Archived ///// Work Truck won't Start.....Cold? ////////

[AndrewKing]

HI Guys,

My work truck (a 1997 Freightliner NT 45 step van w/ cummins 5.9) would not start today (about 5 degrees overnight, no heater grid (I have no Idea why a commercial step van would not have it BUT our other step van w/ a 3.9 doesn't have heater grids either), and not plugged in overnight.

The truck did start the other day when it was warmer (about 24 overnight).....but today it cranked too slowly to fire up easily today (colder) so I had to jump it w/ my 1997 Dually but it still did not fire up.

I did look at the batteries in the Step van...The connections were good and clean....the batteries were (2) group 31 batteries BUT only 650 CCA.

The colder temps and old age probably did the batteries in since I could only slowly crank for about 6 seconds before the batteries seemed to run out of juice (hence the attempt to jump start the Freightlliner w/ my dually but still no luck despite using "good" jumper cables.

Anyways, I replaced the batteries w/ 2 new group 31 batteries rated at 950 CCA....Big difference in cranking speed and I can hold the key in the start position for prolonged times w/o the batteries crapping out on me (I know enough to let the starter motor cool a couple minutes between long cranking (20 or so seconds).

Anyways, the truck would still not want to fire up.....Matter of fact, it did not seem to "puff" smoke out the tailpipe either....so that had me worried I have a fuel problem of some sort? (I think it has #1 in it....I fuel up regularly since I use the truck a daily....Also, the dually I tried to jump the Freightliner uses the same fuel and that truck fired up w/o much to do (of course it HAS a heater grid) so I think I can safely eliminate fuel as an issue (other than the fact that it may not be actually be getting to the pump or injectors).

I know on the my older dodges (pre P Pump), there is a fuel shut off solenoidthat can sometimes get shut in the "off" position and keep you from starting BUT on a P Pump isn't fuel always "on" and then a solenoid energizes to pull the pump "off" (The previous owner must have had shut off issues because there is a large cable that goes to the pump that can be pulled outside the front grill yo manually shut the truck off.

Is there a fuel shut off solenoid that is not allowing the fuel in?....Any ideas how to start the truck (I prefer NOT using starting fluid BUT I hear in a pinch using wd 40 is OK? (If I wd 40 I suppose I have to take off the air filter ?).

It is supposed to get warm tomorrow (30) BUT I have to be at work early in the Am to get work started since I was down today....

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Andrew

PS - I plugged the truck in tonight (first time ever so I hope the heaters (wherever they are ) are working....

 

[JR]

I would verify you have fuel pressure past the fuel filter...has it been changed recently? Plugging it in should help drastically but with a good set of batteries the truck should be able to fire with a decent amount of cranking even down into the single digits without much of a problem.

 

[mwilson]

HI Guys,

My work truck (a 1997 Freightliner NT 45 step van w/ cummins 5.9) would not start today (about 5 degrees overnight, no heater grid (I have no Idea why a commercial step van would not have it BUT our other step van w/ a 3.9 doesn't have heater grids either), and not plugged in overnight.

The truck did start the other day when it was warmer (about 24 overnight).....but today it cranked too slowly to fire up easily today (colder) so I had to jump it w/ my 1997 Dually but it still did not fire up.

I did look at the batteries in the Step van...The connections were good and clean....the batteries were (2) group 31 batteries BUT only 650 CCA.

The colder temps and old age probably did the batteries in since I could only slowly crank for about 6 seconds before the batteries seemed to run out of juice (hence the attempt to jump start the Freightlliner w/ my dually but still no luck despite using "good" jumper cables.

Anyways, I replaced the batteries w/ 2 new group 31 batteries rated at 950 CCA....Big difference in cranking speed and I can hold the key in the start position for prolonged times w/o the batteries crapping out on me (I know enough to let the starter motor cool a couple minutes between long cranking (20 or so seconds).

Anyways, the truck would still not want to fire up.....Matter of fact, it did not seem to "puff" smoke out the tailpipe either....so that had me worried I have a fuel problem of some sort? (I think it has #1 in it....I fuel up regularly since I use the truck a daily....Also, the dually I tried to jump the Freightliner uses the same fuel and that truck fired up w/o much to do (of course it HAS a heater grid) so I think I can safely eliminate fuel as an issue (other than the fact that it may not be actually be getting to the pump or injectors).

I know on the my older dodges (pre P Pump), there is a fuel shut off solenoidthat can sometimes get shut in the "off" position and keep you from starting BUT on a P Pump isn't fuel always "on" and then a solenoid energizes to pull the pump "off" (The previous owner must have had shut off issues because there is a large cable that goes to the pump that can be pulled outside the front grill yo manually shut the truck off.

Is there a fuel shut off solenoid that is not allowing the fuel in?....Any ideas how to start the truck (I prefer NOT using starting fluid BUT I hear in a pinch using wd 40 is OK? (If I wd 40 I suppose I have to take off the air filter ?).

It is supposed to get warm tomorrow (30) BUT I have to be at work early in the Am to get work started since I was down today....

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Andrew

PS - I plugged the truck in tonight (first time ever so I hope the heaters (wherever they are ) are working....

Andrew,

Please provide the last 6 of the chassis vin, if you are not comfortable posting that on here please e-mail it to me. I will look it up and see if the truck / chassis is equipped with any intake air heater.
The fuel shut-off on that particular model went through several part number changes, then it came down to either a vertical or horizontal shut-off. Price may have enticed the previous owner to use a cable instead.

E-Mail is -- email address removed --

Mike.

 

[AndrewKing]

Andrew,

Please provide the last 6 of the chassis vin, if you are not comfortable posting that on here please e-mail it to me. I will look it up and see if the truck / chassis is equipped with any intake air heater.
The fuel shut-off on that particular model went through several part number changes, then it came down to either a vertical or horizontal shut-off. Price may have enticed the previous owner to use a cable instead.

E-Mail is -- email address removed --

Mike.

HI,

The last 6 of the vin is 810232 (off title).

Thanks!

Andrew

 

[mwilson]

HI,

The last 6 of the vin is 810232 (off title).

Thanks!

Andrew,

I think that may be the body VIN. It is not the chassis VIN as that 810232 comes up with a 60 Series Detroit for power. We run into this same thing with motor homes, there are two vins.

It would be a blast to drive, but I don't think that is what you have in that 45 series chassis.....

Mike.

 

[mwilson]

It may start with "4UZ"....

Mike.

 

[AndrewKing]

HI,

Just tried cranking again.......It spins over fairly quickly but it doesn't sound like it is even trying to fire up which is why I think it is not getting fuel somehow....
On the older trucks there is a lever to prime things with BUT I don't see one on this truck.

It is about 32 degrees out (and there was a bottle of water in the truck still frozen solid despite the truck sitting in the sunlight today) so maybe it will take more time to "thaw out" whatever is frozen up.....

I tried rocking the key back and forth before starting and I hear a click from a relay in the truck but the truck never dimmed the headlights on a cold start so I still don't think there is a heater grid present.

I will try to let it warm up some more and hopefully it may fire up.

I will try to get the vin numbers later (I had already left the truck and thought I hd the right number but I will try to look for more numbers).

Thanks again.

Andrew

 

[mwilson]

It may start with "4UZ"....

Mike.

And will be 17 digits long....

 

[AndrewKing]

HI,

Just tried cranking again.......It spins over fairly quickly but it doesn't sound like it is even trying to fire up which is why I think it is not getting fuel somehow....
On the older trucks there is a lever to prime things with BUT I don't see one on this truck.

It is about 32 degrees out (and there was a bottle of water in the truck still frozen solid despite the truck sitting in the sunlight today) so maybe it will take more time to "thaw out" whatever is frozen up.....

I tried rocking the key back and forth before starting and I hear a click from a relay in the truck but the truck never dimmed the headlights on a cold start so I still don't think there is a heater grid present.

I will try to let it warm up some more and hopefully it may fire up.

I will try to get the vin numbers later (I had already left the truck and thought I hd the right number but I will try to look for more numbers).

Thanks again.

Andrew

 

[AndrewKing]

HI Mike,

I found some more numbers and it did have a UZ in it so I am assuming this is the VIN...

4UZA4FAD9VC810202

Thanks!

Andrew

PS - I did crank it again....will spin over fairly quickly but still not firing...

 

[AH64ID]

Not all applications get a heater, and Cummins claims they are good to start down to 10°F without one.

 

[mwilson]

HI Mike,

I found some more numbers and it did have a UZ in it so I am assuming this is the VIN...

4UZA4FAD9VC810202

Thanks!

Andrew

PS - I did crank it again....will spin over fairly quickly but still not firing...

That still won't go, 810202 comes up with an 8.3 Cummins and a 6-speed Fuller Transmission. One of those 6 numbers still may not be right. You have the right series for sure. Sorry to keep sending you back to the truck.

If you verify that is indeed the correct vin I may have to call Daimler. That could be back before Daimler bought John Deere / Oshkosh chassis out. I thought that all of the records had been loaded into the Daimler system but maybe they missed one......I can't remember the exact year that Daimler took it over.

 

[mwilson]

If you verify that VIN and prefer not to wait for me to contact Daimler another option would be to obtain the engine serial number. On a '97 that will be on a tag riveted to the left hand side of the gear cover. If you stand by the drivers side steer tire looking at the side of the engine it should be looking back at you. Will be an 8 digit number.

 

[AndrewKing]

HI Guys,

Just an update....A mechanic (well, actually mechanically inclined buddy of mine who is the general maintenance person on a farm) friend of mine came by to see if he could help me start the truck.

By the time he arrived the temp had about 33 degrees and had been fairly "warm" for at least 6 or 7 hours by that time (we med at about 5:40 PM) .....we tried to start the truck...engine whirred over OK but it didn't even try firing up.

He suggested we take off the air filter and hit the intake w/ some wd 40 (appears that is what they do on the farm w/ stubborn diesel equipment)....He sprayed in small bursts while I kept the starter on.....IT took a little bit but next thing I know the truck sputtered to life and started running !

I have no idea why the truck would not start until the WD was sprayed....I mean it was plenty warm (low 30s) and just the day before it was even a bit colder (low to mid 20's) and it fired up fine even w/ the old weak batteries....Any ideas?

One thing he did notice was a tick the engine had....I told him I assumed it was an exhaust leak (it had been "ticking" for awhile....really sounded like an exhaust manifold leak to me... but he thought it was an injector (he showed me some "black" sooty looking film on one of the injectors...I told him how can it be a leaky injector w/ no fuel running out (it was bone dry just a little "black" around it (not even oily but more like a dry film).....He said \he didn't see any soot around the exhaust manifold which is why he thought it was the injector.....Anybody have ideas on this?

I will try to look at the VIN again.....I am just so happy the truck is back to running.....I just hope it starts tomorrow! (If not I have a can of WD that says it will!)

Andrew

 

[Sticks]

WD40 is a safer alternative to using either/starting fluid on Diesels.

My money is that you have a fuel system leak. Either in the return line, or the fuel heater - most likely. Cold temps, material contracts, air gets in, fuel bleeds back to the tank.

First thing I would do is unplug the fuel heater plug, and if it's wet and/or burnt/melted, you found your problem and you need to replace it.

Next is to check your fuel pressure when you get it running.

If it happens again, crack open the fuel inlet line to the injection pump (follow the lines from the fuel filter(s) and hand prime it for 20 seconds to make sure you don't have any air in the lines. Tighten it back up, then do the same with the return line out of the injection pump to make sure you purged all the air from the pump - if any.

Then crack open 3 of the injector lines at the injectors and crank for 15-20 seconds to purge any air that might be in there. If she starts to fire while you are doing that, stop and tighten them back up.

 

[mwilson]

Sticks probably nailed it. With it plugged in at 30 degrees that should have lit right off with any assistance, Chemical or Electrical......