P207f & 5mph in 200 miles warning

[Bob Snively]

I got these with service def, see dealer. called dealer & was told diagnosis was $130 & if def was bad another $350. so i checked def & sure enough it was, drained it & put in new def , turned off cel, but dont know how to turn off message warning. any body know?

 

[Wayne M.]

How did you determine your fluid was bad?

 

[Newsa]

Was your DEF from the bottle? Or a pump?

 

[Bob Snively]

I pulled the filler neck off the def tank & used a hydrometer type tester from napa. the bad fluid was in a plastic jug- no cardboard box

 

[Wayne M.]

I pulled the filler neck off the def tank & used a hydrometer type tester from napa. the bad fluid was in a plastic jug- no cardboard box

Good to know about that tester. And welcome to the TDR. I'm sure someone will know how to erase the message. Perhaps X amount of starts will do it if the DTC is gone?

 

[gsbrockman]

the bad fluid was in a plastic jug- no cardboard box

Seems like all the more reason to use bulk DEF at the pump.

 

[Bob4x4]

If all the codes have been cleared and the def warning is stillon the pcm will have to be overflashed

 

[OilnGas]

You can disconnect the batteries - positive side, leave for 5 mins and reconnect batteries this will reset the DEF warning...

 

[Newsa]

You can disconnect the batteries - positive side, leave for 5 mins and reconnect batteries this will reset the DEF warning...

I tried that over a year ago. Didn't work. So i disconnected the batteries and left it over night (10 hours). Didn't clear anything. There is a capacitor (that energizes) or memory card in the ECM that records and holds onto this info.????????

 

[Wayne M.]

It's been my experience that when it comes to these diesel emission type codes, the ones like an overloaded DPF or a malfunctioning system like the DPF or SCR system, these codes are not easily erased unless jumping through the proper hoops.

 

[Minnow101]

Is this type of tester you bought ?
http://www.amazon.com/Thexton-THE108-Tester/dp/B00A9YLRWC/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1456369434&sr=8-2&keywords=def+tester

 

[Bob4x4]

The OTC refractometer i use is under $100 now

 

[JDean]

So I'm towing a 16,000 lb 5th wheel with a 2014 Ram 3500 dually. Almost 30,000 miles on the truck, so I change the fuel filters and the air filter before *we leave Benson NM on our way to Elephant Butte. Last thing I did the day before we left was add a jug of Blue DEF since I was showing about 3/8 of a tank and I always use it much faster when I'm towing. The next day we're on the road and get a "Service DEF, see dealer" message on the EVIC. I didn't notice a mile warning, but that must've been my 200 mile warning. Message goes away, but comes back as "Service DEF, see dealer. 125 miles before the truck will be limited to 5 mph." or something close to that. That sounds bad so we start looking for a town big enough to have a Dodge dealer. The 125 mile warning goes away but comes back as a 100 mile warning that remains on and begins a countdown to 5 mph doom. At 98 miles left we pull off at Deming NM. My OBD scanner shows P207f which appears to be a generic code for "something is whacked".

This was on a Sunday. Called the dealer several times on Monday but couldn't get an appointment (their computers were down). Finally got a guy late Monday that said to bring it the next morning a leave it and they would try to work it in. So that's what I did. On Wednesday, they change the DEF but can't get the system "to regen" whatever that means so now they want to replace the catalytic converter. Parts are on back order, no estimate on how long but we have a priority request. The only car rental in town has no cars available. I'm going to load the Über app on my phone. Hopefully a serial killer won't show up.
- John D

 

[Wayne M.]

I commented about seeing this message and code P0207F in a Ford power stroke 6.7. It seems to be an issue spanning the brands and vehicle size. Peak know about this. Here's a link.
http://www.peakhd.com/product-lines/BlueDEF/faq/
It seems that there's an issue with the NoX sensor feedback during def usage on the road. The different manufacturers are tackling it differently, but most involve a PCM reprogram. Regarding the vehicle I was involved with, the DEF was checked with a refractometer (ok) and received a PCM update with success.

 

[gsbrockman]

Last thing I did the day before we left was add a jug of Blue DEF since I was showing about 3/8 of a tank and I always use it much faster when I'm towing. The next day we're on the road and get a "Service DEF, see dealer" message on the EVIC.

What was the date code of the DEF you dispensed????

 

[Newsa]

What was the date code of the DEF you dispensed????

This is a good question. However, the only manufacturer that used to put date codes on Def containers was PEAK. However, i believe they stopped doing that the past 2 years. (Unless i am mistaken.)

The old (Peak) date codes would tell give you a rough idea of when it expires and where it was manufactured. But either they changed their codes, or stopped putting date codes because they don't look like the old codes. And i haven't been able to figure out the hieroglyphics on the last two 2.5 gallon cartons i bought. If his wasn't in a carton, it wasn't likely Peak.

Maybe someone at the store took the DEF out and put in H2O? Question is...... was it sealed?

 

[JDean]

It seems that there's an issue with the NoX sensor feedback during def usage on the road. The different manufacturers are tackling it differently, but most involve a PCM reprogram. Regarding the vehicle I was involved with, the DEF was checked with a refractometer (ok) and received a PCM update with success.

Thanks for the link. The animation of how def works was about what I thought, but I had never seen it explained like that. I didn't see any mention of a PCM reprogram in the list of issues involving def and the SCR. I imagine the EPA has intentionally made it difficult to recover from this type of problem, or perceived problem, to discourage owners from trying to modify this system. It seems like I've been wrongly accused, but still have to do the time.

 

[JDean]

What was the date code of the DEF you dispensed????

I don't know. I've always put in the blue def in the cardboard box from Walmart, except for one time when I put in def in a blue jug (no box) also from Walmart but that was several months ago. I just figure Walmart must sell a lot of this stuff and hope for the best. The box for blue def is sealed which would seem to preclude tampering, but now I'm wondering if I should buy the test kit for def and test each batch myself. Not sure if I could even trust a date code since peak can't control how it's stored. Plus I need a way to sample and potentially replace def in the tank. My current problem doesn't appear to be the quality of the def, according to the dealer, but using expired def would kick off the same chain of events. - John D

 

[gsbrockman]

However, i believe they stopped doing that the past 2 years. (Unless i am mistaken.)

All DEF sold bearing the API certification symbol is required to ensure that a product traceability code appears on each container of DEF (section 4.3.1)

http://www.apidef.org/API_DEF_OVERVIEW.pdf

 

[Wayne M.]

JDean, every manufacturer except aud/VW calls for some sort of update or reprogram aka a flash in that link.