Battery experts please help me out with an issue

[Yo Hoot]

Here are some pictures of today's progress.

Picked up the batteries today. Group 27. Unfortunately they dont fit in the group 24 boxes and if I get group 27 boxes I will have to modify the trailer a little... make the end rails further apart down in the trailer's battery tray.

I bought a Marinco battery master switch and am installing it next to the power panel. It will only disconnect the power panel from the battery. This will allow 110 volt charging from the RV power cord without powering up the RV. If the disconnect was at the batteries, It will not charge them when plugged in at home for a recharge.

I still haven't hooked the batteries up except for some testing to determine what wires did what at the power panel.

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[icman95]

Yo Hoot,



I tried the Optima battery in my Jeep Cherokee some years ago. I was warned by some people that I might not like it and others said that it was the best thing since sliced bread. I had the same experience you did. It died an early death and I replaced it with a Sears which outlasted it by far. I know there are people who love them, but for the price, I'll do without.



Not to fuel the 6v vs 12v debate, but I have 2-6v in my 5er. They've been there since May 2006 when I bought the thing. My RV dealer suggested it and I'm happy I took his advice. I do a fair amount of dry camping and they seem to hold up quite well. I check the water level each year when I dewinterize it (this coming weekend, actually) and so far no problems. Hopefully they'll continue to last. To make them last even longer when dry camping, I've started to change all the interior lighting bulbs to LEDs from the incandescent ones that it came with. LEDs are supposed to cut electric useage by about 80-90%. Nothing's cheap in the LED world, but if you use the batteries enough, it might be worth looking into. I get them from a place in Arizona:



www.autolumination.com Tail Light Brake Light Turn Signal LED Bulbs

 

[Yo Hoot]

From all my research I think the 6v option is a good one. I just didn't want to get into it.



I'm gonna do LED's too. I use the site you posted and this one



Super Bright LEDs – LED Lights, Bulbs, and Accessories



I like this company better... not sure why but I ended up using them all the time. All the tail lights in my truck come from them as well as marker lights.

 

[RVTRKN]

Time will tell on the Optimao) so far they have worked for me, yellow tops are the deep cycle/starting marine grade which I require and I don't have to worry about the dry desert climate. I hope to get at least five years, and so far the oldest is two years and still holds a charge for a long time. They have to hold the charge for at least 6 mo. , before I get back to the boat, which I have not found a wet cell battery yet that can do that in the harsh environment they are in. Last week picked up the boat for the Summer and batts were just fine.

 

[jeepit]

I have a red top in my CJ7. My first one didn't last 2 years. The next has lasted 6 years so far and that's with a fair amount of winching. I think the key to optimas is constantly keeping them fully charged. I have a timed maintainer on it all through the winter when it sits in the barn.

 

[CBari]

I sell and repair Power wheelchairs and through this line of work I stumbled accross a line of batteries made by a company called MK-Power. I think their home office is in Dallas. They specialize in Gel Cell Technology. They sell lots to the Trucking and Container Industries for Reffer Batteries, Along with aircraft and Wheelchair Batteries. I let them talk me into two 6volts for my lq horse trailer in 2005 and they are still going strong. I keep the trailer pluged up year around and the trailer keeps the batteries charged up.

 

[icman95]

See that, Hoot? Great minds think alike.

 

[Yo Hoot]

I guess next time if these guys fail I'll do the 6 volt thing. All I can say is the 12v batteries I'm taking out of the trailer are five years old and would have lasted longer if i didn't abuse them.



The two 12v batteries in my truck are seven years old and still going strong.



Maintenance is key.



Here they are all done installed. Had to do some cutting of the battery boxes to get them to fit.



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[BGlidewell]

$350+ from Sams for two blue optimas with a 2yr warranty. The 6 volts were lucky to last 2 seasons and hopefully these will last longer than 4 6v wet cells.

 

[Shadrach]

I run dual 6v golf cart batteries in my TT. During the winter I store them in an unheated garage on the work bench and the first of every month I hook up the old battery charger for 24 hours. I also check the water twice a year and use only distilled water. My first set lasted 6 years. I have an 80w solar panel on my trailer roof that keeps them topped up between outings. In case you " Southern RVers " who live in warm climates wonder why I pull the batteries in the winter it's because they don't work when covered with snow. I would like to add 4 more but would have to mount them in the truck. I have figured out how to do it just short of cash and time this year. Shadrach

 

[Wooter]

Battery Suggestion

I see someone suggested getting two Walmart Deep cycle batteries - Make it two six ( 6 )volt deep cycle (Golf Cart) batteries and hook them up in series - 6 + 6 + 12 volts. You will have more ampre hours avaliable for use and the batteries will last longer.

About your charger: Call the manufacturer and ask them about an exchange program. I have the same charger, mine went bad and that worked for me. It was less expensive in the end.



FYI

 

[Yo Hoot]

I see someone suggested getting two Walmart Deep cycle batteries - Make it two six ( 6 )volt deep cycle (Golf Cart) batteries and hook them up in series - 6 + 6 + 12 volts. You will have more ampre hours avaliable for use and the batteries will last longer.

About your charger: Call the manufacturer and ask them about an exchange program. I have the same charger, mine went bad and that worked for me. It was less expensive in the end.



FYI

How do you get more amp hours? When you hook two 12v batteries in parallel you get double amp hrs. In series you only get the amp hrs of a single battery but twice the voltage.

 

[RVTRKN]

How do you get more amp hours? When you hook two 12v batteries in parallel you get double amp hrs. In series you only get the amp hrs of a single battery but twice the voltage.

Thats true, you will only get the amp hours of a single 6VDC battery except now its 12VDC. The only advantage is, in theory, they will last longer, because they are made for almost a complete discharge then recharge. The only problem is, that is what a deep cycle is made for, and they have them in 12VDC as well. Two batteries with 12VDC and 800 amp hours will give you 1600 amp hours when connected in parallel. When two 6VDC batteries at 800 amp hours will only give you 800 amp hours at 12VDC when connected in series. But the real problem for me with the 6VDC, is you would need two connected in series and another two pairs connected in parallel to make the 1600 amp hours, thats four batteries and more weight and less room. The longer run times trump the longer life. I would rather replace sooner and get longer camping times.

 

[Road Dog]

A lead-acid battery is made up of cells -- each providing 2 volts. Two 6V batteries in series gives you six large cells. Two 12V batteries in parallel gives you twelve smaller cells. Bigger cells means bigger lead plates, more charge cycles (longer life), more tolerance to deep discharge (more amp-hours, longer life).



Deep Cycle Golf Cart Batteries For Power Storage has a good analysis.

 

[RVTRKN]

A lead-acid battery is made up of cells -- each providing 2 volts. Two 6V batteries in series gives you six large cells. Two 12V batteries in parallel gives you twelve smaller cells. Bigger cells means bigger lead plates, more charge cycles (longer life), more tolerance to deep discharge (more amp-hours, longer life).



Deep Cycle Golf Cart Batteries For Power Storage has a good analysis.

If the rating is 800 amp hours, then its only 800 amp hours. Your right about the larger cells and getting more out of it, the only problem is they are rated only for the 800 amp hours and will last only that.

 

[Road Dog]

True but all 12V automotive type batteries are designed to start engines (even the deep cycle ones). This means high CCA (cold cranking amps) and you get that by having more thinner lead plates. With a power storage battery (like the 6V golf cart battery) you have fewer thicker plates for continuous power at lower current and much longer service life. It's a design trade off. For a given size a golf cart battery will have more amp-hours.

 

[Yo Hoot]

True but all 12V automotive type batteries are designed to start engines (even the deep cycle ones). This means high CCA (cold cranking amps) and you get that by having more thinner lead plates. With a power storage battery (like the 6V golf cart battery) you have fewer thicker plates for continuous power at lower current and much longer service life. It's a design trade off. For a given size a golf cart battery will have more amp-hours.

Sorry, I opted for double the reserve capacity. A well designed 12v Deep Cycle that is intended for deep cycle and not for starting, like Deka DC's, should give me years of good service as long as they are cared for properly. These two batteries in parallel provide 320 minutes at 25 amps load. That's 5. 3 hrs of 25 amps load. (They are rated with a 160 reserve capacity... . 160 minutes at 25 A each). The whole purpose of having two batteries for me is the weekend dry camping without hookup. 6v simply doesn't have the duration for me unless I go four. Not happening.

Deep cycle service means that the battery bank is called upon to deliver power for auxiliary loads such as house power, trolling motors, auxiliary equipment, communications and many other types of electronic equipment typical of marine applications. In contrast to the quick surge of power that is required for starting, deep cycle batteries are called upon to deliver smaller amounts of current over long periods of hours or days, rather than seconds.

While Deka deep cycle batteries can deliver plenty of starting power, they are specifically designed to withstand the special rigors of long, deep discharges and long, slow recharges. These super deep discharges and recharges can literally tear ordinary batteries apart from the inside. Sitting in a discharged condition causes the battery to corrode on the inside, just like iron rusts and corrodes in the salt air. If not recharged promptly and properly, the plates in a battery can disintegrate and fall apart in short order.

The Deka Marine Master Deep Cycle series is specifically designed to withstand the harsh environment. Deka batteries may cost more than other so-called "deep cycle" batteries... but they deliver so more. We have designed and built our batteries especially for the severity of deep cycle service. Others simply take car batteries and put a deep cycle label on them. No wonder they are so cheap. With Deka, you get what you pay for.

FEATURES:

Thicker heavy-duty full frame grids and plates
Exclusive high density plate paste
Exclusive deep pocket envelope plate separators
Special fiberglass mat plate wrap
Exclusive demineralized electrolyte (acid)
Vibration resistant design
Convenient carrying handle
250 quality control checks
Made with pride in the U. S. A.

BENEFITS:

Withstand the corrosive environment iniside the battery - delivers longer life!
Delivers more power per pound of battery
Protect from internal short circuits for longer life
Glass fibers embed themselves into surface of plate to act as reinforcement against plate shedding for longest life
Pure demineralized electrolytes assures longer life

Battery sales and service - Voltex Battery Inc.

 

[RVTRKN]

True but all 12V automotive type batteries are designed to start engines (even the deep cycle ones). This means high CCA (cold cranking amps) and you get that by having more thinner lead plates. With a power storage battery (like the 6V golf cart battery) you have fewer thicker plates for continuous power at lower current and much longer service life. It's a design trade off. For a given size a golf cart battery will have more amp-hours.

Sorry, I opted for double the reserve capacity. A well designed 12v Deep Cycle that is intended for deep cycle and not for starting, like Deka DC's, should give me years of good service as long as they are cared for properly. These two batteries in parallel provide 320 minutes at 25 amps load. That's 5. 3 hrs of 25 amps load. (They are rated with a 160 reserve capacity... . 160 minutes at 25 A each). The whole purpose of having two batteries for me is the weekend dry camping without hookup. 6v simply doesn't have the duration for me unless I go four. Not happening.







Battery sales and service - Voltex Battery Inc.

I'm not dogging the 6VDC batt's, I just think for longer run time's and less room, works for me with the 12VDC Deep cycle/starting batt's. I'm willing to trade the longevity for run time even though I know they wont last as long. But that article you linked to, was very interesting with the graph on the comparison. If I didn't have a boat that I leave for six months at a time I might consider the 6VDC