Choosing a g56 vs a nv5600

[AH64ID]

I take it that, thats the newer trucks. I chose 3:73 from two choices, 4:10 or 3:73 for my 07 C&C AE-G56 . Both trucks (look at sig) run @ 2050 rpm's in sixth @ 70 MPH

Pickups.

C&C can still get 4.10's and 3.73's.

Aside from a few pickups that were subsequently recalled there has never been a factory option for 4.10's and the G56 in a pickup.

 

[RVTRKN]

It's kind of stupid if true, its like the SRW trucks today with the only option of 3:42.

 

[AH64ID]

Been true since 2005.5 when the G56 was introduced.

 

[Tuesdak]

Has anyone figured out why the manual transmissions run so hot?

Here is a look into the NV5600 and the power lube package info is outdated. Replacement cases have the main mod already done to lube the rear bearing and the other spit holes are only done with the customer insisting anymore.

http://blog.genosgarage.com/wordpress1/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/TDR67_MyNV5600.pdf

 

[DClark]

Interesting discussion. As you can see, I have 3 CTDs. First 2 were bought new. '05 was bought used, (low book) 2 previous owners. DMF was already replaced when I bought it. 1446K on the clock. The GN ball and the looks of the floor in the bed told me that it had spent some time on a ranch. It took some getting used to the G56. It was certainly a better tow vehicle then the other 2. Last fall, with no clue that there was a problem, I left home for a 2 mile trip to work and the shifting went from fine at home to not shifting at all on the main drag through town. I limped into my work, shut it down and restarted it and it shifted fine. I assumed it was a clutch associated problem. Drove it straight to my mechanic and had the trany dropped to check the clutch. Yep, the clutch was toast. I told them to ck the input shaft on the G56, as per what has been said on this forum, and yes it was loose. Sent it to a local t-shop and they could not find any parts for the G56 available locally, including the dealer. They asked me if I knew of a t-rebuilder, I sent them to ST in Texas. My trany was on a truck to Texas the next day. It was toast and they advised that financially it was better and quicker to buy a rebuild from them. I'm assuming that mine will become a rebuild later. When it was all said and done, SB clutch, rebuilt trany, shipping, and labor I have 5K in this project. You tell me if an auto is cheaper to own. I wouldn't own a 4sp auto behind one of these D-trucks if I want to tow. I would go for a 6sp however. Well that's my story. I've never owned a NV5600. Truck now has 195K on the clock. It is more comfortable then the 2nd gens, certainly the back seat. It tows my 5th and 20' Bayliner much better then the '98. Can't afford a new one and I don't like all the EPA crap they are forced to equip them with today. I think the ''05 is about a new as you can get and avoid the EPA crap for the most part. 2nd gens still get the better MPGs. I don't know if that helps with the decision on which trany to buy. Good hunting for a truck.
DClark

 

[NIsaacs]

Mine don't run hot, unless you call 190/195 hot. It mostly mirrors the engine temps on a hot day. When I first got this truck I was leery of 6th coming from light duty 5spds so a bought a temp gun and found that I can pull 6th without overheating it. Then I installed a temp gauge and same thing, it does not run hot and I pull in 6th if the road, speed limits, load and grade allows. My opinion is an overfilled transmission will run hot. I change mine every 36k with 15/40 engine oil to the fill plug and have 270k on it now.

Nick

 

[RVTRKN]

I had no idea how hot my NV5600 ever got, my brother owns it now, and is very happy with it. By running different oil concoctions in my G56, from heavy to light weight oils, the temperatures do run cooler with lighter weight oil, the problem running light weight oil is it sounds like my transmission is toast. I've settled on Mobil syn trans 50wt, but it will run hot. However it's a lot quieter and the cooling system I have developed for it really helps a lot. BUT the G56 is gone the next time I have to remove it for clutch or other issues. I hate wondering if my trans is going to grenade while towing at 22K GCW, leaving me stranded in the middle of nowhere, when I could have been proactive and swapped it out to the NV5600.

 

[AH64ID]

IMHO you are far too paranoid about the G56. It's proven to be a lot more reliable than you want to believe.

The old man has 130K on his and most of those are towing in the 18-22K GCW weight range with more than stock power. His DMF lasted for over 100K miles and the trans feels/sounds like it did when new. IIRC he runs redline in it.

 

[ENafziger]

This is a timely discussion, as I am in the same quandry. I have an '06 with the G56 AD that I bought new. In 2011 with 103k on it, I lost 4th and 6th gear. The truck has basically been sitting for 5 years now waiting for a transmission. It looks like I'll finally be able to get it back on the road soon using tax refund money. I'm on the fence as to what transmission to go with. If I only get another 100k out of a G56, I don't want to go that route. The NV5600 is an option. But I've also been considering a ZF6. For those who aren't familiar with it, this is an aluminum cased 6 speed transmission found in the later model Ford diesel trucks. I recently put one in our family vehicle (a 2003 Excursion with a 12valve P-Pumped twin turbo Cummins), and was really impressed. It shifts great!!! Even with a SB double disc clutch, the shifting is smooth and quick. The case is HEAVILY gusseted externally for reinforcement, and it incorporates a pressurized oiling circuit with an integral oil pump. There are transmission lines in/out to send to a cooler and external filter.

In light of the original discussion, if you are going to stay ONLY at stock power levels, maybe the G56 is an option. I had replaced my DMF with a solid flywheel from southbend and a new clutch, and always ran Amsoil ATF in it. It never did shift as smooth as the ZF6. I also was running 35" tires for about 2/3 of the miles, and 37" tires for the other 1/3.

IMO, I would opt for a '05 truck with the NV5600. Or get an '06/early '07 recognizing that the G56 is the weak link.

 

[RVTRKN]

Maybe so, however at 35K miles, the browned bearings/races were replaced and input shaft had to be shimmed back to proper spec. I didn't know temps at that time, and it seemed just fine. Had it done because I was having a SMF installed with a DDS 3250 South Bend Clutch. It was only supposed to be an inspection of the G56. So it must have run hot, also the trans seems noisier than what all other opinions seem to report after a SMF installation. Is your Pops truck a AD version with 4:10 diff? There is a good write up in the TDR mag on the G56 by Joseph Donneley interviewing the man that rebuilt my G56.

 

[AH64ID]

Is your Pops truck a AD version with 4:10 diff?

No, I don't think that was ever offered even in C&C.

AFIK all AD's have 3.73's. The 3.42's weren't even an option until AE's were out and C&C's didn't ever come with a 5.9 and AFIK only the AE has been mated to the 6.7.

 

[Regcabguy]

No, I don't think that was ever offered even in C&C.

AFIK all AD's have 3.73's. The 3.42's weren't even an option until AE's were out and C&C's didn't ever come with a 5.9 and AFIK only the AE has been mated to the 6.7.

That 3.42 sure looks good aside from the cost of install.

 

[RVTRKN]

So your pops truck is completely stock?

 

[AH64ID]

That 3.42 sure looks good aside from the cost of install.

I often think the same about 4.10's. If it weren't for the decrease in speed in 5th I would seriously consider it. Most of my miles are at weight in the mountains.

Too bad no one makes 3.90's.. Thou a AD G56 swap would be better still.

So your pops truck is completely stock?

No. As I mentioned earlier he has more power than stock. I do the tuning and would guess he is in the 350 rwhp range. I would extrapolate that to 400/800 at the crank, give or take.

 

[RVTRKN]

Meaning that it is in the original truck as delivered.

 

[RVTRKN]

This is a timely discussion, as I am in the same quandry. I have an '06 with the G56 AD that I bought new. In 2011 with 103k on it, I lost 4th and 6th gear. The truck has basically been sitting for 5 years now waiting for a transmission. It looks like I'll finally be able to get it back on the road soon using tax refund money. I'm on the fence as to what transmission to go with. If I only get another 100k out of a G56, I don't want to go that route. The NV5600 is an option. But I've also been considering a ZF6. For those who aren't familiar with it, this is an aluminum cased 6 speed transmission found in the later model Ford diesel trucks. I recently put one in our family vehicle (a 2003 Excursion with a 12valve P-Pumped twin turbo Cummins), and was really impressed. It shifts great!!! Even with a SB double disc clutch, the shifting is smooth and quick. The case is HEAVILY gusseted externally for reinforcement, and it incorporates a pressurized oiling circuit with an integral oil pump. There are transmission lines in/out to send to a cooler and external filter.

In light of the original discussion, if you are going to stay ONLY at stock power levels, maybe the G56 is an option. I had replaced my DMF with a solid flywheel from southbend and a new clutch, and always ran Amsoil ATF in it. It never did shift as smooth as the ZF6. I also was running 35" tires for about 2/3 of the miles, and 37" tires for the other 1/3.

IMO, I would opt for a '05 truck with the NV5600. Or get an '06/early '07 recognizing that the G56 is the weak link.

The ZF6 you mentioned seems like a good option, you can purchase a fan cooler from BD

http://www.thoroughbreddiesel.com/bd-diesel/transmission-cooler.htm

It's what I would have chose if I didn't find out about the stock radiator capable of hanging the heat exchanger. (See pics) But the cast iron is what I want as well as the best manual put in a Dodge truck, so I'll stick with the NV5600.

 

[AH64ID]

Meaning that it is in the original truck as delivered.

Clutch was replaced with a SBC SMF around 100-110K. Fluid isn't ATF, otherwise stock.