Additional Filtration

[Terry Jay]

When i got the 2012 I had them install the quart size oil/water separator and a 1-micron fuel filter just forward of the tank. I also installed the pyrometer, boost and fuel pressure gauges. I try to buy fuel from CFN, but to and from Alaska you take what you can find. After 30,000 miles with no drop in fuel pressure I replaced them both at the last oil change. With the '07 I was replacing the OEM fuel filter every 10-15,000 miles, as the engine would develop a slight irregularity at cruise and the new filter cured it. I had the same fuel suppliers. I be happy. Cheap insurance.
Terry

 

[rwitt]

If you haven't seen the Mopar Severe Duty Filter System, here it is http://www.ebay.com/itm/2005-2012-RAM-2500-3500-CUMMINS-6-7L-DIESEL-SEVERE-DUTY-FUEL-FILTER-SYSTEM-OEM-/400291140049?hash=item5d333611d1&item=400291140049&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr. I'm not associated with this at all, just wanted this to be seen if you haven't already. Check your local dealer for price. Fits trucks back to 2004. Factory approved. If I've violated any forum rules by posting this, I apologize, and will remove it.



Rich

 

[Bill Stockard]

If you haven't seen the Mopar Severe Duty Filter System, here it is http://www.ebay.com/itm/2005-2012-RAM-2500-3500-CUMMINS-6-7L-DIESEL-SEVERE-DUTY-FUEL-FILTER-SYSTEM-OEM-/400291140049?hash=item5d333611d1&item=400291140049&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr. I'm not associated with this at all, just wanted this to be seen if you haven't already. Check your local dealer for price. Fits trucks back to 2004. Factory approved. If I've violated any forum rules by posting this, I apologize, and will remove it.

Rich

I have thought about that kit for my '03 and wondered why the '03s weren't included. Is it because of the factory fuel filter mounted lift pump? i have the in-tank lift pump upgrade. Didn't the '04s have the same lift pump on the fuel filter? Is it because of the limited capacity of the ECM? I'm not interested in a cobbled together fuel filter system... been there and done that and learned my lesson.

Bill

 

[HBarlow]

I wouldn't allow a generous friend to install any of the overpriced unreliable crap like airdog, fass and raptor in my truck for free. Installing those products is paying good money for a high failure rate. There are as many posts about failures of those products as there are reports of installing it.

If I was going to install additional filtration I would use CKelly's recommended kit. I tried a year or so ago to talk him into installing one of his kits for me. He wasn't interested so I've never done anything.

The OEM system has worked very well for me. I don't drive the truck anymore so the chance of experiencing a problem caused by dirty or bad fuel is pretty unlikely.

 

[CKelley1]

i agree fully with you harvey, also i have had your filter built and ready for a year now, it seems like just as i got it built i did not get a trip through where you live. i can send it to you or when i finally get a load through i will install it. you only have to drill one hole and cut the fuel line, takes about 15 minutes. for others here i do not sell the filter, harvey pmed me and asked for one. i respect harveys advice to others on towing and built one for him only. i tow very heavy and overload every thing i own and have for 43 years. i think others should be able to drive like me and i give bad advice, harvey will give advice that is more suteable to newer people. pix 1 taken in north carolina 39,600 cgw 1600 miles one way. pix 2 1,100,000 miles, #ad
#ad

 

[HBarlow]

If you ever have the opportunity to travel this way I'd still like to have it. I have a friend who now lives over toward Clovis who was once a Dodge dealership mechanic and now works on Volvo industrial equipment. He'll install it for me.

 

[A2Z DIESEL]

Does it Filter EMULSIFIED water most do not the cummins and cat would not put in writing like RACOR did. we also have tested it to verify and it is a great filter. That is what Chevy went to in 2011 i believe for their stock element because of the filtering of emulsified water. We have a tool called the sona flow that we used to check flow rates GPH and the stock severe duty kit from dodge is about 40 GPH and their filter does not filter emulsified water also it is 5-7 micron the clearance inside of the common rail injectors is 3. 25-3. 65 micron so why would you put a 5,7 or 10 micron on your truck. The truck in this video is running to of the filters in my other post with a 260 GPH pump flow rate is 210 GPH after all filters @ 2 micro He runs 65-80 PSI of boost, rail pressure never drops. Twin Cp3 and Twin Turbos With a custom head and 28lpm injectors in this run. Truck ran 11. 63@ 117. 80 Truck weighs 7120.


Notice there is only a haze no BLACK SMOKE.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkNnDIERKmA

 

[EDankievitch]

The fuel pump being in the tank on the newer trucks (05 and newer) does a really good job mixing the fuel and any water in the tank. That said the mixed fuel water can pass through the factory single filter design found on the early trucks. The double cartrage design, while not the best is better at removing water.

 

[CKelley1]

A2Z you have some weired ideas. no one on this site could ever find a use for a truck like that. the primary filter does filter emulsified water and take the filters apart and see the superior difference between the two. next the cp3 does not need fuel for cooling like the vp44. the specifications on the cp3 is full output with lp pressure from MINUS 5 psi to + 20 psi. a large number of industrial b engines do not even have lift pumps. in 2003 we were having massive problems with sticking injectors. i ended up traveling to Denver and took some training on the new common rail to figure out the problem. bosh told Chrysler to not use any filter larger than 5 micron absolute, the first thing Chrysler did was to install a 10 micron average. we seen what cat was doing and added the cat filter and instantly the problem disappeared. from the school we were shown how the particles in the 4 micron range may not cause sticking but will bind enough to cause early crystal failure. the filters listed was to protect engines costing up to $50,000 and the filters were designed by the engine manufacture. i know all about dual cp3's we did extensive testing on the one shown in the pix. ats Guaranteed me it would give better mpg by not letting rp drop during injection event. on a dyno with digital scales for fuel usage there was not enough difference that you could even measure. #ad

 

[DClark]

CKelley1,
I like your filter setup and your rational for your choice of filters. It appears and I assume that you are using the in-tank OEM pump. Do you have any problems when making full power? Does this pump supply enough fuel under full power situations? I see what you are pulling by the picture posted.
You also suggested that the fuel pressure be monitored and when it drops, it is time to change the filters. Where do you plumb the fuel pressure gauge into the system? I would assume that it should be between the OEM filter and the cp3. If so, where and how?
D Clark

 

[A2Z DIESEL]

Factory pump does not deliver enough fuel to SUSTAIN you maxim HP. We see lots of 05 with "the better module" with bad injectors. There is a TSB 14-002-2010 research and talk to cummins. Dodge quit using the 5 micron because it caused lift pump failure.

 

[BIGNASTY]

Forum rules and personal integrity do not permit someone to come on the forum owned by TDR and post messages with the clear intent of trying to attract attention to your business and increase sales.



That shouldn't be too hard to understand.

:-laf:-laf HB and WHAT THE HELL DO YOU KNOW ABOUT PERSONAL INTEGRITY????? :-laf:-laf:-laf You have belittled and berated people that just disagree with a view and you have the gall to say something like this your a farce and an A******** BUT YOUR CONSISTENT

 

[Bob4x4]

A2z. I think your tsb# is incorrect... . 14-005-12 maybe what you are referring to

 

[A2Z DIESEL]

i have installed over 300 fass pumps (pumps only) and have not had i fail in over 6 yrs.

 

[firemansdiesel]

A2z. I think your tsb# is incorrect... . 14-005-12 maybe what you are referring to

Bob, do you have info on this new factory Nanonet Fuel/water seperator filter from fleetguard? I seen a press clip on it, but little info on release and specs.

 

[Bob4x4]

Bob, do you have info on this new factory Nanonet Fuel/water seperator filter from fleetguard? I seen a press clip on it, but little info on release and specs.

Not yet... ... ... .

 

[cerberusiam]

next the cp3 does not need fuel for cooling like the vp44. the specifications on the cp3 is full output with lp pressure from MINUS 5 psi to + 20 psi. a large number of industrial b engines do not even have lift pumps.

Wow! Talk about some weird ideas and blatantly false information.



The CP-3 relies solely on fuel to lube and cool it. It also prioritizes fuel to the rail by robbing lube\cooling. In addition, the cavitation on the gear rotor pump destroys MANY of these pumps. Main failure point on the Dmaxes is the pump which take sout injectors with FOD. No lift pump and they wonder why?



The operational range of a CP-3 is -5 to 20 psi, that does NOT mean it will live at -5 psi just that it will run pulling a certain amout fo fuel. Those specs are just general and not to be used as installed in vehicles. It doesn't work in the Dodge truck, never has, never will.



As for what Bosch told who and who did what, the spec on solids for high lifetime on a CR system is 3 micron or less and they have known that for years. The fact is Dodge was too cheap to do adequate filtration even after Cummins told them it was needed. These engines were all sold as with planned obsolesence, period. After the warranty was up it was not Dodge's problem.



A2Z is right as far as the LP goes, barely adequate for normal use and not up to the task if you push it. Then again, it wasn't installed for the engine to run at rated power the bulk of its life. Same with the FASS and AD pumps, they are a solid unit IF they are installed correctly. By far the bulk of the failures are from inadequate install procedures which is another can of worms.



Bottom line, these engines need the same as the 5. 9 in filtration, 3 mircon or less on solids and as much water fitration as possible even if you have to use multiple filters. It works, it is proven no matter what some may think because they have not done it.

 

[AEdelheit]

Hey Ben, thanks again for helping my put together my Fass 95GPM and Racor filter setup, it works great! Its amazing how well the Fass works and holds up for being "Unreliable Crap", I dont personally know anyone who has had a failure when properly installed, though I do know many people with stock LP's that have failed.

I wouldn't worry about getting anyone's panties in a bunch, those particular ones are so bunched up so tight a sawzall with demolition blade couldn't even undo them. If you were somehow doing anything wrong by generously helping us im sure a friendly admin would politely inform you and not some bitter old man on a power trip that seems to think his an admin. Please continue as you were and ignore those who think your an idiot if you own anything but a stock 3500 dually to tow your fishing boat.

 

[DClark]

Wow! Talk about some weird ideas and blatantly false information.

The CP-3 relies solely on fuel to lube and cool it. It also prioritizes fuel to the rail by robbing lube\cooling. In addition, the cavitation on the gear rotor pump destroys MANY of these pumps. Main failure point on the Dmaxes is the pump which take sout injectors with FOD. No lift pump and they wonder why?

The operational range of a CP-3 is -5 to 20 psi, that does NOT mean it will live at -5 psi just that it will run pulling a certain amout fo fuel. Those specs are just general and not to be used as installed in vehicles. It doesn't work in the Dodge truck, never has, never will.

As for what Bosch told who and who did what, the spec on solids for high lifetime on a CR system is 3 micron or less and they have known that for years. The fact is Dodge was too cheap to do adequate filtration even after Cummins told them it was needed. These engines were all sold as with planned obsolesence, period. After the warranty was up it was not Dodge's problem.

A2Z is right as far as the LP goes, barely adequate for normal use and not up to the task if you push it. Then again, it wasn't installed for the engine to run at rated power the bulk of its life. Same with the FASS and AD pumps, they are a solid unit IF they are installed correctly. By far the bulk of the failures are from inadequate install procedures which is another can of worms.

Bottom line, these engines need the same as the 5. 9 in filtration, 3 mircon or less on solids and as much water fitration as possible even if you have to use multiple filters. It works, it is proven no matter what some may think because they have not done it.

Okay Cerb, Let's cut to the chase here. I asked if the OEM LP is up to the job. You agree with A2Z that it is just adequate. CKelly, a heavy hauler, seems to be getting along with the OEM LP. If in your opinion it is not up to the job, then what aftermarket LP is best IYO? And what is the proper installation, pre filter or post, push or pull? I have a FASS on my "98 24V, mounted on the frame so that it pulls from the tank and pushes to the VP44. That seem to work in that situation. What is proper for the "05? I appreciate your input here.
D Clark

 

[cerberusiam]

Okay Cerb, Let's cut to the chase here. then what aftermarket LP is best IYO?

"Best" is so realtive to a personal preference it is hard to define. Ckelly, TCDiesel, AEdelheit, along with PowerJoke (big long fight over Walbro many moons ago) all think they have the "best" setup for their needs, and, I doubt anybody could convince them otherwise. It is all relative to what one wants to believe and how well it suits their needs.



What would I do? That is a lot easier.



I happen to believe that removal of entrained air has some long and short term benefits. Comes from spending hours communicating with Pittsbutgh Diesel and several long haul truckers using them. That leaves AD and FASS for the pump systems. I also happen to believe an additional fuel heater at the pump has some benefits. Since I believe in supporting locally (web site) that leaves a FASS from Genos Garage for a fuel pump. Titanium becuase I think it is th eonly one that has the air removal as part of it, you can get an good water seperators for it, and it has a fuel heater. Considering some of the prices for the HD filtration kits plus the cost of a pump, I think it is a wash. I WILL SEND THE WARRANTY CARD IN THE VERY FIRST THING. Thats the important part simply because it doesn't matter what you buy you could get a lemon. Every single manufacturer has had problems with quality of supplied parts.



My Recipe:



FASS Titanium with 10 um fuel filter and best water sperator available plus fuel heater



GDP fuel cannister with 1/2 fittings for suction



3/8 fuel line to the stock cannister



Retain stock cannister, fuel heater, and use 5 or 7 um filter



3 um filter between stock cannister and CP-3







I don't know of anything "better" than the above, IMO.