Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) 01 HO Towing Twins? Questions

[macdaddy]

Gentlemen

Anyone towing with PDR twins?The truck in question is a 01 HO 6 spd w/4:10's DRW, 2WD 235:85-16's, Edge EZ, Bosch RV 275's, AFE, South Bend Con OFE, PDR 35 turbo, ATS manifold 4" exhaust all necessary gauges. and Jacobs E brake. The weight being towed is 19K. No load patrol necessary.



I guess the question is does anybody have this weight or close to it with twins if so which ones?. Also what kind of fueling and or box?. any EGT data?.



Thank in advance



Mac

 

[ThrottleJockey]

PDR 'Towing Twins', the PDR HX-40 and the PDR HT3B 26 cm2 exhaust housing are a beautiful thing and will pull your 19k loaded trailer down the road at 65 mph with EGTs around 1100* PRE turbo...





BUT... This is PIERS your talkin' about here.



Your 275s AIN'T gonna push a pair of Pier's twins, your'e gonna need some more injector.





A lot more.



Then your gonna need some more clutch. This Twinturbo thing is a slippery slope.

 

[macdaddy]

Hey throttle

Thanks the 01 in question is my buddy's he will be happy with the news. I like your phrase slippery slope, but your right these things can be money pits.

 

[HeavyHauler]

PDR 'Towing Twins', the PDR HX-40 and the PDR HT3B 26 cm2 exhaust housing are a beautiful thing...

Piers uses an HX35/14 with an HT3B/26 for his towing twins for better low end. Using an HX40 puts you in the Street/Strip category. I'm also planning on this combination in the future - I'm trying to get things together as I'm able.

 

[ThrottleJockey]

Piers uses an HX-40 and an HT3B for his towing twins. An HX-40 is too big for street/ strip. It's too laggy. A set of twins featuring an HX-40 will always spool a bit slower than the smallest charger in the combo.



A set of PDR HX-35/14 with an HT3B/26 will light off pretty good. Good for street/ drag racing. Low end grunt is not a concern for towing.



EGT management loaded at highway speed is where a set of compounds will shine while towing.

 

[Beast2B]

http://www.piersdiesel.com/DodgeTwins.htm

ThrottleJockey, check out the link. 35 is for the towing and 40 is for street.

 

[HeavyHauler]

I was just about to post that - hate to say I told you so. It only makes sense when you think about it - why would you need extreme top end performance when you're towing? You're gonna need great acceleration and torque to get that big load moving. You want top end on the strip so you don't run out of motor before you get there.

 

[redfuelrules]

According to the link, you guys are right. That being said, I tow pretty heavy (5,000 trailer/11,000 mini-excavator) with a truck thats mostly stock and accelerating def. isn't a prob (thats what gears are for). The goal is to keep the truck between about 1900 and 2300 rpms all the time (as much as egts allow). For towing you need the most power in that range, not down much lower. What Jockey's saying makes sense to me...



Ben

 

[redfuelrules]

I say that based on what works the best for me when towing, but I'd prob. still go with the hx35 setup if I could afford to seriously look at twins. That would be a great problem to have - trying to decide between two great pairs of turbos like the ones offered by PDR, and I'm sure several others.

 

[ThrottleJockey]

Like Ben said, you don't need a set of TWINS for low end performance, our trucks have this piece of equipment that is PERFECT for low end grunt called a transmission.



Why would you need extreme top end performance while towing? Why would you NEED a set of twins at all. By their very nature, a compound turbocharger system is to improve mid range and high rpm performance. There ain't a set of TWINS made that IMPROVE low end response.

Injectors? Yeah.

Twin turbos? For low end performance?



Unless you guys have figured out a way to bypass the laws of physics and overcome the problem of moving double the amount of mass in a single exhaust stream, no way.



To answer your question, HeavyHauler, a set of twins shines in a towing application by FLOWING a COOLER, more oxygen dense air charge to the combustion chamber by compounding the compression of the intake air with TWO turbochargers working together well within their respective mapwidths rather than one turbo spinning it's guts out making the same amount of boost at a higher temperature. Hence, EGTs are kept in check and empty EGTs are REAL silly like 650 degrees at 70 mph with the ambient temps around 80 degrees outside.



And by the way, PDR twins are NOT extreme high end performance. Using an HT3B as a secondary and a T 105, now THAT'S extreme... .



We don't want lots of boost, we want lots of FLOW when towing.

 

[GIT-R-DONE]

Like Ben said, you don't need a set of TWINS for low end performance, our trucks have this piece of equipment that is PERFECT for low end grunt called a transmission.



Why would you need extreme top end performance while towing? Why would you NEED a set of twins at all. By their very nature, a compound turbocharger system is to improve mid range and high rpm performance. There ain't a set of TWINS made that IMPROVE low end response.

Injectors? Yeah.

Twin turbos? For low end performance?



Unless you guys have figured out a way to bypass the laws of physics and overcome the problem of moving double the amount of mass in a single exhaust stream, no way.



To answer your question, HeavyHauler, a set of twins shines in a towing application by FLOWING a COOLER, more oxygen dense air charge to the combustion chamber by compounding the compression of the intake air with TWO turbochargers working together well within their respective mapwidths rather than one turbo spinning it's guts out making the same amount of boost at a higher temperature. Hence, EGTs are kept in check and empty EGTs are REAL silly like 650 degrees at 70 mph with the ambient temps around 80 degrees outside.



And by the way, PDR twins are NOT extreme high end performance. Using an HT3B as a secondary and a T 105, now THAT'S extreme... .



We don't want lots of boost, we want lots of FLOW when towing.

With that being said, how much can one realistically see in EGT drop by going to twins? Are twins something you can put on a close to stock truck or do you have to have the fuel(injectors) to spin them? Understanding that this is a slippery slope here... .

 

[Beast2B]

the slope is slippery, and lined with bombs of every size (and cost)!

yes, you do need the injectors to spin the turbos, but at the same time you're making much more effiecient use of the fuel you inject at a wider range of rpm/boost.

i've seen posts of 200-300 degree drops at the same boost with twins. also see drops with nitrous, cams, port/polish heads... how far do you want to go? someone recently said that power increases *WITH GOOD TEMP CONTROL* get exponentially more expensive as you climb.

 

[ThrottleJockey]

Yeah!



Just set your blowoff for a max of 50 psi and haul that trailer. You can twin a close to stock truck for just towing if you can drive it like a 'normal person'.



They sure are fun, though.