Mystery in Indiana, Interesting News in the RV Production. From RV Consumer Group

[Grizzly]

The bankruptcy of Earthbound RV has left Marion, Indiana residents holding the bag for

$2,000,000, its employees feeling betrayed, and its dealer base totally confused.

Marion city officials recently announced that Earthbound RV is now closed and that its

assets would be auctioned off in mid-January, 2013, in an effort to retrieve unpaid loan money

which the city had backed. This announcement came as a surprise to residents and many in

the RV industry.

Initially, Marion extended a $2,000,000 bond to Earthbound that would have to be paid

back by taxpayers through economic development taxes if the company defaulted. Now the

city is hoping to realize as much as possible of the original monies through the auction so that

less of the burden will fall on the taxpayers.

Earthbound was the brainchild of veteran industry entrepreneur, C. David Hoefer.

Sometimes labeled consultant, sometimes president and CEO, his initial idea was to build an

eco-friendly lightweight trailer using composite, formaldehyde-free materials, with nearly

everything standard that would be optional in other brands, at a starting price of about

$47,000. Founded in Middlebury, Indiana, in 2010, the company soon moved production to

Marion on the basis of a two-million-dollar bond derived from economic development taxes.

Hoefer promised at the outset to hire 180 employees and build 400 trailers per year.

When prototypes were displayed at the major RV shows in the US and Canada, dealers

and prospective RV buyers appeared enthusiastic. Hoefer was labeled "a visionary" by others

in the industry, and the press resounded with rave reviews of the new trailers. For the year

2010, Earthbound was named "Green RV of the Year" by RoamingTimes.com -- an industry

publication. The township reeled in ecstasy over the favorable publicity Earthbound brought to

its business community. However, by the summer of 2011, things started to unravel.

According to dealers, orders were rolling in. But the company was already laying off

workers. Of the 180 they had promised to hire, they had hired only 50 prior to the layoffs, and

had produced a total of 150 coaches during nearly two years of production. As summer turned

Mystery in Indiana

to autumn, dealers were getting nervous. Earthbound trailers were backordered and

customers wanted to know when they could take delivery. Warranty issues that had already

shown up were ignored.

In October came the announcement that production strategy would be changed to a focus

on luxury trailers, with prices of around $100,000 and up, that would be distributed to limited

dealerships in the US and Canada and internationally. Unveiling his plan, Hoefer's charisma

and extravagant promises once again generated an enthusiastic response. On the other

hand, we'll never know how many orders and commitments made to customers of the original

line were ever honored.

After over a year of "planning", it became apparent that production, which was slated to

start "soon," never happened. And why did the company decide to switch gears in midstream

when they had everything going for them? That's the mystery.

Because Dave Hoefer has a 2-decade history with the RV industry and RV Consumer

Group has, during the same time, been issuing "buyer beware" bulletins on Hoefer's

'innovative' products, we plan to follow up on this story. Stay tuned for the graphic details.

Connie Gallant & RVCG Staff

 

[wcoomes]

Hoefer was also w/ Pilgrim Int'l made Pilgrim & Open Road, also went belly-up.

 

[HBarlow]

Quoted from op"initial idea was to build an eco-friendly lightweight trailer using composite, formaldehyde-free materials, with nearly everything standard that would be optional in other brands, at a starting price of about $47,000. "end quote.

Every single item in that opening sentence would have tripped all my alarms and turned me away. It sounds more like the promises of a lying politician than a towable RV to me. I don't know or care if the founder was a leftist or a swindler but when the thin veneer is removed they look the same.

I'm old and cynical. I've owned RVs, read about them, towed them personally and commercially, visited many RV manufacturing plants, and have loved them for a long time. I would have avoided that product and manufacturer like veneral disease.

Anyone who bought that bs and got suckered deserved it. PT Barnum was a smart man.

 

[Grizzly]

Well said Harvey. I totally agree.

george

 

[HBarlow]

I hope Marion and the state of Indiana provide that bs artist with free housing and meals in a state prison for 20 years to go along with what they've already given him.

 

[jgillott]

Question for you guys..... how does someone like that apply for government/municipal money for stuff like this? I know companies do this all the time, but it seems like he had quite a background that should have raised the red flag.

 

[HBarlow]

I don't live in Indiana, know the details, or pretend to but this was likely an extraordinary procedure proposed and voted upon by their city council in a desperate attempt to create jobs for their citizens.

Indiana was booming during the RV heydays of the Bush administration and had been strong for a long time. I was living in IN and pulling RVs out of there in '05 through '07.

This is not the political forum so I can't write freely but almost immediately following the November '06 congressional election the victors began running their mouth in the media about all the new legislation they were going to impose beginning in January '07 when they took office. I knew those lying conniving hacks and it didn't require much brain power to predict the outcome.

In early '07 the economy began the downward slide. Our diesel fuel prices began to rise and our RV shipments began to slow. It became a little harder each month to get a load out of IN and stay busy. Within about a year some of the best old high quality RV manufacturers began dying. Overall production, profits, and wages across northeastern IN began to slump.

I got disgusted by October '07 and returned home. To be fair, I was still busy and making money but growing tired of the grind of the road. I knew what was coming. Lots of IN RV industry workers began losing their jobs. All the illegal immigrants in the secondary RV industry began packing their limited stuff and heading southwest for mexico.

IN's economy has been slow ever since. Baby boomer retirements and America's love for RVs and travel have saved the cheaper brands, Keystone, Forest River, some of the Thor brands. Those brands have cut back but continued producing but jobs have never returned like before. Lots of IN folks had nice homes, cars, trucks, boats, etc. and new financial problems.

The city leaders of Marion, IN probably sincerely believed the bs halo over that guy's head and his reputation which he probably puffed. Lots of stupid people sit on city councils. They were probably influenced by the leftist propaganda about eco-friendly and formaldehyde free and wishful thinking and thought that shyster was going to create a big new plant and hire all their citizens, produce thousands of flimsy, cheap trailers, their citizens would all have good jobs, and they'd all be city council heros and move on to become governor or who knows. Local governments often do similar things and some turn out great. I, just an ordinary old guy, would have strongly advised that city council not to touch that.

The con artist may have been serious, a big talker with big ideas and a lot of self-confidence and bs to spread around. His lines probably sounded good. The truth is the economy is in far worse shape than most Americans understand and sinking like a turd but the media is lying about it. RV sales are probably not half as good as the propaganda media claims. That guy's big ideas may have been just bad judgement. He may have believed his own lines.

Some consumers and lenders are smart enough to know that a cheaply made, eco-friendly, lightweight, composite pos travel trailer that costs upwards of $50k will fall apart on the highway long before the note is ever repaid to the lender. He may have tried valiantly but couldn't sell that crap. Perhaps the plant discovered they couldn't even build them. Who know?

Do you know that ordinary blue collar working Americans are financing some of that cheap crap for 20 years, 30 years, perhaps even longer in some cases.

The entire idea from start to finish was a fool's game and everyone who touched it got burned.

For years I've been preaching right here. NEVER buy a cheapo entry level travel trailer built by one of the low quality mass producers and certainly never from a new start up RV company that was not building trailers two years ago and won't be building them two years from now. The same amount of money or much less money will buy a good used upper or top quality trailer several years old that is affordable and will outlast all that new crap. Rarely does anyone listen.

 

[jgillott]

Now that you described it, I believe that something similar happened here over the last few decades. In the late '70's, Chrysler built a huge plant about 10 miles from here. Just as the complex, rail lines, and new roads were completed, Chrysler corp. abandoned the project and the building remained empty for several years. Then, by the early '80's, VW of America came in and built the Rabbit line there for a number of years. I'm not positive when the VW plant closed, but I do think it ended when the Rabbit was dropped.

Again, the huge complex sat empty until Sony corp came in a started making large screen TV's there. They even built a separate video glass "American Video Glass" plant across the street and it was very successful for a number of years. In fact, two new industrial complexes sprouted in the area with several dozen little electronics and technology support companies. The state gave Sony a 10 year tax free status and low and behold, as soon as that time ended (after one short extension), out goes Sony, American Video glass, and a handfull of small companies with it. The majority of those structures are now again sitting empty.

Some of the area is now being used by the new drilling companies in the area, especially the rail lines and shipping areas. But they are still searching for a major cornerstone to end up back here again.

 

[JMetzger]

AMEN Harvey. We live in Indiana (95 miles from us) & no one here had even heard about this deal. I am not saying it didn't happen but a lot of dirt here gets covered up because of stupidity & not letting the public know what is going on.

 

[HBarlow]

Now that you described it, I believe that something similar happened here over the last few decades. In the late '70's, Chrysler built a huge plant about 10 miles from here. Just as the complex, rail lines, and new roads were completed, Chrysler corp. abandoned the project and the building remained empty for several years. Then, by the early '80's, VW of America came in and built the Rabbit line there for a number of years. I'm not positive when the VW plant closed, but I do think it ended when the Rabbit was dropped.

Again, the huge complex sat empty until Sony corp came in a started making large screen TV's there. They even built a separate video glass "American Video Glass" plant across the street and it was very successful for a number of years. In fact, two new industrial complexes sprouted in the area with several dozen little electronics and technology support companies. The state gave Sony a 10 year tax free status and low and behold, as soon as that time ended (after one short extension), out goes Sony, American Video glass, and a handfull of small companies with it. The majority of those structures are now again sitting empty.

Some of the area is now being used by the new drilling companies in the area, especially the rail lines and shipping areas. But they are still searching for a major cornerstone to end up back here again.

I think you nailed it. The timing you mentioned would have corresponded with the four years of a fool from GA who thought he could manage the economy and make wonderful thing happen from a big white house. He did a lot of really dumb things that cost all of us.

 

[HBarlow]

AMEN Harvey. We live in Indiana (95 miles from us) & no one here had even heard about this deal. I am not saying it didn't happen but a lot of dirt here gets covered up because of stupidity & not letting the public know what is going on.

The sad thing about it a con artist like that can spread his big ideas and plans around like that and a number of cities in the area will compete to see who give away the most tax revenue or co-sign the largest note to get him to agree to locate in their area.

Any dimbulb should be able to understand that when the con artist runs it in the ground and runs away with the remaining funds leaving a bk filing they can't collect. If he was slick enough that he didn't commit fraud he walks.

 

[jgillott]

I think you nailed it. The timing you mentioned would have corresponded with the four years of a fool from GA who thought he could manage the economy and make wonderful thing happen from a big white house. He did a lot of really dumb things that cost all of us.

Yes, and the second time around with Sony corresponded with a 2 term Governor here that wasn't going to extend any type of tax breaks to a company in PA. It was a shame, I knew a lot of guys my age with families that made a good go of it with Sony Corp. They sponsored college tuition for their workers, very good pay, and gave many grants to local schools and community group. Oh well, I guess our governor showed them. It's now a ghost town again.

 

[Shadrach]

For years I've been preaching right here. NEVER buy a cheapo entry level travel trailer built by one of the low quality mass producers and certainly never from a new start up RV company that was not building trailers two years ago and won't be building them two years from now. The same amount of money or much less money will buy a good used upper or top quality trailer several years old that is affordable and will outlast all that new crap. Rarely does anyone listen.

Right on Mr Harvey I agree 100% I can't afford to buy new anyway. The RV show is this coming weekend and I will probably go just for entrainment purposes and to see see what is "new". I don't like most of the new units that are being built but I do hate to see workers get shafted thru no fault of their own. Shad

 

[Grizzly]

Some people have to live and learn and find out the hard way about what's a good trailer and what isn't My own son bought a cheap 5th wheel, much against my will, but he felt the floor plan would be good for his two very young boys and and his wife. He is a building contractor and is very handy with tools and so far has kept up with all the many maintenance problems. He bought what he could afford at the time. He'll do much better next time, he said.

I try to help anyone who asks which brands to buy and which brands not to buy. I am not an expert, but I do consult with my RV Consumers Group and invite anyone to ask me what my guide says about whatever brand you are considering. I look up the data and tell them exactly what the guide says. It's not always what they want to hear. I am always glad to do it and many have taken advantage of that. I still say if you are going to make a large investment in an RV, say 20, 30, 40 K you may want to buy your own copy of the RV Consumer Group. It's a very small investment that will pay off 1000 fold.

I get no kick back from RV Consumer Group for their endorsement. They don't even know who I am. I'm just on their mailing list. I only do this to help out anyone considering a large purchase in an RV, new or used. I hate to see anyone get burned and I know many of you have. RV salesmen are like most car salesmen, the biggest crooks in the business. They tell what you want to hear and they listen to what the little wife wants. So don't take little wife with you when shopping for an RV.

Hope this helps, george

 

[wyosteve]

Grizzly, since you sort of offered, I'm interested in your opinion or that of the RV group on a 2005 Arctic Fox 24-5 fifth wheel. I'm doing some shopping and am limiting my search to Arctic Foxes, either the 24-5 or the 27-5. I need it to be short enough to be able to reasonably tow my boat behind it. One potential issue I've come up with at this point is the rating for a receiver hitch on the rear of the 5th wheel. I was told by an Arctic Fox dealer that the frame is only rated for a 350 tongue/3500 gvw trailer. My boat with trailer, etc weighs in at around 5000 lbs. Do you know if a competent welding shop can reinforce the frame to allow a 500 lb. tongue/5000 gross weight rating? Thanks for any insight you might offer. I may be putting a deal together for a unit in AZ. If so, I'll buy you a beer on my way through ABQ.

 

[HBarlow]

A local welder can probably fabricate a good hitch receiver capable of handling the tongue and towing weight you described but what about the forces the weight adds to the overall frame? The kingpin box and the front section of the frame where the kickup attaches to the main frame feels the stresses of a trailer at the rear and the tongue weight on the rear of the frame creates a hinge effect over the trailer axles also. All of those factors have to be considered.

I would recommend you make a call to the manufacturer of Arctic Fox trailers and ask someone in engineering that question. They may tell you the frame can handle 500/5000 lbs. with a good hitch receiver that spreads the weight and stress or they may warn you away. They know the frame strength and can advise you if you tell them the year and model you're considering.

 

[Grizzly]

Grizzly, since you sort of offered, I'm interested in your opinion or that of the RV group on a 2005 Arctic Fox 24-5 fifth wheel. I'm doing some shopping and am limiting my search to Arctic Foxes, either the 24-5 or the 27-5. I need it to be short enough to be able to reasonably tow my boat behind it. One potential issue I've come up with at this point is the rating for a receiver hitch on the rear of the 5th wheel. I was told by an Arctic Fox dealer that the frame is only rated for a 350 tongue/3500 gvw trailer. My boat with trailer, etc weighs in at around 5000 lbs. Do you know if a competent welding shop can reinforce the frame to allow a 500 lb. tongue/5000 gross weight rating? Thanks for any insight you might offer. I may be putting a deal together for a unit in AZ. If so, I'll buy you a beer on my way through ABQ.

You can't go wrong with an Arctic Fox. They are a 4 star rated trailer. I'm assuming you're talking about a Travel Trailer (TT). If you're going to pull a boat behind the TT, I'd get a 5th wheel. My 5th wheel is an Arctic Fox 27-5L and has an American made, in their own factory, 12" frame under it. I assume that a 27-5 TT has the same frame, which I would think is more than adequate, but you need to consult with someone who knows more about double towing, which I do not recommend, especially with a TT.



george

 

[Grizzly]

A local welder can probably fabricate a good hitch receiver capable of handling the tongue and towing weight you described but what about the forces the weight adds to the overall frame? The kingpin box and the front section of the frame where the kickup attaches to the main frame feels the stresses of a trailer at the rear and the tongue weight on the rear of the frame creates a hinge effect over the trailer axles also. All of those factors have to be considered.

I would recommend you make a call to the manufacturer of Arctic Fox trailers and ask someone in engineering that question. They may tell you the frame can handle 500/5000 lbs. with a good hitch receiver that spreads the weight and stress or they may warn you away. They know the frame strength and can advise you if you tell them the year and model you're considering.

Harvey, I believe that Northwood Mfg would tell him that no TT is designed to do what he want to do with it, especially that much weight. wyosteve might consider a truck camper instead of a TT.

george

 

[wyosteve]

Sorry I didn't make it clear guys. I'm only looking at 5th wheels. Either the 24-5 or 27-5. I would never consider towing doubles with a TT and in fact, it's not legal to do so here in Wyo. to my knowledge. Good suggestions on calling Arctic Fox direct. I'll do that later today. Thanks for all the info.

 

[Grizzly]

Sorry I didn't make it clear guys. I'm only looking at 5th wheels. Either the 24-5 or 27-5. I would never consider towing doubles with a TT and in fact, it's not legal to do so here in Wyo. to my knowledge. Good suggestions on calling Arctic Fox direct. I'll do that later today. Thanks for all the info.

Phone # for Northwood Mfg. , makers of Arctic Fox, Nash and Desert Fox is 800. 766. 6274. Ask for Doug, Ted or any of the Reps. All are friendly, knowledgeable and very helpful.

george