Water and Methanol

[Swamp Donkey]

What is the scoop on this? Did a search on meth and methanol and came up with nothing. (titles only)



Is it hard on head gaskets? Seems to be getting more popular, but I have not seen many threads at all on it. Educate me.

 

[Huff N Puff]

Search it under water/meth injection

It works wonderfully,it drops EGTS and can add lots of power. Dont inject too much methanol, that can take out a headgasket. Keep it less than 50%. Merv

 

[Jim Fulmer]

Swamp Donkey We'll leave my truck out of this and go to a Stock turbo'd 97' (read competition thread about stock 35's hp record) I dropped just short of 300 degrees of EGT and gained 59 HP with a Snowperformance stage 2 kit. I think 496 hp out of a stock 35 and EGT's at 1500 speaks for it's self.



Jim

 

[JSHAW]

I use 99. 9% pure methanol and bottled water. 250-300 degree EGT drop and about 50-60 HP gain. I have it set at 25 psi, works great.



Jim Shaw

 

[csevers]

I am still tuning my water system in, but I would use water/meth long before Nos or Propane.



Jim how much does your boost jump when you turn your system on?



Craig

 

[Swamp Donkey]

This is starting to sound quite interesting. I think that might be just what the doctor ordered for my truck as a temporary band-aid for my lack of power and high egt's! I also have at my disposal about 20 m3 of pure methanol. That is about 5285 gallons of the stuff. I will see what becomes of this thread and have a look at the other suggested search items.



Can the water meth combo be turned on and off with a simple switch?

 

[Jim Fulmer]

Jim how much does your boost jump when you turn your system on?



About 4-5 psi is the Norm



Can the water meth combo be turned on and off with a simple switch?



Yes, activation switch is in the cab.



Jim

 

[Sticks]

There are three or four threads about the water/meth (search on that combo) in the parts and acc - engine & drivetrain. Lots of good info in them. Jim is the big tester, since he has been running it the longest on the TDR that I know of.



Know what you are going to do with the truck, and build it around that concept.



I am way happy with mine. Stock engine with an AFE and Edge EZ got me 322hp and 756tq at 5000k elev.

 

[y-knot]

If this water/meth injection stuff seems to float your boat and you decide you want one for yourself, I can sell you mine if you'd like. It is new and has never been installed, still siting in the box. I bought it last winter and never installed it, it's a Snow Performance stage II kit.

 

[Huff N Puff]

Please dont use this as a bandaid

Because if you have a lack off air the addition of a water/meth mixture might make it worse in the power situation. You need to inject it at the higher boost levels probably over 35lbs. You need the extra air to light of the methanol,and to keep it from stumbling upon the injection of the mixture. Merv

 

[crudd]

So would it be advisable to run water/meth with a stock HX35 turbo? It seems that 35psi is pretty high to start injection...

 

[Huff N Puff]

An HX35 would be OK also as long as you are

Injecting the mixture as your EGTS are gettin high and boost is up there this combination keeps the engine from stubbling as the water meth is injected.

 

[StakeMan]

I don't want to derail the thread but I would appreciate it if someone could answer a question for me, I would appreciate it.



Everything I have read about water injection says that it lowers peak combustion chamber pressures. Why then do you hear about blown head gaskets from it?

 

[Jim Fulmer]

I'm lost here with the posts, did you guys not read the part were I have a stock turbo'd truck at 496 HP.



Here is the scoop, when I started this deal on my truck over a year ago I built my own system from scratch and had it to activate with a hobbs switch at 30 psi. Then I found out about Matt(snowperformance) and talked to him quite a bit about what I had been doing, what I wanted was to use his nozzles as I knew they would atomize the water better, so what I proved is with his setup I could do the same thing with half the liquid and still make the same power, even now I run the same hobbs switch to activate 2 nozzles and a solenoid/hobbs to activate a third nozzle at 60 psi. Were you run into trouble is trying to run (2) 625 nozzles and bringing then on too quick, if you use Matt's variable controller you can bring the pump on at half speed at one boost setting and full on at another boost setting therefore eliminating any issues. This is like a plate and AFC they do require a little tuning for the optimal effect. The 496 HP truck comes on at 10-12 psi and full on at 25... old style controller, if your just messing around at half throttle you will get a stumble, but at full throttle is all in the game, so I ask the question if you have it on goofing around maybe you need to turn it off, it's just a switch.



Do all 24V guys run around on 5/5?



Jim

 

[Jim Fulmer]

Why then do you hear about blown head gaskets from it



Stakeman, it's not the water, it's the Methanol that increases cyl pressure, when I kicked my head gasket out using it prior to finding Matt did I cry, nope I laughed, heck I was at 60 psi with a stock setup and running methanol... . who's fault is it... . mine! I have now run to a max of 85 psi with it and no issues with my current single O-ring and studs, before I get my new short block I will test it to max boost to see what it will handle.



Jim

 

[csevers]

Jim

I can see 6 lbs of boost jump with my water on. If I hit a hill at 20 psi boost and 1k egt and turn on the water the boost jumps and climbs and the egt stops and stays. I have tryed this several times and am not up to the bigger size nozzles yet. Plus I have a bigger pump to install that will help push even more water. This is with No white smoke and no noticable timing noise.



Craig

 

[Huff N Puff]

Got to be careful,cause if you injest to much

water/meth its not compressable,and the only weak link is the head gasket. Pumps capable of 200psi can move alot of water. So start low like about 50psi and move up slowly 10psi at a time.

 

[StakeMan]

I know of a few others that lost a gasket running water/meth as well. They were pushing the limits I'm sure.



The methanol increasing the peak pressure makes since. Guess I couldn't see the forest for the trees.

 

[Sticks]

Injector nozzles are the other key. This is like tuning a carburetor engine, lots of adjusting and jet sizes to think about.



200 psi pump, start with smaller injectors, and work your way up. If you lower the pressure first, you will not get the atomization that is needed.



Think of a hand pump sprayer like a windex bottle. If you lower the pressure - squeeze slowly - the fluid just dribbles out. If you tighten the nozzle - make it smaller - you get a better spray and it takes longer to squeeze at full force = less liquid being transferred at full pressure.



Yes water methanol can be run on a stock truck with a stock turbo. I did and I gained 63 hp.



Yes it does increase boost pressures about 4psi (that is all that I have seen).



Yes it can quench the combustion in the cylinders if you run it too soon and/or the injectors are too big - start small and work your way up. Stock HO engine with a boost fooler runs great with 2 375ml injectors and a 140psi pump (Snow Performance Stage 1 kit with the stage 2 variable controller set with 18psi start and 25 full on)

 

[TPCDrafting]

This water/meth intrigues me, I've been reading quite a bit about it. Has anyone done an oil analisys? I'm curious of seeing an oil analisys on a particular truck before installation, then another analisys after installation with an idea of how much of the sauce was ran through between oil changes.