Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) why more horsepower??

[tobaccogrower]

why do the 2002 trucks have more horsepower then previous years?

i'm putting 275's in my dad's 2002 this weekend and was wondering if its even worth it? does the 2002 already have bigger injectors? if not, will 275's make a diffrance? have any of you put 275's in a 2002? how much more power/milage did you gain? i'm just looking fore some insight before i pull dad's brand new truck apart! TIA..... james

 

[chuck3]

I though the 02's still had the same HP as the 01's ?

 

[Phil Stuart]

ETC vs. ETH

The standard engine (ETC) has 235 horses while the High Output (ETH) has 245 horses. the ETH has larger injectors along with a different injection pump configuration and I believe the flywheel/clutch surface area is larger also. Someone else will probably have some more info.



Phil

 

[Idaho CTD]

ETH power

They haven't changed the horsepower rating for the 2002 ETH's. They do still have smaller injectors then the ETC motors and are still 245 hp. So to answer your question. The 275 injectors will wake the truck up some but stage 2's or 3's would be more fun. The clutches are 13" on the ETH and the ETC's are 12 1/4". My . 02



Nathan

 

[TomGolden]

My upgrade philosophy has always been to take the biggest step that I can afford or that the available technology at that time allows me to, then I won't piecemeal upgrade (as much... ) when I get a small taste of increased power and decide "darn! I should have gone with the next bigger widget instead!!"



But not everyone wants or needs to get maximum power from their trucks. If you know anyone who has medium sized injectors in a truck, say 275's or DD stage 1's, go for a ride. Then try to ride in a more highly BOMBed truck and decide which path is best for your/his end needs.



I personally would recommend at least DD stage 2's right of the bat. I think the price difference between them and the 275's isn't all that large, but starting with 275's then ending up wanting DD 2 or 3's next month is really expensive



My 2001 ETH truck went from a solid 16. 0 MPG totally stock, up to between 18. 0 - 19. 2 MPG when I added my DD 3's and Edge EZ box. I still get the same with my Edge Comp box and HX40. It is my experience that most everypone sees at least a slight mileage gain with the larger injectors, and especially with a fueling/timing box, because both are more optimally designed for fuel efficiency than the stock engine.



Tom

 

[Idaho CTD]

I agree with Tom

The first set of injectors I put in were the 275's. Then I put in BD 3's OMG what a difference. It seems that the stage 3's are a little hot for towing (which I do with my '01) and I was already running fairly hot with the 275's. So since I got my PDR HX-40(this thing is awesome compared to a stock HX-40), DD 2's are on the way. Wish I would have done them the first time. Not to fear though dad is getting the 275's.

 

[tobaccogrower]

I keep telling him, but.......

dad has it burned into his head he should be able to pull a 48' loaded trailer no problem with his stock cummins! he also is wicked paranoid about voiding his warantee. i have my first set of injectors(275's)collecting dust on my workbench. i finally talked him into letting me install them. all he wants is a little more power to tow his boat. as soon as i get some VOID stickers, i'm going to let him try my Van Aaken thanks for all the info, guy's! i needed to make sure that he didn't already have big injectors in already. thanks again..... james

 

[RustyJC]

In the spirit of "different horses for different courses", I guess I'd like to see these recommendations based more on the intended usage of the truck. That would help me make some decisions on possible future upgrades.



Admittedly, some people are interested only in maximum possible dyno numbers. Others want the best drag racing configuration (track or street). Someone else is looking to build the ultimate sled puller. All of that is fine and well - to each his/her own!



In my case, however, I use my truck to pull a 13,500 lb GVWR 5th wheel RV. I'm interested in an optimum towing configuration. I don't want to kill fuel mileage, I don't want to have to worry about EGT's on long grades, I don't want to have the 5ver black from soot at the end of every day on the road, I'm not interested in burning up a clutch in the middle of nowhere on a Sunday afternoon, I have to be able to back the 5ver into a campsite, etc.



As you can see from my signature, the mods I've made so far are minimal (BHAF, Jardine 4" exhaust, Edge EZ). This has made a nice towing package - 1100 degF maximum EGT's, 10% better fuel mileage and much improved midrange torque.



To give an example of the information I could use, with an 1100 degF maximum EGT, obviously I could use a little more fuel. If I didn't want to exceed 1250 degF, should I go with DD1's or DD2's?



My point is that not everyone on the forum is looking for a 700 RWHP truck that blacks out the sky every time the loud pedal is depressed. It would be nice to see some recommended configurations based on the different applications for which our trucks are used.



JM2CW!



Rusty

 

[Idaho CTD]

Truck usage

Rusty,

I use my '01 to pull a 20' flatbed trailer with a maximum weight of around 7000 lbs. Before I installed the Piers HX-40 turbo I could max my egt's with just the 275 injectors( at the higher elevations in Wyoming and Colorado). I also have a TST powermax 3 adj. on the truck and I was looking to be able to use some of the power from the box in addition to the injectors. By the way, injectors usually give you the best horsepower for the lowest egt's. I did have to replace my cluch at 26k even though I never pulled with the box on over level 3 of 9 (about 40hp gain... . guess). My truck has always run hot even in stock form though. When it was stock I could floor it getting on the freeway and see 1200* stock in hot weather. That is part of the reason I went back to a ETC truck instead of the ETH for my '02. I wish I had the gears just didn't like the heat. It seems the turbo fixed most of my major heat problems but time will see.



Nathan

 

[TomGolden]

Rusty, for what it's worth, here is my recommendation for your needs with the truck you have.



If funds allow, I would say the ultimate setup for you would consist of the following:

* DD 2's

* Piers modified HX40 turbo

* South Bend Clutch - Con 02 FE (not the OFE, lower HP rated)

You already have the EZ, an excellent choice.



If you'd rather not spend all that right away, and you'd be happy waiting a while for upgrading to the above list, I'd suggest DD stage 1's and leave the rest as you are now.



My guess is that if you went right for DD 2's and didn't do the clutch and a bigger turbo, your EGT's might get a bit hairy, especially if you live or tow frequently at higher elevations, and your stock clutch would soon be toast towing that load frequently.



I completely agree that each of us has his or her own, unique needs for our trucks, and just because I have my particular setup and want more, doesn't mean doodely for what you need from your truck.



Tom

 

[RustyJC]

Originally posted by TomGolden

Rusty, for what it's worth, here is my recommendation for your needs with the truck you have.



If funds allow, I would say the ultimate setup for you would consist of the following:

* DD 2's

* Piers modified HX40 turbo

* South Bend Clutch - Con 02 FE (not the OFE, lower HP rated)

You already have the EZ, an excellent choice.



If you'd rather not spend all that right away, and you'd be happy waiting a while for upgrading to the above list, I'd suggest DD stage 1's and leave the rest as you are now.



My guess is that if you went right for DD 2's and didn't do the clutch and a bigger turbo, your EGT's might get a bit hairy, especially if you live or tow frequently at higher elevations, and your stock clutch would soon be toast towing that load frequently.

Tom,



Thanks - now we're getting somewhere!



Since I have the Jacobs e-brake, I'm stuck with the 3. 5" turbo outlet. That pretty well limits me to a stock or modified HX-35. The question then becomes - if I were to go to DD2's, can I keep my EGT's below 1250 degF with a stock HX-35 or would I need an upgraded HX-35? I suspect the latter would be the case. Do Piers or Kurt have anything for my application (guess I should call 'em, huh?)



The reason I haven't gone any farther than I have is the clutch. It's interesting that you're not recommending the OFE - I thought that was Peter's towing clutch (minimal chatter). Am I off base there?



Money really isn't the hurdle. My plan was when the injectors go in, the clutch is going in along with a U. S. Gear 20% overdrive - 2350 RPM at 70 MPH unloaded is for the birds! I was just waiting to do it all at once.



Thanks again for the suggestions. Glad you understood the point I was trying to make (I was using myself as an example).



Nathan - my truck would hit 1300 degF EGT's stock. The mods I listed (including the EZ's boost elbow) dropped my maximum EGT's by 200 degrees.



Rusty

 

[Chipstien]

DD 2's

Rusty, I think you would be fine with Stage 2's if you went to a 14 cm housing. A PDR HX-35 would be the best bet but don't shy away from the 2's because they are not that bad. 3's are definately out of the question with the wieght that you are towing. Ps. Alot of people are towing with the stock HX-35 and 2's and don't have any probs. Good luckOo.

 

[Ted Constantine]

Rusty,



I am very happy with my truck right now. Towed a 7500ish lbs trailer at 95 degrees peak for 2000 miles in the last couple days with a good load in the bed as well. GCVW around 16. 5k No EGT issues at all. Hot rodding I can hit 1500s on the EGT side of the gauge. The only time I saw 1250 towing was passing hard up hill. This is with the COMP on 1/2. With that setting I see virtually no smoke and good fuel economy. Look at the Sig. I like the combo. I have debated on going to a PDR hx35 but have not really NEEDED to.



Go with the dd2s. if you are going over a 275



My $. 02

Ted

 

[yogibear]

I have a KwikSpool HX 40 w/14cm hsing. , that the Pakbrake will bolt right up to. I used it for about 5Kmi. , it lowered my egt's a good 200*, then went with the B1, which lowered egt's another 200+*. For the B 1 had to go with BD's 4" brake. The KwikSpool is for sale if anyone is interested, email me. BTW, the KwikSpool spools up about 1500rpm. The B 1 is not for sale!!!

Larry

 

[TomGolden]

Rusty,



As you can see, Piers does indeed have a modified HX35. I am not sure if KwiKurt does or not.



When I got my SB clutch last May, the OFE wasn't out yet, I don't think. But, based on several other threads on the TDR about clutches lately, I have made the conclusion that the OFE is for trucks up to the 400 HP range, and the FE is for up to 450HP. So, the FE would seem to be the stronger clutch. I could be totally backwards, as I haven't actually asked Peter about the two clutches. Again, this is based totally on other TDR posts comparing the FE and OFE to each other.



However, based on my personal experience of 21K miles on my FE clutch, any South Bend product is top rate - in my opinion, and for my usage of it. I have drag raced a few times with the SBC, but have never sled pulled with it (or any other clutch). So for my particular needs, and for yours as well, I feel Peters clutches are at the top of the heap, although I won't say they are alone at the top. I've only had the stock clutch and the FE, so I can't and won't make any comparrisons of any other clutches



Tom

 

[WadePatton]

Originally posted by RustyJC





... My point is that not everyone on the forum is looking for a 700 RWHP truck that blacks out the sky every time the loud pedal is depressed.

JM2CW! ...

Rusty [/QUOTE

:-laf :-laf :-laf :-laf



are too!Oo.



Everybody around here is tired of me telling them about Joe D's truck... (No disrespect to you other big number guys. )

 

[Mad Bomber]

Why more?

Why more HP it's more fun Don't get less than the DDII's. The PDR HX35 w/14cm wastegated works well for towing. BTW the comp box even adds to the fun and 'S for all that smoke.

 

[ToolManTimTaylor]

WHOLLY CRAP WADE!



Ya snuk that post in a Lil' late ... . ohhh by a year and 3 months

 

[WadePatton]

Tim- so I missed it the first time. I'm still learnin' how this here 'puter works ya know.



You are "with me" aren't you? (Steve Martin -My Blue Sunday, or was it Monday?). You know 700HP, accelerate the rotation of the Earth torque! Oo.

 

[ToolManTimTaylor]

LOL Wade! Yeah and just think that Puters get tossed out every 2 years cause they get out dated and technolgicly dunce what's that mean for us ?????