2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission Rear disc brake conversion

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Been too busy lately and waiting for some other parts to come in (Energy Suspension bushings for the rear that I want to do the same time). It will be at least a week before I get to it unfortunately.

I took some pics of what's in the kit, I got the Dana 70 kit with emergency brake option and also the $50 hose extension kit. . . photos in this album http://s113.photobucket.com/albums/n228/VMac822/Misc post photos/

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Well this week I am back in town and have some time, but the weather isn't cooperating. . . been around 50 but very windy and some rain. But good news is SE Washington is supposed to be sunny and mid 60s this weekend

 

[RLaJeunesse]

A little off subject but I happened to got t some low rate you pull it junk yard near work for a unrelated part. Anyway I walked in and low and behold there blocked up on some old rims was a 2002 2500 with hybrid 80 with disk brakes complete from rotor to rotor. Well any way its a pull and pay place. Well to make it short they have set prices for different parts. I paid 136. 00 plus tax and 11. 00 core charge. So for 150. 00 bucks I got a 80000 mile rear end in perfect shape for next to nothing. Like my brother in law said every dog has his day. Just wanted to share my one in a life time deal.

 

[HBarlow]

You did get a deal! That rear end assembly may have been worth ten times what you paid for it. If I was driving a Gen II truck with a Dana 70 and drum brakes I'd probably pay $1000 for it and not complain.

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

A little off subject but I happened to got t some low rate you pull it junk yard near work for a unrelated part. Anyway I walked in and low and behold there blocked up on some old rims was a 2002 2500 with hybrid 80 with disk brakes complete from rotor to rotor. Well any way its a pull and pay place. Well to make it short they have set prices for different parts. I paid 136. 00 plus tax and 11. 00 core charge. So for 150. 00 bucks I got a 80000 mile rear end in perfect shape for next to nothing. Like my brother in law said every dog has his day. Just wanted to share my one in a life time deal.

You got a deal! I really thought about getting a newer axle with disk brakes, my truck is 2wd and the problem is 2000-up axles are 2" wider than '99 down and I was afraid having the rear tires sticking out more than the front would be noticeable. Shouldn't be that noticeable on a 4x4, especially being the track width of the front axle is a bit wider than the rear on all 2nd Gen 4x4s anyway.

 

[Matt42]

The rear disc brake conversion is something I've been thinking of doing for many years. But other expenses have come first. (House payments, food, clothing, the usual nonsense. ) In the meantime, I installed a PacBrake and went with the 1 ton rear cylinders. Those have been satisfactory. At least for me.

 

[JMcCoy]

I too liked the results from the GM wheel cylinders. I now have a disk brake Dana 80 w/ 4. 10 to replace my drum Dana 70 with 3. 55. I hope to install it in the next few weeks.

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

OK, FINALLY got my rear disk brakes installed! Worked hard in the blazing sun all day a couple days ago (OK it was only 77F) but I'm happy with the results Definitely improved the braking power. Bolted up good and no surprises. Still have to fab up brackets to secure the parking brake cables but hopefully will get to it in the next 2-3 weeks. I don't expect that to be too difficult.

It's never a perfect world and the only quibbles I have are there's a little more pedal travel before braking commences (as expected due to larger pistons), and you have to use thin spacers between the hub and rotor to get proper alignment for the caliper, which brings it out on the thinner threaded portion of the lugs and therefore not a tight fit. Probably not a big deal though. The spacers came with the kit. Glad I did it and feel it's worth it and glad the lower-priced Blackbird kit did the job.

When braking hard the rears come close to locking up, they are definitely generating more braking power.

Last bit of info is I weighed all the parts and pieces to see if I saved much weight doing the conversion:

Drum brake setup weight for one side (drum, shoes, piston, hardware) 60. 2 lbs
Disk brake setup for one side (caliper, pads, rotor, hardware) 36. 9 lbs
Weight reduction of over 23 pounds which is 46 lbs less unsprung weight and less rotating mass (the drum weights quite a bit more than the rotor).

Next week I will start a new thread with pictures. I also removed my rear leaf springs and replaced the bushings with Energy Suspension poly bushings. I'm loving the ride now (where's that Rock smiley??)

 

[moparguy]

Vaughn, the unsprung weight reduction HUGE. You said you're loving the ride, is it an easily quantifiable improvement? Where my 3500 comes up most short is rough washboard roads. I could almost justify the conversion on ride improvement alone if it makes the poor secondary roads I drive a little less bone jarring.

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Moparguy I don't know if it would be worth it just for weight savings, when I did mine I also got rid of the overload springs and between all that it is rather noticeable and nice. I have a Dana 70 which is definitely lighter in the first place.

Well after a few days and several hundred miles later I'm still liking the brakes a lot. The added pedal travel I mentioned previously has cleared up and it's back to normal, must have been a little air that took a few days to work its way out of the system.

I hauled a Dodge Dakota and then an old Massey Ferguson tractor on a flatbed last weekend and it was so nice having good braking power.

Vaughn

 

[budnate]

sounds great, how did the E Brake part of the install work out?

 

[Matt42]

I'm curious about the E-Brake part. Does the Blackbird kit use an internal "hat" drum system or does is use the actual calipers? Forgive my ignorance. Being talked out of retirement increased my workload and ate my free time.

 

[AClayton]

Uses the traditional rear disc kit parts..... Chevy front rotors w/ calipers off a 3/4ton. If you choose the e-brake option, you get the caddy e-brake calipers. The owner and the guy responsible for designing the vast majority of the parts for this kit from Blackbird kind of discouraged the use of the e-brake calipers because of their problematic nature. Problematic being: the lack of holding power when compared to drum style e-brake clamping force and the major factor was the fact that how often the e-brake is used... ... meaning they seize up and become a nuisance due to lack of use and they require almost constant adjustment.

I installed the kit without the caddy calipers and chose to source a transfer case e-brake... . which I will purchase later due to the expense of the kit. I love the positive and active engagement of the rear brakes! I did however, experience the same basic vague pedal for a few days also..... and then it just went away and now everything works better than ever!

 

[ChrisOlson]

Joe I'm glad to hear Blackbird has a decent kit because I just ordered it yesterday. I talked to the owner and he said Dodge used about 13 variations/spacer setups on the eBrake and that it wasn't practical to include a perfect bolt-on kit. Said it would require a little fabricating but I'm not too concerned.



The last two trucks I've had, '98s with Dana 70s, have both had troublesome rear brakes, mostly tweaked/warped drums that cause a lot of shaking upon braking. I just want better brakes and decided since I like my latest truck a lot I'm going for it. One plus for me is you lose several pounds of unsprung weight off the rear end.

Hey Vaughn

How is it Going?? Funny this thread should pop up when it did as I just finished my road trip to FLA I love everything about the 99 EXCEPT the Brakes and the Steering. I am going to consider this blackbird kit based apon the reccomendations here. Are you happy with the E brake caliper???... ... . Now If I could just resolve this steering wander?



the Trip to FLA after the VP44 Replacement

The Blue Chip Pump worked great, Smarty???? I am not sold on the whole Smarty thing. The Edge Comp offered way more performance. but i did not install because i wanted the longevity for the blue chip pump, Maybe i will grow some and stack it with the smarty one day.



keep me posted on the brake upgrade.



Later



Chris

 

[Matt42]

Has anyone made the Blackbird conversion on one of the Dana 80 axles? Are the spacer and fabrication issues about the same?

 

[AClayton]

Mine was done a dana 80

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

As an update to my rear brake conversion the brakes are well seated and work awesome. I put a set of slotted rotors and new pads up front and the combination did wonders for braking power. The brakes are every bit as good as my 3rd Gen I used to have. Pedal feel is greatly improved over what the drums provided and much less pedal travel before braking starts. It cost a few bucks but this was an upgrade definitely worth doing. I still need to get the parking brake setup done but I'll get there eventually.

 

[JR]

About how many miles have you put on them? I'm Looking at a complete rear brake job, original shoes are nearly worn and drums are warped. I'M really not looking forward to spending a couple hundred bucks to replace my mediocore rear brakes. Looking at the kits I don't know if I'm sold on the parking brake, in my experiences those set ups have not lasted very well in humid climates, particularly the winter months when you throw salt in the mix. I like the fact they offer the kit both ways, with and without the parking brake kit.

 

[Regcabguy]

I did the proportioning valve delete,Chevy wheel cylinders and EGR rear disc conversion. The EGR kit left me with longer pedal travel and an inadequate e-brake. A Pacbrake finally enabled my '98. 5 to stop reasonably well. I looked for quite a while for a 2001. 5 rear axle.

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

diesel4life I've gone 5000 miles since installing the kit.

Regcabguy maybe removing the proportioning had something to do with the longer brake travel? I didn't touch mine, there is an adjustable aftermarket one you can get if braking is out of balance after converting to rear disks. The rears don't lock up under hard braking and the ABS kicks in when I slam the brake pedal. As for EGR I'm not sure they're all they're touted to be, I did their blueprinted calipers and braided SS lines on another truck and ended up with mushy brakes.