VE-44 pump cost

[btoscano]

My '93 is at the Cummins dealer. I suspect they will find the fuel solenoid needs to be replaced. The engine cut out on the interstate and will not restart. Manually powering the solenoid does not cause a current to draw through it (i. e. spark at the battery terminal with a test wire as does the KSB). I was unable to get it out roadside so I had it towed. They might tell me the IP needs to be replaced. I'll know on Tuesday.



I am wondering what fair and reasonable prices for the pump are in terms of the pump itself, and labor? Is new or rebuilt the way to go? I see that Piers has "new" ones for $1395?



One reason I wonder if the pump is ultimately on its way out is the intermittant power loss I was experiencing prior to this total failure. On grades it would somtimes have trouble doing 72 MPH and this was on the US 101 and the 405 in Calif. - not high altitude and no trailer.



Thanks,

Brian



'93 W250 5 spd 3. 54 206Kmi

 

[bgilbert]

I think I was quoted 2 hours to remove and install a pump. $450-650 I imagine for a reman.



With this electrical solenoid, we all should take the time to grind/cut off the top portion of the pump bracket that is in the way of removing the solenoid. That way out on the road we can get the big wrench to it in the event the truck won't start. Then we can remove the solenoid's spring or plunger, not sure, then reinstall the solenoid and it will start. Just have to use the manual shutdown to shut off the truck.

 

[1stgen4evr]

solonoid

Spring and plunger. The bracket can be ripped off with a 12 inch crecent in an emergency. Just fit the cresent to the bracket and bend it back and forth about twenty five times and it will break off at the upper bolt. Nothing else bad happens.



I have helped a couple of fellow travelers that had the connections fail. The push on connector will enventually give trouble. It is a good idea to replace those with eylets and then put them under the nut on the solonoid.



$450 to 650 on the pump remam is the going price. The labor is extra over that.



The solonoid gives trouble but would not have the effect of low power. It is all or none. Low power would indicate clogging fuel filters or low lift pump pressure and hopefully last injector pump wear.



James

 

[tugboatphil]

Brian,



I hope you can find a simple fix. Just a word of experience, I also took my truck to the Cummins shop in Roanoke. After I had it there, I found out that they do NOT do any pump work there. Don't know if this applies at all of their facilities.



I did find out that everyone in the vicinity takes their pumps to one shop that is the authorized Bosch facility. When I got a used pump, it was this shop that I went to for a flow test.



So if the Cummins shop charges you the price of a kidney for labor, this might be an explanation.



Good luck!

 

[GOTSOOT]

sounds like you all wwent from talking about a 24 v right to a 12v. Post says "cost of vp-44". you will never get a reman vp-44 for 450 to 600.

 

[1stgen4evr]

Ve Vp

Pardon me for pointing out that the original lead line indicates "VE". I did indeed overlook everything after queing on the VE part. I believe most of the participants in the first gen forum would be 12 valve. Try to forgive us the lapse.



So what are we talking about a VE or P pump. I am going to hazard a guess that since he is depending on the dealer, he has not changed the pump (or engine) to a P series.



Tug, I don't know of a dealer anywhere that has a test stand. No doubt there is one somewhere. They usually add a 'little' mark up to everything and so would be more than taking the truck to an authorized Bosch repair facility. You may have noticed my comments on other posts that I have recently aquired a Bacharach injection pump test stand. I am looking forward to playing with pumps.



Also on the intermittent power loss, the internals of the injection pump seldom exhibit intermittent failure, when it dies, it dies.



James

 

[btoscano]

This is the original pump that a shop in Moses Lake, Wa. "reworked" prior to me purchasing the truck. Fuel filter was first suspect and replaced using FS1232. Lift pump was suspect and replaced after fuel filter using genuine Cummins part (probably could have got it cheaper elsewhere, but I like Cummins parts when it gets bolted to the engine).



Are you all saying the dealer will not attempt solenoid replacement? Or just that they won't try to fix anything inside the pump?



Fuel economy on this truck on the freeway at 70-75 MPH (speedo reading 80) has been 17. 2-17. 5 on average. Is this "too low" ? Does it suggest a timing or pump issue? Or that my condensor has too many bugs in it and needs to be cleaned out?



Thanks,

Brian

 

[Turbo Tim 1]

Back in 99 I had my VE rebuilt by a shop in Maine, I took the pump out and put it back in after they were done. Mine basically dropped a cylinder, they said it had a broken spring in it. Back then I paid $500 to have it rebuilt,tested and turned up a little. Here is the shop I used Bangor Diesel Fuel Systems They have a test stand on site and are very knowledgable.

 

[1stgen4evr]

I am sure the dealer can do the solonoid. Beyond that, I would place a bet that they don't have any equipment to do other than remove and replace the entire pump. And may or may not have anyone with any real experience as to diagnosing what might be wrong.



It is near imposible to guess what might be wrong. You have to have some test equipment. The 'rework' might have been marginal as to specifications and calibration. I have a truck with 480k+ miles and it is running perfect. I have a parts truck with only 200k that has a dead pump. A lot depends on how the truck has been maintained over the years.

 

[btoscano]

The Cummins dealer did replace the solenoid.



And I still have intermittant low power.



Yesterday I pulled the tank and its clean and so were the screens in the pickup.



So should I be focusing on pump replacement/repair at this point?



Out of curiousity the local Cummins dealer wants $1593 for a rebuilt pump and $540 for a set of injectors!!



Brian

 

[DBF]

Out of curiousity the local Cummins dealer wants $1593 for a rebuilt pump and $540 for a set of injectors!!

Brian

Piers charges $1375 for the rebuilt pump. They'll set it up for the type of work you do with it and other mods you've done. Have them put the 3000 rpm governor spring in it at the same time.



POD injectors are $440 at Piers.



DBF

 

[1stgen4evr]

How do you define intermitent power loss. In my experience, when the pump wears a lot, it will get so it is hard to fire up, especially first time cold for the day. Things that are intermitent have always been either air ingestion or fuel delivery related. Of course there are exceptions to every rule, but when the pump REALLY goes south, it isn't intermitent. It is down for the count. Which leads me to think that something minor is being overlooked.



Make up a jumper for the solonoid and provide absolutely uninterupted voltage (jumper to the battery) to the solonoid and see if that cures the intermitent loss of power you are referenceing.



Should you have to take the truck to someone for pump repair, find an authorized Bosch repair facility that knows the Dodge system or someone that a fellow TDR member can give testimony to their work. I seriously doubt that you need to spend over 700 bucks on your pump if it will crank from cold and run right SOME of the time. Maybe not even a hundred.



James

 

[Philip]

1st > does the engine have a loud idle or does it sound like a gasser running.



2nd > how does the exhaust smell is it a strong smell or very little smell?



3rd > does the C. C keeps up on hills or do you have to override it to maintain speed?



4th > does the pump make any suspect sounds when idling?



Case500D and I just went threw this problem with a new to him W350. A new pump cured all the problems I listed above. To bad we had to make 2 trips to Oklahoma to get it back to Indiana.



The 1st trip was to pick it up. The throttle shaft seal let go on Sat at 6:00 PM. No place to get bushing and seals. So we left is setting in my brothers yard and came back without it. ON our return trip to IN we decided that with the other issues we had seen in a 150 mile trip to Tulsa. It was time to replace that pump before trying a second time getting it here to IN.



We droped a new pump in it last Sat. With no other changes other than running the valves. You wouldn't know it was the same truck. It will move now. The fule milage came way up on it. On our 150 mile trip back to Tulsa it used 1/2 tank of fuel running at 75MPH. At that speed the old pump required 3/4 throttle. The new pump only uses around 3/8's throttle now for the same speed and the cruise will keep up on hills now.



Most of the time these pumps die outright. But if you get one acting like Case500D's did. It can drive you nuts trying to figure out the problem.



BTW Schieds gets around $700. for a rebuilt VE pump. They are a autherized Boush repair shop also.

 

[btoscano]

Most of my driving is on 300 mile trips (one way). Some of it is "around town".



Intermittant means it might run fine for 200 miles, and then on one slight grade it experiences power loss and can barely keep speed at 70 MPH, then be fine for the next 100 miles. The next 300 miles day, it might be fine. However, usually at least once in the drive, sometimes more, it experiences a loss of power. Most often its middle of the day, with A/C. Usually it doesn't last long, but sometimes it might be low on power for a few hours. For the first time on Saturday afternoon it was low on power 55-65 MPH country roads for 10 miles into town. Later that night it was still low on power having trouble on a local 10-15 mile drive with no A/C. It was still sluggish when I parked it! Next morning I drove 300 miles and as I recall it worked fine!



Thanks,

Brian

 

[btoscano]

1. It sounds fine, just like my 1990 D250 did.



2. I have not paid too much attention to smell. I can check that.



3. I have not paid too much attention to C. C. as I don't use it much, but it seems like when power is there it will run like a champ. I can check more.



4. No noticable sounds that seem irregular.



I noticed that when it runs real good its almost effortless to cruise down the road at 72 MPH but when power loss is going on it takes a lot more throttle even on a mostly flat road.



The pump has been reworked by some diesel shop the first owner used 2500 miles away, so somebody has "already been in it".



My fuel economy is 15. 5-17. 2, usually at 77-82 MPH indicated (72-77 MPH actual).



I am not sure if its related, but I was curious about the fuel pickup sending unit. There are 3 screws that hold the bottom to the top part. I was able to slide this up and down to variable length. I am wondering if that is moving around in the tank or if that is even approparite. I am wondering if, when fuel gets hot, there is less resistance and this pickup is moving around too much? When I installed it, I put some washers behind the screws so the two parts don't ride up and down. Please tell me if this is bad or good!



Thanks,

Brian

 

[JLEONARD]

When I run at that speed I get 21/ 22 mpg with my speedo also acting that same way.

Jay

 

[Steve Graham]

Have you checked the lift pump?

I went through simular situation with my 92, ran good through the lower gears but would bog down in 4th and 5th. Turn out the problem was the Lift pump.



Steve

 

[btoscano]

Lift pump aready replaced with Cummins dealer part.



Thanks,

Brian

 

[1stgen4evr]

lift pump

This primary charge pump might be intermitent if the internal valves had trash or something of the sort so that it didn't hold constant feed pressure. Put a guage on it. You need one anyway.



James

 

[btoscano]

James,



I don't understand what you are saying about lift pump trash and valves. Can you rephrase? I replaced the lift pump about 4 days after I purchased the truck on 8/19/05 because of this issue.



Back then the low power would be for hours probably because I was using the A/C. Cutting the A/C off did not immediately restore power. However, at night time power would be normal. It was like that for a few days in Calif. until I got to San Diego. Then it got better, sort of. Surprinsgly, but very thankfully, it worked flawlessly from S. D. to Flagstaff via Phoenix which means very high temperatures, A/C on max, and steep grades. Crossing AZ, NM, TX, OK, AR, and TN all I recall was a bout of low power on a grade in NM. About half or more of that trip was at night, the problem in NM was broad daylight w/ A/C. Since then, it generally occurs as I mentioned a post or two ago usually one or two pulls will have an issue the rest will be fine. Worst was on Saturday when it happened even at night. That was the first time I've had a problem at night.



Brian