2020 HO. Does anyone trust the computer to tell when to change the oil?

[larryq]

I have a feeling that the dash/computer telling us when to change the oil may be like being led down the primrose path.

I’ve been trusting it so far, but I can’t stop thinking to just go back to every 5k with Rotella T6.

I rarely tow anymore, and a lot more in town driving now that we have retired.

any opinions??

thanks
Larry

 

[Ozymandias]

With T6 I wouldn't worry at all, that will even outlast the computer.
The system's pretty well thought out and takes everything into account, no matter if your towing or commuting or use it as a grocery getter.

 

[Diesel85]

These Cummins trucks make great daily drivers not towing. I know of plenty HO and non-HO operators that tow or haul nothing and have well over 100k no issues. No lift kits. Just stock, other than new tires (either more beefy or more highway style). Ironically, I've heard that they are less problematic over time than the gas version long term -- mostly referring costly EVAP related CELs as the fuel system ages.

I cannot wait till the new 2025 trucks come out with the even higher-high output engine. My right hand is quivering for the want to hit that engine start/run button. My right foot is itching for the fuel pedal experience.

 

[Larry Willard]

I never follow the computer, I change by time/mileage and it never shows a need by the computer. Oil and filters are a lot cheaper than engines.

 

[Diesel85]

I never follow the computer, I change by time/mileage and it never shows a need by the computer. Oil and filters are a lot cheaper than engines.

I know it's not a Cummins, but I change my oil and filter regardless at 1 year or 5,000 miles in my Gen 3 EcoD. In fact, that is what I used to do with my 2002 Cummins.

@Larry Willard -- I totally agree with you!

To put it in perspective, a new Cummins 6.7l engine is ~$25,000. Add installation and you're looking at half a new truck. A new Gen 3 VM Engine for a 1500 is ~$15,000.

Yeah, I'll take my oil filters and oil changes any day.

 

[Tuesdak]

I’ve been trusting it so far, but I can’t stop thinking to just go back to every 5k with Rotella T6.

Dumping the oil early doesn't do anything. You should be doing UOA that actually can tell you something important IF you have some problems coming up. Coolant in the oil, dust from an intake leak, excessive soot, high metals ... Or more importantly it can tell you everything is fine to go the full year or 15,000 miles. Sample the oil at 5,000 miles rather than change it.

You should be using the best oil filter you can get as the limitation is no longer the engine oil, but, oil filters that simply won't go the distance. An example is well known names like Tear-O-Later that are a bad rash all over the internet with torn pleats, allowing unfiltered oil through, supposedly due to excessive cost cutting in manufacturing. The FRAM oil filter coming apart taking a 6.7L engine out is a epic thread on here. The air filter is more critical than either for long engine life.

You get 1 year and 15,000 miles on the oil from the owner's manual. It has (or had) a warranty for going this long. There is a documented exception in the owner's manual and that's using Biodiesel blends higher than 5% that will require more frequent oil changes. Pay attention to the other oil, diesel, we should be discussing more.

My dad had vetted going 5,000 miles on engine oil in a fleet of 600+ 4.3L V6 GM pickups BEFORE GM's Oil Life system came out in 1999. He used UOA and they were getting 250K out of the engines before the pickup fell apart around the engine in oilfield use. GM's oil life system when it did come out, no surprise, would say to change the oil around 5,000 miles.

His program with UOA also found a new backhoe engine with high silicone. The ultimate cure was the factory redesigning the valve covers as they would crack and allow dirt into the engine. The one in his fleet was repaired before the engine was destroyed. Several repairs for cracked valve covers before the final new valve cover design was put on. The UOA avoided the downtime and lost money, jobs billed out the machine by the hour, waiting for an engine to be replaced under warranty.

With rare exceptions the oil change indicators "computers" have been conservative but accurate. Exceptions being a Rube Goldberg timing chains that come apart early and their debris overwhelm a small oil filter and trash the engine. GM revised the oil change intervals shorter to help the timing chains last longer.

 

[larryq]

Dumping the oil early doesn't do anything. You should be doing UOA that actually can tell you something important IF you have some problems coming up. Coolant in the oil, dust from an intake leak, excessive soot, high metals ... Or more importantly it can tell you everything is fine to go the full year or 15,000 miles. Sample the oil at 5,000 miles rather than change it.

You should be using the best oil filter you can get as the limitation is no longer the engine oil, but, oil filters that simply won't go the distance. An example is well known names like Tear-O-Later that are a bad rash all over the internet with torn pleats, allowing unfiltered oil through, supposedly due to excessive cost cutting in manufacturing. The FRAM oil filter coming apart taking a 6.7L engine out is a epic thread on here. The air filter is more critical than either for long engine life.

You get 1 year and 15,000 miles on the oil from the owner's manual. It has (or had) a warranty for going this long. There is a documented exception in the owner's manual and that's using Biodiesel blends higher than 5% that will require more frequent oil changes. Pay attention to the other oil, diesel, we should be discussing more.

My dad had vetted going 5,000 miles on engine oil in a fleet of 600+ 4.3L V6 GM pickups BEFORE GM's Oil Life system came out in 1999. He used UOA and they were getting 250K out of the engines before the pickup fell apart around the engine in oilfield use. GM's oil life system when it did come out, no surprise, would say to change the oil around 5,000 miles.

His program with UOA also found a new backhoe engine with high silicone. The ultimate cure was the factory redesigning the valve covers as they would crack and allow dirt into the engine. The one in his fleet was repaired before the engine was destroyed. Several repairs for cracked valve covers before the final new valve cover design was put on. The UOA avoided the downtime and lost money, jobs billed out the machine by the hour, waiting for an engine to be replaced under warranty.

With rare exceptions the oil change indicators "computers" have been conservative but accurate. Exceptions being a Rube Goldberg timing chains that come apart early and their debris overwhelm a small oil filter and trash the engine. GM revised the oil change intervals shorter to help the timing chains last longer.

 

[larryq]

I use Fleetguard filters exclusively

 

[AH64ID]

The CGI Cummins 6.7 is incredibly easy on oil when everything is working properly with the emissions system. Luckily it’s easy to tell when it’s malfunctioning as the oil volume grows.

Check your oil on a regular basis and change it according to the manual, 12 months, 15K miles, or 500 hours whichever comes first. It’s a waste of money to do it any sooner.

Too much around town driving will cause increased regens which can also increase your oil level and needs to be monitored for if the trucks have a light duty use.

 

[Ram4Sam]

Go with the science.......www.blackstonelabs.com.....for the cost of a 1/2 bag of groceries. My 2nd gen from a few years back.

Sam

 

[AH64ID]

View attachment 141573 Go with the science.......www.blackstonelabs.com.....for the cost of a 1/2 bag of groceries. My 2nd gen from a few years back.

SamView attachment 141573

But you didn't get TBN which, especially on a 5.9, is the single biggest indicator of oil life remaining. Without it the UOA is pretty useless for determining drain intervals.

 

[Ram4Sam]

But you didn't get TBN which, especially on a 5.9, is the single biggest indicator of oil life remaining. Without it the UOA is pretty useless for determining drain intervals.

Not really, I never came close to 15,000 miles in a year (I'm sure the 2nd gen was less than 15,000 miles) so I just changed it every twelve months, so other than curiosity, it was never much or an issue for me.

Sam

 

[AH64ID]

Not really, I never came close to 15,000 miles in a year (I'm sure the 2nd gen was less than 15,000 miles) so I just changed it every twelve months, so other than curiosity, it was never much or an issue for me.

Sam

TBN starts to degrade the first time you start the truck after an oil change. It’s still the main thing to look for (fuel is the other main consideration in a stock 6.7) on a UOA, regardless of miles.

 

[Ram4Sam]

TBN starts to degrade the first time you start the truck after an oil change. It’s still the main thing to look for (fuel is the other main consideration in a stock 6.7) on a UOA, regardless of miles.

I get that....I did an OA on my 2016 last year that included TBN. The OA's on my 2001 were done for wear, fuel in oil, and silicone levels due to performance mods I did, not for oil change mileage. As you can see in Blackstones narrative on the report, there were no fuel, insolubles, or silicone issues (with a K&N no less) so never checked the TBN box on the form.

Sam

 

[AH64ID]

I get that....I did an OA on my 2016 last year that included TBN. The OA's on my 2001 were done for wear, fuel in oil, and silicone levels due to performance mods I did, not for oil change mileage. As you can see in Blackstones narrative on the report, there were no fuel, insolubles, or silicone issues (with a K&N no less) so never checked the TBN box on the form.

Sam

But wear materials and TBN are independent of each other... and Blackstone's comments, well that's funny because their comment about figuring out what you did different and repeating it is a pretty lackluster comment that's typical for them.

The raw data does indeed indicate things were wearing great on that truck, it's only telling part of the story thou.

 

[Ram4Sam]

But wear materials and TBN are independent of each other... and Blackstone's comments, well that's funny because their comment about figuring out what you did different and repeating it is a pretty lackluster comment that's typical for them.

The raw data does indeed indicate things were wearing great on that truck, it's only telling part of the story thou.

It told the story I was after...wear metals and oil contamination due to mods and some hard towing miles. Due to yearly oil changes which were usually around 5000 miles, didn't need a TBN number. They serve me well, apparently not so much for you....

It was a great truck, I was a fool for selling it....

Sam

 

[larryq]

I would like to send in samples for my Ram and my lovely Bride’s 370z Nismo Tech.

my issue has always been how to get a good sample without making a huge mess in the engine compartment!

I have a couple of those hand fluid pumps, but for a simple sample, it’s way overkill, and incredibly messy!

If someone has a part and procedure, that would be great to know!

as a matter of fact, I’m so confident that one of my fellow TDR members has a great method, I’m going to get 4-6 sample kits from blackstone right now!

thanks @ all

L

 

[Diesel85]

I've used large 250 ml syringes you get off Amazon and use a small hose. Stick it in the dip stick hole and draw some oil.

I also use those syringes for adding Diesel Kleen, the no mess method.

 

[larryq]

I called blackstone, and asked the same question.
They pointed me to their pump that accepts the sample bottle as it was made for it!

not cheap at 40$ but looks like the perfect tool!!

I bought 2.
One for the truck one for the Nismo!

will keep them separated in large ziplock bags.

I would like to be able to “flush” them after use, so as to not contaminate the new sample with oil from the old
Sample.

don’t know what to use that won’t ruin the pump and also not contaminate the next sample.

https://www.blackstone-labs.com/product/quick-draw-pump/


any thoughts?

thanks again!
L

 

[AH64ID]

I called blackstone, and asked the same question.
They pointed me to their pump that accepts the sample bottle as it was made for it!

not cheap at 40$ but looks like the perfect tool!!

I bought 2.
One for the truck one for the Nismo!

will keep them separated in large ziplock bags.

I would like to be able to “flush” them after use, so as to not contaminate the new sample with oil from the old
Sample.

don’t know what to use that won’t ruin the pump and also not contaminate the next sample.

https://www.blackstone-labs.com/product/quick-draw-pump/


any thoughts?

thanks again!
L

Pump a bit out thru them before filling the container. That should provide an accurate sample.

I would also avoid Blackstone, they are getting worse and worse reviews across other forums (thou I stopped being impressed with them around 2007). Fleetguard and O.A.I. Testing are the preferred UOA companies per Cummins Rocky Mountain.