Which Truck should I order.

[CharlieMiller]

Well I was already to order a 2500 HO 6sp. quad cab, lwb, and 4x2 with the 3. 55 rear.

I plan on getting a 30' 5er that has a dry weight of 9300 & GVWR of 12700 and giving me a hitch weight of about 1500. According to the DC towing guide the truck is rated for 8800 GVWR and a payload of 2490. curb weight of 6310 (seems low from my readings here). GCWR of 20,000 and a max trailer weight of 13,550. From some of the weights I have seen here on TDR I may be over on some things(GVWR) and under on others (GCWR or max trailer weight). So the question is what do I do take a chance that I may be pushing it to the limits and take a chance that I may get fined somewhere in my travels? Or go ahead and spend the difference and get a 3500? I just don't really want a duelly as a daily driver. I have quite a few years before I retire and I don't think I need that much truck. I have about a 65 - 70 mile round trip commute to work so most of the time the I'll running empty. I know the 2500 will handle it but it a matter of safety and the laws. Too many eager lawyers. With the way my luck has been running I don't want to take any chances. Am I looking at things all wrong? Am I off base or what? I appreciate any help and suggestions.

Charlie

 

[John Berger]

A dually isn't a bad daily driver. It's quite a bit more stable towing a load than a 2500 is. Mine sticks to the road really well, even with the tread getting low on the tires. To each his own. I like dually's, so I probably wouldn't be the best person to take advice from. Your numbers seem to be within manufacturer's recommendations, so you should be OK. Take it to a scale and find out for certain, though. I don't think there is any law that exists or is enforced that would nail you on being over weight. I think length and emissions are the two biggest factors you would need to be worried about if you were inspected while on the road. I may be wrong and if someone knows otherwise, they will chime in.

 

[Batman]

Charlie

I prefer duallies for towing anything, especially 5er's. Mine is a daily driver, and I don't have any adverse issues with it.

Good luck, HTH

 

[RustyJC]

Will a 2500 tow a 12,700 lb GVWR 5ver - of course, since it has the same drivetrain as a comparably equipped 3500. Will a 2500 tow it legally? That's where the numbers come in!



We went with the 3500 ETH/DEE/4. 10 since (in a 4x2 Quad Cab configuration) it carries a GCVWR of 21,500 lbs and a "trailer tow rating" of 14,700 lbs. The same truck with 3. 54's has a GCVWR of 20,000 lbs and a "trailer tow rating" of 13,200 lbs. Remember that the trailer tow rating is for a base truck with only a 150 lb driver - the weight of a heavier driver, any passengers, cargo, fuel, 5th wheel hitch, etc. comes right off the trailer tow rating. As far as the 3500 vs 2500 question is concerned, the 2,500 lb pin weight of our 5ver put us well over the 8,800 lb GVWR of the 2500, so that decision was pretty much automatic.



Everyone has to make their own decisions regarding towing legally. We had a perfectly good 1996 3500 V-10, but we were over its 19,000 lb GCVWR with our new 5th wheel. We weighed the financial risk we were assuming in case of an accident against the cost of upgrading to a truck with the ratings we need to pull the 5ver legally, and we went with the new truck.



All I can say is that, if I were in your shoes and buying a new truck anyway, I'd buy one that's legal for your application. Why spend that much money and still have the potential legal risks hanging over your head. At the end of the day, though, I recognize that it's your call, not mine - at least whichever way you go, you'll be making an informed decision.



Good luck,



Rusty

 

[Okie-Go]

From the way you sound I think you would sleep better at night if you had a dually. I am satisfied with my 2500 but when I see some of the duallie's I think oh man I should have got one of them. Mine does for me and it fits in my garage. I have never actually weighed my 5er but I am right close to your weight you are talking about,in the end it will be like Rusty said. It is your decision and your money.

 

[RByford]

CharlieMiller



Charlie go with the dually, in the long run you will be glad you did.

I just sold a 2500 4x4 to get a dually, and am very satisfied with it.

For what ever drawbacks there might be as a daily driver they are canciled out when you hook onto your trailer. A dually realy shines when hooked to a 5er, there is no sway in cross winds or when meeting a big semi doing 80. I love the stability when pulling my trailer, you can relax and just drive. As it has been said before it is your money, but it's also your safety to think about. I only replyed to this post to say it is a lot cheaper to buy the right truck the first time. Good luck in what ever you decide Roy

 

[klenger]

With all this talk about "legal" limits on GVWR, why are only comercial vehicles required to stop at the scales on the highway? Is GVWR really a legal issue, or is it a guideline from the manufacturer on what the truck is capable of without damage to the truck? I would like to actually see a law qouted that forbids the overloading of a non-comercial truck. I know that there are speed limit laws, but I don't here forum members ranting about never drive 1 MPH over the speed limit because if you are in an accident, the laywers will sue(sp?) you. I personall don't live my life in fear of what a laywer may do. That's why I have insurance. Why is it that if I hook up my 5er, which brings the truck right up to GVWR, the overload springs are still about 1" away from being used.



Don't get me wrong here, I do not advocate grossly overloading a truck, but I do not plan on leaving my wife at the truck stop becuase I am now 150 lbs. over weight after filling up with fuel.

 

[RustyJC]

Ken,



Whether or not we have to stop at commercial scales, vehicle loading can be part of an accident investigation process if overloading is suspected. Totally aside from criminal law, civil law apportions guilt and financial responsibility for damages based on concepts such as contributory negligence. If you want a shock, read through the small print in your insurance policy, or ask your insurance agent if your liability coverage applies if you are involved in an accident while exceeding the vehicle manufacturer's weight ratings. It might be enlightening.



If people want to run overloaded, that's their business (at least until they injure my family), but don't you think they should know what potential liability they are opening themselves up for before they make that decision?



Rusty

 

[metal tech]

I had a similiar situation

Planning on getting a 32-36ft gooseneck trailer for my car. A 2500 would pull it but a 3500 is a safer choice. I went with the 3500 and feel that I made the right choice. I went from driving a 1988 Trans Am to the 3500 QC 4X, it was scary the first couple of weeks. Once I got used to the width, I wouldn't go back. One seldom mentioned benefit of a dually is people in smaller cars will get out of the way, having them training wheels is a good thing



AL

 

[klenger]

RustyJC



Everything you've said is your opinion. Quote me a traffic law, regulation, or a paragraph from an insurance policy.



Has anyone on this forum ever been fined, sued, or arrested for driving a non-comercial truck over GVWR?

 

[HEYBOSS]

Go Dually

Charlie; I too was hesitant when I bought my dually as I use it as daily. You can't beat a dually for tow specially with that size trailer. By the way that's about the same as mine, you would be surprised when that 5er and truck is loaded how close you'll come up to the GCVWR. I also think your hitch weight is off a little, more likely 2000lbs of more, I could be wrong. Just for kicks I weighed truck and 5er loaded at Cat scale and came up to 18,600lbs just 400lbs under the 19,000 GCVWR of the 3500 with auto and 4. 10s. I went with the dually and would do it in a heart beat again, the best decision I made, after you get used to it, don't even know you're driving such an impressive truck, heck the wife drives and loves it and you couldn't get her to drive a caravan, that was to big! What ever you decide, good luck, but you would never look back if you went dually, IMHO.

 

[GLASMITHS]

charlie, you will regret not getting a 3500 if you plan to pull a heavy 5er. I almost screwed up and bought the 2500, listening to a female trailer salesman, whoops, person.



My wife and I have traveled about 40,000 miles in the last 2. 5 years pulling a 16,500# Kountry Star, a lot of times we also have a 5x8 Wellscargo trailer behind the 5er full of tools, etc. Dry, the trailer and truck, with just me weighed 22,000# at Flying J. That was before the 95 gaqllon bed tank was instqalled and filled. another 1000#; plus when we go on a trip we are packed tight. So we are talking 26,500#. As long as we don't hit a good head wind we get 11-13mpg, at 55-60mph, on I-10, 45 mph max, rough.



We observe other trucks and trailer combinations as we travel. One of my observations is those folks that pull a heavy 5er with the 2500; well the bumper is near the ground and they just don't look happy. I don't personally feel it is safe. but then neither is my GCVW, and every other aspect. Expect to get some air bladders from airlift or someone, keep whatever level. You will enjoy the trip much more.



No problems related to performance. My 98. 5 just gets it. . Whatever I want, it does, with joy.



There are no laws regarding POV WEIGHT. I asked this specific question of our LADOT, the lady said "What ever your vehicle will pull, is what you can pull. " No problems... ...

 

[RustyJC]

Originally posted by klenger

RustyJC



Everything you've said is your opinion.

Ken,



Actually, everything I've said is based on opinions I've received from my attorney, my insurance agent and my financial advisor. As I've said before, you and others can do as you want insofar as running overloaded is concerned. I was just attempting to ensure that you consider all aspects before making your decision to do so. End of topic as far as I'm concerned - there's an old Texas saying, "You can only help a man who wants to be helped. "



Rusty

 

[GLASMITHS]

about the biggest problem I have seen on the "TDR' is people giving their "opinions" rather than information relating to their own experiences, with their specific vehicles.



that is what I would want

 

[wrk2mtch]

I agree with RustyJC that lawyers will look for every little detail to try and screw you. Heck, you could probably be under your GCWR and if you blew a rear tire on a 2500 and caused an accident they would probably sue you on the grounds that you should've bought a dually! (I hate lawyers!)



Dodge under-rates their tow ratings by assuming that you are going to be doing a lot of towing with your truck unlike Chevy who assumes that you won't be doing a lot of towing and maxes-out thier tow ratings (I read an article that interviewed engineers from the big 3 on how they establish their tow ratings) The GCWR is as much about warranty issues as it is about safety.

The fact that manufacturers still don't put GCWR's on the doorjam stickers leaves a lot of room to debate the GCWR issue IMHO.



Bottom line, I think a 3500 is much better for towing a heavy load, but as long as you don't exceed the RAWR or the rating on the rear tires I wouldn't sweat the GCWR too much. Look at the specs for a '94-the V-10 had a higher GCWR than the Cummins!

If you do blow a rear tire it would be nice to have the "training wheels" though.

 

[Driftwood Ram]

3500

What Rusty said.

If I was to buy a nw truck today to pull my 5er it would be a 3500, 6 speed with 4:10 rear. My 2500 will do the job, but I feel the 3500 will do it better and safer.

 

[CharlieMiller]

OK I have come to a decision and want to Thank all for there input. I have decided to go with a 3500 dually. Now I just have to decide on the gear ratio. 3. 55 or a 4. 10? What and where is the sweet spot the engine?

 

[HEYBOSS]

3.55 or 4.10

Charlie; You're on the right track, you'll never regret the dually.

As far rear end ratio, I have the 4. 10 with the auto and love it.

Sweet spot is 2100-2200 and that puts me at 68-70mph and that's were I like it to be. I've seen someone post here an HO with 4. 10 which at 70mph they're at 2350, that seems a bit high. If you go with HO 6spd, I think you're better off with 3. 55, I don't have any facts on this or any hard numbers due to the fact that I never drove or towed with an HO, my opinion on this is based on what I've read here the last couple months, do a search on it.

I'm sure someone can give you better advice or opinion, what ever you decide don't rush it, take your time, good luck.

 

[RByford]

Which Truck

Charlie I have a dually with the HO 6 speed, the RPM @ 65 mph is

1875, @ 70 mph 2000. My truck pulls my 28' Carrie-Lite with ease, I don't think I would like the 4. 10 gears because of the high RPM at cruise speed. Others on here have posted that they

really like the 4. 10 gears, and you might get a little better fuel economy while pulling your trailer. If you are going to be using the truck as a primary daily driver with occasional trailer pulling then you would probably be happier with the 3. 54 gears. Whatever you decide you will be geting a great truck. Roy

 

[RustyJC]

Originally posted by CharlieMiller

OK I have come to a decision and want to Thank all for there input. I have decided to go with a 3500 dually. Now I just have to decide on the gear ratio. 3. 55 or a 4. 10? What and where is the sweet spot the engine?

Charlie,



We went with the 4. 10 because we needed the ratings to pull our 13,500 lb GVWR 5ver (the ETH/DEE/4. 10 in a 4x2 QC 3500 has ratings of 21,500 GVWR and 14,700 trailer tow. ) The same truck with 3. 54's is rated 20,000 GVWR and 13,200 trailer tow.



If the weight of your 5ver is such that you can go with the 3. 54's lower ratings, I probably would. The 4. 10's are great for towing a heavy 5ver at 60-70 MPH (2000 to 2350 RPM), but I'm looking at adding the U. S. Gear 20% overdrive for use when we're running unloaded to get the revs down on the Interstate.



Rusty