Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Edge Comp. VS. Smarty/TST

[Todd F]

My earlier post was not meant to be an attack post against the Smarty as it is a great product. I have had no issues with it except the "P0802" hard code when downloaded, no big deal though. The power delivery is good an smooth and it does produce some good HP numbers for an non-pump piecing fueling enhancement.



Who knows, my favorite timing box ever was an original Van Aaken ( aluminum housing) box for my truck, man do I miss that box... LOL



So this thread is about which box/boxes you would prefer to run or stack. For me with my HO truck I prefer just a timing box of the EZ or V/A and go with bigger injectors. Some boxes give bottom end power and others or more top end delivery. You need to figure out where you want the most go juice

 

[MrDiesel]

Love my Drag Comp. I bought the PM3/Smarty before I really did my research. Now I want to make it clear I NEVER ran that combo, but after hearing of so many problems with it, and such good things about the drivablity of the Comp, I went that route. I never did like the fact of the down load on the Smarty either. With my Drag comp, I can adjust it on the fly, or turn it off all together. I decide Im going to sell my Smarty/PM3 combo and stay with the ease of adjustability... .

 

[NoSeeUm]

I re-checked MikeD's sig, he is also running Nitrous.



These days I rarely turn on the TST. I have removed the remote so it comes on to level 7 when its on. No real reason, just sometimes I need to hear the sound of twin turbo's spooling hard. I think that is the reason, but I'm not sure. The TST hits like a shot of nitrous when I need that particular fix.



I would like to try out a Comp or the new Quad for comparison, but these days my boat is making me broke.



Dave;

No doubt in my mind you have outgrown the Smarty with current SW's. That 4 wheeled beast of yours needs to eat!



Shortshift;

You have touched upon my wish list as well.



Jim

 

[DPrew]

I drive an 02' 2500 HO 6 speed and my Smarty\Comp stack works great. The Smarty is great for towing solo and the duo is great for all out performance. I'm assuming you have a 4" exhaust installed. You may need to do a turbo upgrade to take full advantage of this setup. Your probably going to blow some extreme smoke and make high egt's if you have a stock turbo with a 3" bottleneck on the down pipe.



I had an EZ before and I can tell you that the Smarty will walk all over the EZ. The EZ only worked well on my truck in level one and made more smoke than my Smarty in level 9. My EZ quit working after 2 1/2 years. Edge gave me a credit for the EZ so I installed a Comp since my engine was past the 100k warranty.



I run the highly praised F1 1. 6 90 hp injectors in my truck. My Bosh shop tried to sell me on the 40 hp Bosh injectors claiming larger injectors would make white smoke. When I asked Austin Injection Service (local authorized Bosh dealer) about Formula One injectors they didn't know what I was talking about. I would recommend that people make sure they talk to an experienced full service performance shop before they do any injector upgrades. I don't think your going to find any true speed shops pushing Bosh marine or medium duty truck injectors for use in 5. 9's. I deal with Steve at Performance Turbo Motorsports because he knows his stuff. It can be tempting to install some cheap Edge nozzles (I was tempted) or mild Bosh nozzles designed for a different application but if you install true performance injectors you will get better results.

 

[JFlagg]

Not to steal this thread, but there seems to be quit a few guys on here with PM3s as do I. I was wondering if anyone has tried the competition upgrade on it? Was thinking about the Drag upgrade on my Comp, but tried the EZ/TST option instead and love it, but of course now I want some more Just wondering, Thanks guys.



Jeremy

 

[Fishin Guide]

Not to steal this thread, but there seems to be quit a few guys on here with PM3s as do I. I was wondering if anyone has tried the competition upgrade on it?

Jeremy

Yep. Got it!



Dave

 

[NoSeeUm]

I ran my truck with stock SW, but just for some testing. This is something I have not done since I got the Smarty and installed the M4's. Smoke is really down over any SW4+ setting. The Catcher settings will do a good job of pollution under 1500 rpm / 5 psi boost. SW5 was the most manageable, still smokey. SW's 6 and 8 almost un-useable due to excess smoke in that range.



SW3 and stock compare pretty close. The smoke volume is about the same. Maybe a little blacker for SW3 and a little more grey for stock, but about the same amount. What I did was set my cruise control at 60 mph then slow down to 55 mph and turn the cruise back. The 50 mph to 60 mph re-start cruise test smoked bad no matter what. On my truck 60 mph = 1670 rpm in 5th. There feels like there is possibly more power on these settings at those rpm's over the Catcher. I am thinking too much fuel, too low rpm with not enough air and the fires are unstable.



IMO twins are set up to spool cool and in my case tow. Mine do not spool fast. No matter which SW I run if I wait a few seconds to get on it, waiting for the s400 spool up sound, then I have zero smoke or much less smoke. Usually just a haze. To a great extent the Smarty likes rapid spool, my truck can't give it up so it smokes. I think to run the Smarty driven aggressively on the street with bigger injectors needs a fast spooling turbo. Not really the Smarty's fault in my case.



Once I am spooled to 5 psi, the 1500 to 3000 rpm rise rate is very noticeably more rapid with a Catcher SW loaded and noticeably better on SW3 over stock. Catcher keeps pulling hard all the way. Where stock starts to give up around 2300 rpm and the peddle has to be almost fully down to make 3000 rpm. Stock Is a struggle to make those rpm's Catcher lives there. Turn on the TST and I can write a new book. I am currently running SW3, which is still my preference (that or SW2 for less noise).



I am beginning to think, Smarty Team needs to rethink Catcher to some extent and provide a SW that optimizes timing to fuel to boost for trucks running big injectors and slower spooling. If that is possible. I would think the "Catcher Type" SW would need to stay out of the way until around maybe 1800 rpm. Just add timing but not fuel until then. Then if the APPS is >20% and >1800 rpm (etc) then ramp up the fueling at a aggresive rate and let the have Catcher the play ground. IMO thats where Catcher shines.



Jim

 

[PRout]

The 'ol Van Aaken solved my problem. . Man this is a gooood running truck! Oo.

 

[NoSeeUm]

The 'ol Van Aaken solved my problem. . Man this is a gooood running truck! Oo.

Must be, I saw your add!



Dave;



Did you say that you tried Fuel Saver and had issues?



On a whim I loaded that up. It seems to work very will with the TST on full time.



Jim

 

[Fishin Guide]

Must be, I saw your add!



Dave;



Did you say that you tried Fuel Saver and had issues?



On a whim I loaded that up. It seems to work very will with the TST on full time.



Jim

I have tried it. Honestly, for the rattle factor, I am better off with an Edge product when compared to the fuel saver. The reason is driveability.



My issues are simple in nature. It's strictly too compressed throttle for a given speed. I have come up with a way to make it work with my truck, but it is more work than it's worth and adds another electronic part that could possibly fail.



I would prefer to keep the Smarty with some tweaks to make it work better for me.



Dave

 

[PRout]

Right, same here when I was using the Smarty. . In fuel saver mode it ran ok, just rattled and loped too much for everyday driving. Would have been nice to have a stock SW with the ABS & boost fooler. Good luck you guys, Think Im bowing out of the Smarty threads.

 

[NoSeeUm]

The Fuel Saver seems the best smoke control for me. From my experimentation it smokes less than stock. I can actually drive fairly aggressively and not smoke out the entire street / highway.



With the TST on all the time I lose no throttle response. It seems like the lower rpm's might actually pull better off the bottom using Fuel Saver. When using Catcher SW, if I don't roll into the throttle and wait for spool up, my truck smokes like a coal train on steroids and the engine just seems to go flat. Possibly the Smarty is over fueling a bit at low boost. Even the engine sound is sort of weird during that time. Reminds me a bit like when I was getting the VP44 dead peddle episodes. Otherwise the Catcher SW performs very well if I set the fueling rate correctly with my right foot.



The TST waits on boost to fuel so unless the diesel pedal is floored I won't smoke much and I can drive more using the "Ronco" method vice always being careful not to fuel too soon and smoke. The TST has a better rpm rise than any Catcher setting.



I wished I knew exactly what is meant by "Towing Heavy". And maybe I need to re-think Smarty usefulness for my truck as well.



Jim