Competition When does the head gasket go? (ETH)

[mikel]

Hey,



I thought about posting this in the 24v forum, but figured that the guys here might have more experience in "pushing the envelope. "



At what power level do people tend to start having trouble with the head gasket on an ETH? Will something "mild" like DDII/DDIII's and an EZ do it, or does it take one of the big fueling boxes and some of the mental injectors?



Thanks!

Mike

 

[KLockliear]

Normally, it's boost levels over 60# or propane. Power alone won't do it (unless you have another problem).

 

[willyslover]

DD II's and DD III's are just fine on a ETH gasket. . as well as a HX40 along with those... seams to be above 45 lbs boost or so... some have gone farther but several at 45+ have lost it

 

[HeberRam]

Head-gasket

Amen brother Willy... 3-gone at 45 psi +. Thanks to you and Nowel, no mo problems.



Steve



Propane & NOS help to push boost to much.

 

[TURBOs4LIFE]

I have wondered why propane sometimes is a problem for a headgasket?

 

[HeberRam]

Turbo. . Propane, if injected to much creates high combustion pressures and can ignite sooner then diesel in the combustion chamber... . then "boom". :{



Steve

 

[TURBOs4LIFE]

Ohhhh I see.....

 

[CRegal]

Well... ... ...

Mine went with just DDIII's & a comp box with an hx35. I believe it had to do with all the towing I did with it last summer running psi around 25 constantly weakened the headgasket. Then this past winter when it was super cold it just let loose. I wasnt running it hard when it went.



Sooooooooo



I decided to just "O"ring the head to help prevent that from happening again. Just need to add a larger turbo now.....

 

[Jim Fulmer]

I have to agree with the guys on this, mine held out at 60 PSI for 7500 miles but finally let go when I was injecting water/meth at 67 PSI, motor has 106K on it. The gasket blew at #5 cyl forward and to the pass side to the water jacket, didn't blow completely out just lifted, if this happens to you at least O-ring the head when you put it back together.



Jim

 

[HVAC]

Propane

Like HeberRam eluded to, propane is murder on the ETH's especially. I recommend a 20 over gasket to decrease the static compression.



Propane seems to advance timing in effect which is great until you have detonation. Another thing I've seen is when you go up the fuel ladder your engine will not tolerate as much propane. I think it's the additional heat from the fuel that causes the propane to give up. So frequently we see guys running propane push the envelope. It leads to trouble my friends.



When detonation occurs the propane is starting to burn to early. Then this exploding charge is compressed which creates tremendous pressure in the combustion chamber. The weak link is the gasket area.



I got rid of the propane system on my truck. With enough fuel I'm making good power. I would say that for those that are lightly fueled and want more power without smoke, propane does fill a void there. Just need to keep it around eighty horse max or possibly develop problems.

 

[formula]

so, how about nitrous?

How does nitrous affect things as far as the head gasket is concerned? Any affect on boost or egt? (assuming, of course that there is extra fuel to be burned)



Sean

 

[HVAC]

Nos

Nos is safer then LP IMO. It's not a fuel for one thing. It will drop EGT due to the cooling effect when it vaporizes. You shouldn't have the detonation problem while you can shut down the engine with too large a dose.



Some Ford fellows have a track record of crumbling pistons, and sending rods through the block with too much LP. I begged them to lay off the LP and add Nos.

 

[Chrisw]

check sig. max boost is 53 psi. no problems yet.

 

[willyslover]

ChrisW... your on borrowed time... unless you did some help already and not saying it LOL

 

[Chrisw]

borrowed time what?

willyslover, as strong as the truck is now I am sure something is going to let go one of these days. If it's the head gasket ..... well I will just have to make it stronger so far the only trouble I have is keeping fuel pressure up to the pump and I have had the vp44 quit working once. I am waiting for it to quit for good one of these days.



Chris

 

[HVAC]

Head Gasket

Be thinking about a . 020 over gasket to drop your compression if you pull the head.

 

[Chrisw]

HVAC is that the thickest I can or should go with? As it looks right now I my have a set of twins to put on my truck with in a month or so. I may need a little more then just a head gasket

 

[HVAC]

Head Gasket

Chris, The . 020 is available from Cummins for a marine application. It is a nice size to take the edge off your static compression. Should drop one compression ratio.



This will be even more important to you if you install the twin turbos. If you go with copper you can even go thicker then the . 020.



If you use the . 020 Cummins marine gasket I would open up the coolant passages to match the size of your 24v gasket.

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Chris,



The propane has a few effects that tend to result in higher combustion pressures.



propane acts like a catalyst to the diesel combustion process. In small quantities it appears to advance timing. In reality the air:fuel mixture prior to diesel injection is insufficient to cause premature ignition(detonation or at least fuel burn prior to injection timing ). what happens is the combustion is accelerated causing it to finish earlier. This raises cylinder pressure similar to an injection timing change.



when large quantities are present detonation occurs and it is compouded by the drastic difference in the burn rates (propane is much faster burning) and the accelerated diesel burn rate causing cylinger pressures high enough to blow out a gasket or lift the head. either way the head gasket is shot.



The 45+ psi guys are probably victems of heads and blocks that are less than true or a head that is not perfectly torqued. the 70-80+ psi fellas(me included) are lifting the head. at 80psi or so the pressure exerted on the head is above the strength of the head bolts.



FWIW,

Mark