride up the road breathing hard for fittness and in turn force the co and nox into their lungs like idiots...

they deserve a heavy dose of soot especialy when they stay to the left and will not let a truck by...

 

[RacinDuallie]

No!! No need to go to the muffler shop you can do that yourself- it's the first section of pipe off the turbo, bends past the trans bell then short staight section to another straight section- seperate from turbo then go underneath and seperate the down pipe from your exhaust system and replace with the full 4" downpipe- no welding needed it's ready to mount with correct flange..... Save your money on labor- and use it for more power!!!!!!

 

[bmoeller]

also while on exhaust is the big 3pc pulse manifold a need with this or can it wait for twins, would the ksb1 be a good top for twins?

If going to twins later, no real need for the ATS 3 pc, unless your stocker is cracked, or as in my case, shrunk. Bent all but 2 bolts.



The turbo does spool a little better having the ATS, though. Ported/polished or not. No port/polish on mine.



I made my own stack "kit".



I bought my PDR 40, used, from a fellow TDR member. He was a great guy to deal with. It took a litle while, because he was still waiting on a new (bigger) turbo. Still like new, even today.

 

[RacinDuallie]

rivercat... ... ... ... . now your talking twins??? ... ... .....

If your thinking about twins then forget the KSB-1... ... ... ... :{

You have to make up your mind on what exactly your gonna want with your set-up in order for proper advice- if you want to save time and hassles... .....

I wouldn't recommend a KSB-1 for the primary turbo to feed a larger secondary turbo in our compounded twin set-ups... ... .

 

[rivercat]

one more is the afe better than scotty2



and building stacks sounds hard without a big $10,000 mandrel bender or a friend that has their hands on one and a tig machine, wouldn't want people crawling all over my rig looking at big bubblegum mig welds



Ok good thread l8r all

 

[bmoeller]

No need for a pipe bender. All off the shelf parts for a big-rig. Would suggest band clamps, over the other style. Won't squish the piping this way.

 

[RacinDuallie]

Yes, you can get everything you need for stacks- single or dual- pretty much off the shelf- no bending- no welding- no bubble gum welds... .

( sounds like someone needs more practice with their mig welder if they're making bubble gum welds... ... )

 

[rivercat]

if I whent with m4s/mad/b-1b what would this make on my ETH



what whould b1/b2 twins make down the line and how much if you already had the b1?