2015 auto or manual trans?

[andymac]

The G56 is really a pathetic excuse for a transmission in these trucks, opting for an auto is by far the better choice. Exactly oppositie of what it used to be but engine management and trans management has come a long way since the 47RE. For a multi-use truck and the ease of driving the auto cannot be beat.

I guess I had better give my nickels worth on this topic. I currently own 6 trucks with the G56 plus 3 new 2014 trucks with the G56 (A 5500, 3500 and 2500, all 4x4). In my business my trucks pull trailers all day long, up long grades, many times in 4 wheel drive, with shifting loads (cattle) and have not had one single issue with this transmission. I have all kinds of employees that some really arent the best with the clutch and have yet to touch a clutch on any truck. Is the auto (any flavor) easier to tow, of course. You just point the truck in the right direction and press go. I appreciate having the control on the truck. I dont care what they say about controlling the transmission with push button autos, you are still at the mercy of a computer. I just dont like that. Yes, I know I am old school but I have really like the G56 and manual trannies. I would venture a guess that few companies in the US have as many manual trannied trucks as I do. As long as I can buy them I will and realize that my days are numbered because most folks dont want to mess with shifting. I just completed a roundtrip to Oklahoma and back (2500 miles) and got 22.4 MPG highway on my 2500. I get about 19 on my 4.10 dually. Pathetic transmission? I dont think so. Now if only they didnt build the beds on these trucks out of cardboard we would be talking. Have yet to make it past 20,000 miles without a totaled (cracked) bed.

 

[Newsa]

I guess I had better give my nickels worth on this topic. I currently own 6 trucks with the G56 plus 3 new 2014 trucks with the G56 (A 5500, 3500 and 2500, all 4x4). In my business my trucks pull trailers all day long, up long grades, many times in 4 wheel drive, with shifting loads (cattle) and have not had one single issue with this transmission. I have all kinds of employees that some really arent the best with the clutch and have yet to touch a clutch on any truck. Is the auto (any flavor) easier to tow, of course. You just point the truck in the right direction and press go. I appreciate having the control on the truck. I dont care what they say about controlling the transmission with push button autos, you are still at the mercy of a computer. I just dont like that. Yes, I know I am old school but I have really like the G56 and manual trannies. I would venture a guess that few companies in the US have as many manual trannied trucks as I do. As long as I can buy them I will and realize that my days are numbered because most folks dont want to mess with shifting. I just completed a roundtrip to Oklahoma and back (2500 miles) and got 22.4 MPG highway on my 2500. I get about 19 on my 4.10 dually. Pathetic transmission? I dont think so. Now if only they didnt build the beds on these trucks out of cardboard we would be talking. Have yet to make it past 20,000 miles without a totaled (cracked) bed.

One question. I haven't had issues with my G56, the clutch, or dual mass flywheel.

Have you kept everything stock? (Flywheel/clutch)

 

[andymac]

One question. I haven't had issues with my G56, the clutch, or dual mass flywheel.

Have you kept everything stock? (Flywheel/clutch)

Stock? Absolutely. I need my trucks to work. I dont need them to be the first one off the stop light. I dont care that I have more power with autos. These trucks have more than enough power for the work they do. They have more power than the brakes generally should be stopping. So many folks are obsessed with the power numbers but I frankly could care less. It does the job and does it well. Sounds like my 2500 is exactly like your 2013. When I starting messing with the stock trucks, then the problems usually arent too far behind. My oldest truck is turning 300,000 miles this week with over 2/3 of it locked in 4x4. Not too shabby. I like many buy the truck for the engine as it is the same as many of my tractors. I really dont have any more reason to buy a ram than the driveline that I am comfortable with. If that goes, then all bets are off I reckon.

 

[photowrite]

snip...
Is the auto (any flavor) easier to tow, of course. You just point the truck in the right direction and press go. I appreciate having the control on the truck. I dont care what they say about controlling the transmission with push button autos, you are still at the mercy of a computer. I just dont like that. Yes, I know I am old school but I have really like the G56 and manual trannies. I would venture a guess that few companies in the US have as many manual trannied trucks as I do. As long as I can buy them I will and realize that my days are numbered because most folks dont want to mess with shifting.

What an excellent, real world testimonial from an owner of a fleet of G56 trucks!

 

[Newsa]

What an excellent, real world testimonial from an owner of a fleet of G56 trucks!

I agree. It counters many of the personal prejudices that are posted here as fact by a majority of automatic owners.

I bought a Ram instead of Duramax because of the manual transmission. I hope that Ram doesn't go the way of Ford & GM and lose the manual transmission.
Since owning the Ram, I have developed a respect for the Cummins powerplant.

There apparently is some testimony that the stock Dual Mass Flywheel can fail when worked hard. And there are comments that the stock clutch may be the weakest link in the drivetrain. But it is reassuring to see that these stock drivetrain components are standing up to Comercial use. I use mine for daily & recreational use. I thought maybe I got myself into a towing situation where I smoked the clutch. But it is still working fine, so I won't worry about it and won't look at aftermarket solutions just yet. I'm usually pretty easy on the clutch, but the fact that the reverse gear was not geared low as I needed, forced me to ride the clutch and smell some burnt clutch plate. The automatically adjusting clutch, accommodated that so I wouldn't have to.

 

[andymac]

I agree. It counters many of the personal prejudices that are posted here as fact by a majority of automatic owners.

I bought a Ram instead of Duramax because of the manual transmission. I hope that Ram doesn't go the way of Ford & GM and lose the manual transmission.
Since owning the Ram, I have developed a respect for the Cummins powerplant.

There apparently is some testimony that the stock Dual Mass Flywheel can fail when worked hard. And there are comments that the stock clutch may be the weakest link in the drivetrain. But it is reassuring to see that these stock drivetrain components are standing up to Comercial use. I use mine for daily & recreational use. I thought maybe I got myself into a towing situation where I smoked the clutch. But it is still working fine, so I won't worry about it and won't look at aftermarket solutions just yet. I'm usually pretty easy on the clutch, but the fact that the reverse gear was not geared low as I needed, forced me to ride the clutch and smell some burnt clutch plate. The automatically adjusting clutch, accommodated that so I wouldn't have to.

In my opinion you said something very important here. I really dont think you fully appreciate the torque and power curve of this engine when the computer does the work. When you shift your own gears you, in time, understand exactly where the powerband is, how to maximize your torque and how to stretch the fuel budget. When talking about a burning clutch, we learned many moons ago when backing up that 4x4 low is your buddy. Pop that truck into 4x4 low and the truck creeps around like a tractor. Makes backing up easy and controlled with lots of torque to help you do it. Its not easy backing a 30,000 lb moving load up hill into a corral. Tests your patience and clutch. I talked with our mechanic about our 300,000 mile truck and we have no records nor can remember changing a clutch on this truck. If we had a new clutch not more than one in that time frame. Really not too bad considering the use it has. I think so many folks smoke the clutch with high performance upgrades and want to go fast right now. I guess I am not the man to ask about that. Steady as she goes and this powerplant/driveline is lots of fun.

 

[CMgoFast]

I guess I should have came back and checked this thread sooner. I had no idea it would grow to 7 pages. I'm a diesel truck mech. I love a manual transmission behind my diesel. I want a manual transmission. I also want 860 ftlbs, just because it's there. But for what I tow, mainly just a jeep, I don't think I need the 860 ft lbs. My main concerns are the loss of torque being an issue and the MPG with the manual vs. the auto. I'm 38, I don't mind rowing through the gears, yet. We have a '14 at work with the 68 and it gets 24MPG on the flat highway, empty. How are the manual transmissions on MPG? My 01 gets 16-17. Can i get a manual trans with coil springs in the rear? Giving up 200 ft lbs sounds crazy, but I like manuals.

 

[Newsa]

In my opinion you said something very important here. I really dont think you fully appreciate the torque and power curve of this engine when the computer does the work. When you shift your own gears you, in time, understand exactly where the powerband is, how to maximize your torque and how to stretch the fuel budget. When talking about a burning clutch, we learned many moons ago when backing up that 4x4 low is your buddy. Pop that truck into 4x4 low and the truck creeps around like a tractor. Makes backing up easy and controlled with lots of torque to help you do it. Its not easy backing a 30,000 lb moving load up hill into a corral. Tests your patience and clutch. I talked with our mechanic about our 300,000 mile truck and we have no records nor can remember changing a clutch on this truck. If we had a new clutch not more than one in that time frame. Really not too bad considering the use it has. I think so many folks smoke the clutch with high performance upgrades and want to go fast right now. I guess I am not the man to ask about that. Steady as she goes and this powerplant/driveline is lots of fun.

You're right. I waited too long to put it in 4x4 low. I did when my rear tires finally broke loose on dry pavement. I usually hesitate to use 4×4 on dry pavement because that's what the owners manual says and I don't like the tire hop I get.
Trailer was off the pavement, but truck was on the pavement. Rear tires broke loose even with the extra weight of the trailer.

 

[Newsa]

I guess I should have came back and checked this thread sooner. I had no idea it would grow to 7 pages. I'm a diesel truck mech. I love a manual transmission behind my diesel. I want a manual transmission. I also want 860 ftlbs, just because it's there. But for what I tow, mainly just a jeep, I don't think I need the 860 ft lbs. My main concerns are the loss of torque being an issue and the MPG with the manual vs. the auto. I'm 38, I don't mind rowing through the gears, yet. We have a '14 at work with the 68 and it gets 24MPG on the flat highway, empty. How are the manual transmissions on MPG? My 01 gets 16-17. Can i get a manual trans with coil springs in the rear? Giving up 200 ft lbs sounds crazy, but I like manuals.

Best mileage I ever got.was right after unhooking the trailer. I was getting between 22 & 23 mpg hwy. The lie -o - meter was telling me 24 mpg, but it is usually optimistic by one mpg . I think the truck reached it's peak efficiency pulling the trailer. I've seen as low as 20 mpg hwy unloaded and going 70.

You will get better hwy mileage with the double overdrive of either the 68rfe or Aisin.
The manual transmission is lighter than the automatics, but spins the engine faster because it has only one overdrive gear.

 

[andymac]

Best mileage I ever got.was right after unhooking the trailer. I was getting between 22 & 23 mpg hwy. The lie -o - meter was telling me 24 mpg, but it is usually optimistic by one mpg . I think the truck reached it's peak efficiency pulling the trailer. I've seen as low as 20 mpg hwy unloaded and going 70.

You will get better hwy mileage with the double overdrive of either the 68rfe or Aisin.
The manual transmission is lighter than the automatics, but spins the engine faster because it has only one overdrive gear.

I would guess my highway mileage at 22 - 23 but thats with 100 gal of diesel in the bed, a ranch hand front bumper replacement on the front to the tune of who knows how many lbs and my big rump behind the wheel. If they could allow that engine to breathe a little without the EPA nonsense on the exhaust I can only imagine how that truck would do. But they certainly have made improvements as I have neighbors with early 2010-2011 trucks who can't negotiate 16 MPG if their lives depended on it.

 

[Deleted member 995608]

Something I've noticed over the last few months (both TDR and Forum B) is that I've read more complaints about the Aisin or 68RFE than I have the G56. Hmmmmmmm.

 

[Ram4Sam]

Something I've noticed over the last few months (both TDR and Forum B) is that I've read more complaints about the Aisin or 68RFE than I have the G56. Hmmmmmmm.

Factor in that there are probably way more trucks sold with the auto trans than with the sticks.........

Sam

 

[RVTRKN]

Andymac, I'm glad your having such good luck with your G56's. That was my attitude when I got mine, until the ECM got screwed up and took out my clutch. (Long story that has not ended yet) Since my SMF with a dual disk clutch was installed to hold the power that the completely stock truck ECM is capable of when it glitches will hold, it's noisey and runs hot. I strongly recommend you install a temp sensor to see just how hot they get. I also recommend you PM TDR member CKelley1 and compare notes, for he also has a fleet of G56's behind all versions of engines and the different G56's, which all has had DMF failures. As I mentioned, mine was not a DMF failure and it only had 35K miles when clutch was replaced.

 

[photowrite]

In my opinion you said something very important here. I really dont think you fully appreciate the torque and power curve of this engine when the computer does the work. When you shift your own gears you, in time, understand exactly where the powerband is, how to maximize your torque and how to stretch the fuel budget. When talking about a burning clutch, we learned many moons ago when backing up that 4x4 low is your buddy. Pop that truck into 4x4 low and the truck creeps around like a tractor. snip...

Years ago I wrote an article in the Power Stroke Registy (among many others) that detailed my use of 2WD low-range in an F-350 for backing a trailer. The ZF-S5 transmission in the F-350, even with 4.10:1 diff gears, had a much taller reverse gear I preferred for slow backing of a relatively light trailer. Since that truck had manual-locking-hubs, it was easy to shift into 4WD and use the gear reduction without any concern about 4WD bind on dry ground.

That said, if the front wheels are not turned much the drivetrain will handle a little bind and I will still use low-range as needed on my '14 Ram 2500 [which has taller gearing]. A very skilled, fine control of the clutch [with limited to zero fuel added via the accelerator] can also work, even in high-range, for moderate loads... Though I love low gearing and for 30,000 pounds low-range sounds like a smart option to preserve the clutch.

 

[Newsa]

Now if only they didnt build the beds on these trucks out of cardboard we would be talking. Have yet to make it past 20,000 miles without a totaled (cracked) bed.

Question about the cracked beds: Do you think it is from frame flex? Gooseneck flex?

Do you think the stronger frames of the 2014 will give you better service?

And which brand of gooseneck do you use?

My 2013 has the 2012 frame.

 

[andymac]

Andymac, I'm glad your having such good luck with your G56's. That was my attitude when I got mine, until the ECM got screwed up and took out my clutch. (Long story that has not ended yet) Since my SMF with a dual disk clutch was installed to hold the power that the completely stock truck ECM is capable of when it glitches will hold, it's noisey and runs hot. I strongly recommend you install a temp sensor to see just how hot they get. I also recommend you PM TDR member CKelley1 and compare notes, for he also has a fleet of G56's behind all versions of engines and the different G56's, which all has had DMF failures. As I mentioned, mine was not a DMF failure and it only had 35K miles when clutch was replaced.

Sounds like I have been lucky. I have trucks going back to the I think its the second run of G56's (Is that 2006? if I recall?). They see pavement about 1 mile per 20, they pull in 120 degree temps in the desert with dust, dirt and a loaded trailer nearly every mile. I have a few trucks that have not been unhooked from a trailer in over a year. The vibration that these trucks have is enough to make the dash fall in your lap (literally). The door panels fall off. Power window motors are good for a year at best. Two trucks dont even have front fenders after two bulls wanted them as horn emblems. My point is I doubt many have the extreme use my trucks do and at least my trannies and engines still work and work well. I guess I am fortunate. The last thing I want in the middle of nowhere is another computer to foul and I dont need a sensor to tell me its hot, I cooked a sandwich on my dash )I know its hot). As for the cracked beds, I just bought a new 2014 2500 and the bed didnt make it to 20,000 miles. As usual I go to the dealer (3 hour trip) and they give me the run around. You must be abusing it etc. They say they are the "official truck" of the rancher yet when a rancher has a quality issue they leave you hanging. The Fords we have do exactly the same thing and crack at the same place (front corners) but they do it at around 150K miles. So no more pickups. Only chassis cabs. Anyway, I digress. What were we talking about?

 

[andymac]

Question about the cracked beds: Do you think it is from frame flex? Gooseneck flex?

Do you think the stronger frames of the 2014 will give you better service?

And which brand of gooseneck do you use?

My 2013 has the 2012 frame.

No doubt, it is the vibration. I think the frames are fine. This new one has the factory gooseneck option. Never really had any frame issues.

 

[Newsa]

Makes sense to me that Andymac using his truck in low gears and 95% on dirt/mud is taking it easy on his g56.

 

[Newsa]

Andymac, which gooseneck hitch do you use?

 

[andymac]

Andymac, which gooseneck hitch do you use?

With the exception of the 2014 2500 that has the factory option, I use American made only hitches. Usually B&W. As per the discussion on the clutch, If I recall I had a 2009 Ford (It is the 2009 Red Ford F350 on the destroked ads in the diesel power magazine) that was converted to a commonrail with a manual transmission as well. We had to replace the clutch and did so with a LUK clutch. That clutch was really smooth and had a nice engagement. So I stand corrected, I did have to replace a clutch one time. That LUK clutch was really nice and no more DMF. Nope, they didnt pay me to say that.