New IP

[MEby]

Well. I got some good news on my IP. $670. 00 for a total rebuild. It had a bunch of busted springs inside. I get it back tomorrow, then I'll put it on and see how it performs. hopefully better than the old pump.

 

[Philip]

Thats about the normal price.



You ever get anywhere on getting your gages working?

 

[MEby]

No, I wasnt very motivated to work in my unheated shop this winter. I did find out the guy that got the 24v out of the truck is planning to p-pump it and put it in his dump truck. Thats good for me because I think the ecm is still on the 24v and I should be able to pick it up for a few $. I'll start working on the guages from there. On my VE they said it could have been as much as $1100. 00 if it was messed up real bad inside. They also said the cam and rollers are still in good condition.

 

[MEby]

Help

ok... ... I'm bringing up this thread because I installed the pump and the timing is now terribly advanced, I'm getting lots of pre ignition. Is it possible when I turned the engine with the pump out, that the gear jumped a tooth?

 

[DieselBuzz]

You can check the marks on the gears to see if they are off. The pics are in the shop manual. The other possiblity is that the key slipped out the back and the IP shaft turned in the gear before you finished tightening it. I lost the key out of mine when I reinstalled after a rebuild but it was in the right spot. Over time the timing retarded soo much that it smoked and sputtered alot when starting. It was easier for me to find TDC and set the timing then keep that @#$% key in place when reinstalling the pump. Here's hoping you get it soon.

 

[bgilbert]

ok... ... I'm bringing up this thread because I installed the pump and the timing is now terribly advanced, I'm getting lots of pre ignition. Is it possible when I turned the engine with the pump out, that the gear jumped a tooth?

I not sure, but I think the pump gear 'could' come unmeshed with the camshaft gear while rotating the engine with the pump removed. Only way to know for sure is to remove the front cover and turn the engine over to TDC and line up the single mark on the cam gear with the letter E on the pump gear. If you are to the left of E, you are retarded, if you are to the right of E you are advanced. If you are building a toy, non-towing type rig, and plan to bomb the engine in the future, you might consider placing the pump gear on letter C. This is one tooth advanced ~5*. Then back off your timing at the pump slots.



Where did you pull the pump, at TDC, keyway at 1 o'clock? Did you have to turn the pump shaft or the engine over to line up the keyway and pump gear on reinstall? How much?

 

[MEby]

I pulled the gear housing cover off last night ,but it was to dark to see if the gears were lined up. The gears themselves didnt look worn at all. I havent checked the keyway yet but it was firmly stuck to the shaft on the pump before I put the pump in. I called the IP shop yesterday and he said that they advanced the pump internaly by half a millemeter, but that shouldnt affect things much, right? I pulled the pump right were it happened to stop, the plastic timimg pin is sheared. Then when I received the pump back, locked at tdc,( facing the pump from the front of the engine the keyway was in the 5:30 position. ) I rolled the engine over till the keyway on the pump fit the slot. I turned the engine over by at least half a revolution without the pump to line up the slot with the keyway.

 

[dpuckett]

It IS possible to jump a tooth when turning the engine with the pump removed- BTDT (only mine ended up super retarded, not unlike others in this area).



You can remove the timing pin and stick your finger in the hole where the timing pin is, and stop the engine when you feel the hole come by your finger.



DP

 

[DonTX]

I was worried about losing my key, so when I got the pump and gear together, I stuck an icepick in the keyway before putting on the nut, and was able to feel the end of the key, insuring that it was where it belonged.

 

[PToombs]

I went on a job where the customer changed his pump, then it wouldn't start. I tried to turn the gear thru the pump hole, to see if it could jump. No way! I could not get the gear to jump a tooth. Too tight to the case.

I'm not saying it's not possible, just unlikely. My . 02!

 

[TWorline]

Could you possibly be 180 degrees off?

 

[MEby]

I checked the timing marks on the cam and the pump gear, it was lined up properly so I pulled the nut off the pump shaft and looked in the end of the keyway. When I installed the pump I didnt have the key and the slot lined up so it sheared off half of the key length ways, the timing was advanced between one/eigth and one/sixteenth of an inch on the pump shaft. I fixed that, checked KDP, and replaced the crank seal while it was open. I put it all back together and now it wont start at all. It has plenty of fuel. #@$%! #@$%! #@$%! What gives?

 

[MEby]

Could you possibly be 180 degrees off?

To my knowledge its not possible.





edit;



the only senarios I know of that this would be possible is if the pump gear was installed at 180 degrees off or if the key was not in the slot and you turned the pump shaft 180 degrees, and lastly I think the pump could be off internally.

 

[TWorline]

To my knowledge its not possible.





edit;



the only senarios I know of that this would be possible is if the pump gear was installed at 180 degrees off or if the key was not in the slot and you turned the pump shaft 180 degrees, and lastly I think the pump could be off internally.

Never mind, I was thinking backwards. At least I think I was thinking

 

[bgilbert]

If you replaced the damaged key and have it installed correctly, I would guess air in the fuel lines to be the reason it won't start.

 

[MEby]

another update... ... ... I got the truck to run again now that the timing is set right, cross my fingers. The white smoke is all gone, but now the truck has a definate miss at idle and sometimes at more than idle. seems kinda like an injector is not pulling it weight. Power is way down from where it was. I have a spot where I test my vehicles at and its 59 mph now compared to 72mph prior to the pump change. :{ I am running the exact same settings on the full fuel screw and smoke screw. boost is now maxed out at 15psi compared to an average of 27 psi before. I also just changed the lift pump and plan on change some bad looking supply line right before the lift pump. I think I mentioned before the injectors tested perfect.



any idea's? thanks guys.

 

[DonTX]

I had that same problem. Although I have bled plenty of diesels, with a new pump it takes much more bleeding. I finally bled it again, it is easy to see which one is missing when you crack the injector line, that one will make no immediate difference. I think what happened is that after I bled that one, air from the system got back in it.

 

[bgilbert]

another update... ... ... I got the truck to run again now that the timing is set right, cross my fingers. The white smoke is all gone, but now the truck has a definate miss at idle and sometimes at more than idle. seems kinda like an injector is not pulling it weight. Power is way down from where it was. I have a spot where I test my vehicles at and its 59 mph now compared to 72mph prior to the pump change. :{ I am running the exact same settings on the full fuel screw and smoke screw. boost is now maxed out at 15psi compared to an average of 27 psi before. I also just changed the lift pump and plan on change some bad looking supply line right before the lift pump. I think I mentioned before the injectors tested perfect.

Do you have a good connection/no air leak on the boost line between the cylinder head and afc housing of the pump?



BTW, not all injection pumps are created equal. Did you get the same pump back, ie YOUR pump was rebuilt, not givin back a different rebuilt pump?



The miss at idle and above idle sounds like the injection pump might need attention. I had one that idled good, but missed terribly above idle and smoked white bad at 1600rpm +. It turned out to be the advance timing piston in the pump was stuck in the advance position. This is why I would only use a well known reputable fuel injection shop to do any of my work.

 

[MEby]

Do you have a good connection/no air leak on the boost line between the cylinder head and afc housing of the pump?BTW, not all injection pumps are created equal. Did you get the same pump back, ie YOUR pump was rebuilt, not givin back a different rebuilt pump? The miss at idle and above idle sounds like the injection pump might need attention. I had one that idled good, but missed terribly above idle and smoked white bad at 1600rpm +. It turned out to be the advance timing piston in the pump was stuck in the advance position. This is why I would only use a well known reputable fuel injection shop to do any of my work.

yes,have a good connection.



They rebuilt my pump.



I dont have any white smoke anymore now that the timing is right. The shop seems to be reputable. I know the guy who rebuilds the pumps.

 

[PToombs]

DPuckett had an air leak on the supply line, his truck ran poor. From the symptoms, you wouldn't have guessed that was the problem.