Aisin Shifting

[sag2]

I noticed something last week while we were camping. I shut the truck off with the EB on, then remote started and it was on when I got in. I don't recall that happening before so don't know if it was just a glitch. Didn't think to try it again to test it out.

 

[Wiredawg]

I noticed something last week while we were camping. I shut the truck off with the EB on, then remote started and it was on when I got in. I don't recall that happening before so don't know if it was just a glitch. Didn't think to try it again to test it out.

My EB is on every time on initial startup for the purpose of speeding engine warming so assume all do this per the owner's manual. As you likely know, C&Cs only are allowed to keep EB switch on at startup for use with driving, but I think the engine warmup occurs regardless if I have switch on or off, which it is never off except under slick driving conditions.

Cheers, Ron

 

[JR]

All these odd Aisin shifting issues threads, coupled with the uptick in price, reduced maintenance intervals, and limited fluid sourcing makes me glad I didn't find one.

Doesn't sound like a deal at all.

 

[dieselshadow]

All these odd Aisin shifting issues threads, coupled with the uptick in price, reduced maintenance intervals, and limited fluid sourcing makes me glad I didn't find one.

Doesn't sound like a deal at all.

It’s really worth it though. You can feel it shift. It’s a real medium duty trans and the truck lets you know that. How many “my Aisin trans just blew up” threads have you read? I haven’t seen a single one really. They do have some issues to, but I believe it’s well worth the trade-off.

My truck reminds you it’s a truck masquerading as a luxury vehicle. My last ‘17 2500 was a luxury vehicle masquerading as a truck. Huge difference.

 

[JR]

I suppose it's all in perspective. If this truck with an automatic transmission can figure out how to shift without all the herky jerky whammy slammy that is spoken of in many threads on here, why can't the 69?

Im not trying to stir the pot. But making an automatic transmission shift like an automatic transmission ain't rocket science, which we've also gotten pretty good at again btw

 

[dieselshadow]

Well, I’m not an expert, nor do I claim to be one. I don’t have the miles that some have accumulated over the years driving a 96. But I can say that mine has smoothed our considerably over the miles and the year I’ve owned it. It’s not silky smooth, but it is markedly better than the day I drive it off the lot.

Your mileage may vary, but I’m very happy with my purchasing decision.

 

[SnoKing]

I got on the freeway last night and put my foot in the 2015 on the on ramp and it made mice smooth but distinct shifts up through the gears. Coming up on 68K on the clock and empty mileage is about the best I have seen in almost 5 years.

 

[Wiredawg]

I suppose it's all in perspective. If this truck with an automatic transmission can figure out how to shift without all the herky jerky whammy slammy that is spoken of in many threads on here, why can't the 69?

Im not trying to stir the pot. But making an automatic transmission shift like an automatic transmission ain't rocket science, which we've also gotten pretty good at again btw

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JR,

I'm on my second Aisin truck and have found it shifts much smoother under load versus empty. I'd say the rig you're showing is anywhere from 16KLbs to 20KLbs as it sits, so is basically always operating loaded. If you could figure out a way to have that transmission in a platform 8Klbs to 10Klbs it might feel a little more firm too. Before deciding on purchasing my 2017 Ram 5500 GCWR 38.5KLb, I test drove and almost pulled the trigger on a Freightliner Sportchassis, GCVWR 40KLb. There was no comparison in ride... the 5500 way better riding, even with air suspension and air seat on the FL. Additionally, even with the noise package (Fatmat) it was very noisy, mostly wind. And the physical dimensions were impractical. The Allison 3000 shifted fine, but still a med duty truck.

My 2017 Ram 5500 was 12.2KLbs everyday and have had folks riding in it comment how smooth it shifts. I'm certainly no transmission expert, just experience owning and driving them, but the Aisin was/is the only auto I would/did purchase for heavy hauling. Also, IMHO, 1st and 2nd are the two gears most susceptible to damage/wear. I interpret the firm (not harsh) shifting as a good thing for durability and efficiency towing and running empty.

Of course this is all opinion, and as we've discussed in the CP4 discussions, the best way to exercise our opinion is at the dealership where we choose to either purchase or not. For me, I would have no hesitation to buy a 2020 Aisin Ram.

As always, good discussion and interesting folks diverse opinions looking at the same thing.

Cheers, Ron

 

[JR]

. If you could figure out a way to have that transmission in a platform 8Klbs to 10Klbs it might feel a little more firm too.

Conversely, if you could figure out how to put that 9L Paccar in a pickup it would probably fold the front end and twist the rear
The point I was trying to make was, that KW is a properly matched system and shifts firm but smooth and predictable, the way I would expect it too.
There is almost a cult like following from the core group on the Aisin and the default answer every time these types of threads come up because it's a "real" transmission... I dunno. Just seems like an odd response especially as these threads become more and more common.

As long as the OP is happy with the performance, that's really all that matters. I didn't intend to take away from the subject at hand.

 

[Cummins12V98]

All these odd Aisin shifting issues threads, coupled with the uptick in price, reduced maintenance intervals, and limited fluid sourcing makes me glad I didn't find one.

Doesn't sound like a deal at all.

I have the "GOLDEN AISIN" with zero of the issues some mention.

 

[SnoKing]

I have the "GOLDEN AISIN" with zero of the issues some mention.

From what I am reading they screwed up the Aisin programming in the 2019(?) and newer trucks. Stuff happens, just like how they screwed up the factory brake controller programming in the 2015+ models.

 

[Wiredawg]

Conversely, if you could figure out how to put that 9L Paccar in a pickup it would probably fold the front end and twist the rear
The point I was trying to make was, that KW is a properly matched system and shifts firm but smooth and predictable, the way I would expect it too.
There is almost a cult like following from the core group on the Aisin and the default answer every time these types of threads come up because it's a "real" transmission... I dunno. Just seems like an odd response especially as these threads become more and more common.

As long as the OP is happy with the performance, that's really all that matters. I didn't intend to take away from the subject at hand.

JR, I actually did understand your point, just drawing my comparison on my experience. And you're right about perspective on this. For my part, I don't feel like I'm almost part of a cult... you could call it a point of discussion, which is what we do here on the TDR. I like mine others dont. I guess you could say the same about the Aisin descenters as almost being a cult too, although I would not think of characterizing them that way.

Cheers, Ron

 

[dieselshadow]

Have you guys actually seen the Aisin sitting next to a 68? It’s a LOT bigger. The clutches are larger, the planetaries are bigger, everything is bigger. It’s a medium duty transmission that wasn’t setup to shift like a fancy grocery getting mom-mobile. It’s designed to work and work hard. If that’s what you want, get it. If you want smoother shifting and an overall nicer luxury vehicle and not the biggest tow monster, than maybe the 68 is the perfect choice.

I’m definitely not slamming the 68 or anyone who made the choice to own one. It’s a perfectly fine transmission and does it’s job very well. Look at the total sales numbers. They speak for themselves.

Transmission choices are just that, a choice. I don’t think it really matters to anyone else here what an owner decided to purchase as long as they were happy.

I pass along my information so others may make an informed decision. I try to not persuade anyone to make an uninformed decision or get what I’ve got because “it’s mine and it’s the best.” Maybe the written factor has taken some texts outside of what they were meant, not sure.

In the end, read up, research, purchase, drive, and smile.

 

[SnoKing]

In Sept of 2015 we sold our boat and did not have time to have a new RAM built before leaving for Arizona between Christmas and New Years. So I started searching for a RAM truck in stock a few weeks before the boat sale closed. The search started in the NW and ended up almost to the Mississippi River.

Requirements I was looking for:
1. Aisin
2. Laramie
3. Bucket Seats
4. No sun roof
5. 5th wheel prep
6. No Nav
7. CC SB

We closed the boat sale on Sept 18th and stayed in the bank to wire the money to John Elway's CJDR in Greeley, Co for the Laramie, 4x4, CC, SB, Buckets, Nav, no sun roof, and no 5th wheel prep. They had three trucks all configured the same in three colors. They all had the same 64,595 MSRP, the Red one was on their web site for 53545(lost leader?), and we did not question the price. We most likely could have gotten the Blue one or Granite one at the same price, but Deep Crystal Red seemed fine. I did not even know it was two tone with the silver until she emailed a picture after we paid for it. We got on a plane Sunday(we had enough air miles to fly first class, did I say this was a great adventure? Well maybe later) and flew from Seattle to Denver. Monday morning the internet sales lady picked us up and the airport motel and drove us a hour North to the dealership and we got the first view of our new truck. We finished the paper work, bought the pucks and wiring kit from them and cancel the back ordered order I had placed online for them. She helped link our phones to the truck, clicked a picture for us and we were off on a great 48 hour trip 1350 miles home with it. Would ever was in the shotgun seat was charged with researching the owners manual when needed to figure out things. We would do this again in a minute. It was a great adventure. Needless to say the truck has never been back to John Elway's service department. I have always been treated great at three different dealerships that have performed recalls on the truck.

 

[HPSimpson]

So Snoking what's this thread about transmission you running the thread off the rails?

 

[SnoKing]

So Snoking what's this thread about transmission you running the thread off the rails?

You do not have to read anything I post, it is up to you.

 

[gsbrockman]

I wish I had the option of a 68RFE in my 2018 RAM 4500 Cab & Chassis.

 

[dieselshadow]

I wish I had the option of a 68RFE in my 2018 RAM 4500 Cab & Chassis.

Why? It’s not like you tow or anything....

 

[Wiredawg]

GS only tows downhill... you don't need as much power OR robustness for that.

Sometimes things soak in slower as I get older... I think I AM a member of the Ram, Cummins, and AISIN Cult. And most followers are members of the Royal Order of the TDR. Heil the leader (Ram, Cummins, Aisin)!

Cheers, Ron Grand PooBah

 

[JR]

Have you guys actually seen the Aisin sitting next to a 68? It’s a LOT bigger. The clutches are larger, the planetaries are bigger, everything is bigger. It’s a medium duty transmission that wasn’t setup to shift like a fancy grocery getting mom-mobile. It’s designed to work and work hard. If that’s what you want, get it. If you want smoother shifting and an overall nicer luxury vehicle and not the biggest tow monster, than maybe the 68 is the perfect choice.

I’m definitely not slamming the 68 or anyone who made the choice to own one. It’s a perfectly fine transmission and does it’s job very well. Look at the total sales numbers. They speak for themselves.

Transmission choices are just that, a choice. I don’t think it really matters to anyone else here what an owner decided to purchase as long as they were happy.

I pass along my information so others may make an informed decision. I try to not persuade anyone to make an uninformed decision or get what I’ve got because “it’s mine and it’s the best.” Maybe the written factor has taken some texts outside of what they were meant, not sure.

In the end, read up, research, purchase, drive, and smile.

They are definitely bigger, both dimensionally and weight. Aside from what you mentioned there is also the PTO. They account for a lot of mass.

I think you are largely still missing the point i am trying to make. I didn't chime in to try and justify what "I" bought. In fact it has nothing to do with the 68rfe and everything to do with the Aisin, the one that so many have commented on asking "is this right?" And it isn't just new guys either. There is a very respectable member who i wont name that has had probably more experience with MD stuff than most here. He has had his in to get looked at for these very issues. At one point he wrote "I've simply learned to ignore it".That's not right, not normal, and not characteristic of any properly tuned automatic transmission regardless of rating. I'm sorry, but it just isn't.
And he isn't alone. Another long time member that changes trucks like some guys I work with change underwear sold his Aisin truck for a 68 because the shifts drove him nuts. There's definitely something more than just explaining away, "it's a real trans".

Maybe it's just Ram and Aisin not working together to get the tuning right. It seems hit and miss with some owners having a finnicky unit and others not. The bad thing is, nobody even knows what else these transmissions are run in So there's nothing else to even compare to. That's another head scratcher. Eaton, ZF, and Allison have their units available across multiple truck manufacturers and are very modular in the aspect they can be upfitted to multiple platforms.