Dealers, a complete rip off

[Jeremiah]

Time and advice

Abraham Lincoln once said (O. K. , if it wasn't Honest Abe it was someone else) that a lawyer's time and advice are his stock in trade. Car dealers are not in the business of public service. They aren't supported by taxes and they have to make a profit, otherwise, they will go out of business. If an owner doesn't know how to do his own flashing, change his own oil, etc. , etc. , he will pay for the time and labor when someone else does it for him. I went to a doctor awhile back who see if back surgery was an option for a problem I have. He took one look at x-rays I brought with me and said surgery wasn't advisable. He charged me $200 for that piece of advice and I was face to face with him less than 5 minutes. But I still paid for his expertise and advice and the years he spent getting his education. Same deal at a truck dealership where the owner likely spent a few million dollars building it and hiring people to work there. Everybody's gotta make a living and that's what makes the world go 'round. Have a great day!

 

[wcjp]

I recently paid $50 to activate the power on/key off option. I wasn't pleased about this but understand why. The dealer recently flashed a car that had the ECM crash during the flash. There was a gray area as to responsibility. Was it the dealer or DC? If the customer had paid it would've been an easy DC responsibility. CYA



When I had the cold start flash done for better mileage the dealer couldn't write it up for mileage. Had to write up the service order for "cold start white smoke". This makes it a warranty issue.



I've also learned dropping off the truck with the problem only will get me nowhere. At the end of the day they'll call saying no problem found. It's upto me to research the TDR, trouble shoot the truck and then drop off with diagnosis and solution.

 

[Jeremiah]

That's very true. People drive in all the time and tell service writers there's a "funny noise" that goes click-click-click-br-r-r-r-r-r-up when they (fill in the blank). The service writer rolls his eyes, but sends the vehicle back so some wrench can take a look at it. You're correct that it's our job as responsible owners/drivers to do a little research on the TDR first so we'll have some idea of what the problem is. I've learned a lot since I began reading the TDR many years ago. I'm not a wrench but I can talk intelligently about my truck.

 

[BillDriscoll]

Back to the TSB question. What does it do? Does it make it like the 06's where you have a tow/haul and a od lockout?

Is it worth a visit tot the dealer? I cant find the TSB listed. Anyone have a copy?



Thanks

 

[Forrest Nearing]

everybody's gotta make a living, but when Dodge tries to charge DOUBLE for relabeled parts, they're cutting their own throats because I'm going to Cummins or aftermarket to buy the same or better parts.



let the sheep overpay for their "knowledge"... I'm not going to

 

[DBentley]

You would think that when we buy these 40000 $ ++ rigs that the salesman or girl?would give us a check off sheet to have any feature we desire turned on or off. Kind of a one time thing to be done instead of all the fussing about shinny paint and tires the dealer does.

Then if you change your mind or buy a used one the 90. 00 fee is about the price i'd expect to pay.

 

[mopars1]

Just to let you all know the tsb in question pays the dealer . 8hr to perform when paid by warranty. I takes a little more time to complete the tsb than "just a few minutes".

 

[Missouri Mule]

You have to pay for the new update(program) and all the overhead but I'm in agreement that dealers and some shops charge to much.

My mom waited 3 hours at dealer for regular shecduled maintenance she watched the bozo walk to the back of the shop 4 or 5 times thinking he was getting things (parts) for the car she found out from another customer that was where they went to smoke. It would of been nice if he had just did the job she would of been out there in an hour.



I get charged a full hour for oil/filter changed,/lubed/fluid levels checked, I supply the oil/filter, added fuel filter change got charged another hour. I will be doing my fuel filter from now on 90 plus bucks is too much (His mark up on parts is way to much).

 

[Missouri Mule]

TFucili, Has I have heard the joke(being in the produce business).



Two old men with a truck went to the market filled there truck with watermelons. Went and parked on a corner and sold out of watermelons shortly after parking. They went back to market two more time for water melons that day.

The next morning they all telling the man they had been buying watermelons from they don't seem to be making any money. Their buying the melons at dollar and selling the melons at dollar. Maybe we need bigger truck?



Dealers and shops shouldn't have parts... higher than retailer's. Dealer and shops charge by the hour. Retailer's don't they do figure labor into their mark-up.

 

[Grizzly]

everybody's gotta make a living, but when Dodge tries to charge DOUBLE for relabeled parts, they're cutting their own throats because I'm going to Cummins or aftermarket to buy the same or better parts.

let the sheep overpay for their "knowledge"... I'm not going to

I'll go to Cummins, but I will never go to a dealer unless it's warranty work. The last time I went to a dealer for warranty, that's when I had my 95, the mechanic tried to convince me that my truck needed front brakes so bad that he wouldn't drive it another mile and that it needed a serpentine belt because it was so badly cracked it was about to fall off. I told him, show me. I found nothing wrong with the front brake pads, in fact they had 20, 25K miles left. I found not even one tiny crack on the serpentine belt. I gave him a good piece of my mind and walked right over to the general manager office and reported him. The GM said that he would have a good talk to their Master Tech and that he would call me back with what action he takes on the Master Tech because he does not allow that sort of practice in his dealership. Nothing ever happened. Funny they don't call them mechanics anymore.

 

[BigPapa]

... just think how much time they waste on the phone or dealing with customers...

That's called OVERHEAD, it's what makes the price higher. Kinda like you pay for the illegal aliens medical bills when you pay your hospital bill.



Have you quit attending your anger management classes again Forrest?:-laf



Scott

 

[BHolm]

Independant shops all have overhead too, yet the rates are much lower. In addition dealers have a sales end to help cover overhead as well, unlike most lower priced independant shops.



It would just be nice to see the dealers clean up their act a little. Like when I take the truck in at 8am and do not get it back until after 4pm, no matter how simple the projects. No calls during the day, no detailed invoices telling me what EXACTLY they did.



Truth be told, most of these places have EARNED the bad reputation they have.



At this point I always deal directly with the service manager first, and last. He knows I will go right to the owner if it isn't handled well, and even that is no garuntee. The techs I have seen are lazy and slow moving. They are unwilling to discuss repairs, all you get is the party line. This is from a dealer I have bought six vehicles from in three years. I have yet to find a domestic dealer, from any brand, that has a clue what customer service should be.

 

[JoelMartin]

Anyone???

Back to the TSB question. What does it do? Does it make it like the 06's where you have a tow/haul and a od lockout?

Is it worth a visit tot the dealer? I cant find the TSB listed. Anyone have a copy?



Thanks

I would be interested in hearing an answer to this question also.

 

[drury]

My problem with the dealers is that they are unbelievably busy. The last time I went to the dealership for a remote start issue, it took me over an hour and a half just to drop off the car in the morning. It wasn't fixed that day. It took me another two hours to pick it up the next day. This doesn't count drive time or the fact that my wife was with me, so double the man hours were being wasted. At the end of the visit, they had (1) reconnected the remote start antenna (2) Informed me that my sound guys had Dynamatted over the AC intake; and (3) managed to convince me that there was no instruction sheet for the MOPAR remote start (which I have since obtained a copy of through someone on this forum). For all of that, I had to give up my truck for a day and a half, and spend 12 man hours (1. 5 hours x 2 round trips x 2 people + 1. 5 hours pickup x 2 people + 1. 5 hours dropoff x 2 people) getting the truck to the dealership and back.



After that experience, I developed a pinhole leak in a power steering hose in my '06. I paid my local independent $150 to fix it, even though I could have taken it in under warranty. It was one trip, one person, and all I had to do was wait about 3 hours (I think they took a lunch break while I was there).



The hassle factor is just so darn high when going to a dealership!

 

[mopars1]

SUBJECT:
Flash: New 48RE Feature That Allows Normal Shift Schedule With Full Disable Of 4th
Gear Overdrive
OVERVIEW:
This bulletin involves selectively erasing and reprogramming the Cummins Engine Control
Module (ECM) with new software.
MODELS:
2005 (DH) Ram Truck (2500/3500)
NOTE: This bulletin applies to vehicles equipped with a 5. 9L Cummins turbo-diesel
engine and a 48RE automatic transmission (sales codes ETH and DG8
respectively).
SYMPTOM/CONDITION:
1. The following enhancement is included with this software:
a. A new 48RE transmission feature that will allow normal shift schedule with full
disable of 4th gear (overdrive gear), when the customer selects the Over-Drive
(O/D) switch.
Prior to the implementation of this new transmission feature, the use of the O/D switch
changed the automatic transmission shift schedule from a “normal” shift schedule to a
tow/haul mode shift schedule, and allowed 4th gear (overdrive gear) engagement.
This new transmission feature will not change the transmission shift schedule, but will
allow full 4th gear overdrive disable (lock out). With this new feature the customer will have
the “normal” shift schedule with NO overdrive (4th gear).
NOTE: To enable the new 4th gear disable feature, the ECM must first be
reprogrammed (flashed) with the latest software level, and then the 4th gear
disable feature “O/D OFF ENABLE” must be selected (turned on) using the
DRBIII®.
Tow/haul mode is not an available feature whenever the DRBIII® has enabled the “O/D
OFF ENABLE” selection.
NUMBER: 21-006-07
GROUP: Transmission
DATE: March 20, 2007

 

[Forrest Nearing]

That's called OVERHEAD, it's what makes the price higher. Kinda like you pay for the illegal aliens medical bills when you pay your hospital bill.



Have you quit attending your anger management classes again Forrest?:-laf



Scott

I quit going, the instructor was a real :-{}#@$%!:-{}

 

[JoelMartin]

Shall we start a new thread for this?

SUBJECT:

Flash: New 48RE Feature That Allows Normal Shift Schedule With Full Disable Of 4th

Gear Overdrive

OVERVIEW:

This bulletin involves selectively erasing and reprogramming the Cummins Engine Control

Module (ECM) with new software.

MODELS:

2005 (DH) Ram Truck (2500/3500)

NOTE: This bulletin applies to vehicles equipped with a 5. 9L Cummins turbo-diesel

engine and a 48RE automatic transmission (sales codes ETH and DG8

respectively).

SYMPTOM/CONDITION:

1. The following enhancement is included with this software:

a. A new 48RE transmission feature that will allow normal shift schedule with full

disable of 4th gear (overdrive gear), when the customer selects the Over-Drive

(O/D) switch.

Prior to the implementation of this new transmission feature, the use of the O/D switch

changed the automatic transmission shift schedule from a “normal” shift schedule to a

tow/haul mode shift schedule, and allowed 4th gear (overdrive gear) engagement.

This new transmission feature will not change the transmission shift schedule, but will

allow full 4th gear overdrive disable (lock out). With this new feature the customer will have

the “normal” shift schedule with NO overdrive (4th gear).

NOTE: To enable the new 4th gear disable feature, the ECM must first be

reprogrammed (flashed) with the latest software level, and then the 4th gear

disable feature “O/D OFF ENABLE” must be selected (turned on) using the

DRBIII®.

Tow/haul mode is not an available feature whenever the DRBIII® has enabled the “O/D

OFF ENABLE” selection.

NUMBER: 21-006-07

GROUP: Transmission

DATE: March 20, 2007

I guess this is kinda off topic for this thread but if someone has a problem with it just yell. So what they mean is that the tow haul button is now O/D off. I'm not sure that I want O/D off instead of tow haul mode. Which do you think is better?

 

[JasonCzerak]

Friend of mine bought a used Ebayed 03 CDT Auto. He gets it and the shifter is broke. won't shift. Take it to the dealer they replace the cable. He gets it back drives is a few miles and it's broke again!. Tows it back, they service manager tells him "we'll replace it again". My buddy says "no, I don't want it replaced again, I want the problem fixed, it's obviously not the cable. "

 

[DieselFiend]

Ok so i think I've got a solution in order to get them to do the TSB for free. I'm just going to tell them that my transmission is doing something really strange. It keeps shifting in to OD while I'm in tow haul mode. Really strange. I'll just play really stupid and see what happens.

 

[DonFitzwater]

Now your cooking with gas!