10 Tanks B100

[JimB1]

In the last few months I've used about 10 tanks B100 from Seaport Petroleum, a refiner, here in Seattle. Did fuel filter drain yesterday into clear plastic bottle. Not a single visible drop of water. Just to make sure, I added about 1 tablespoon of water to the sample and it immediately settled to bottom and was easily visible.

 

[MStrain]

This is an interesting post, there are two places near me in L. A. that sell B100, one is in Marina Del Rey, the other is in Pacific Palisades. I have never done a full tank of B100 but I did pump a quarter tank to try it out and the truck ran fine. The reasons that I don't buy it regularly is because it is out of the way for me to get, it costs almost a dollar more than diesel at the time I tried some, and the sheet they give you at the station says that it reduces economy buy 10 to 20 percent. So if I was wealthy and didn't care I would run it all the time because it is totally organic and even safe to eat, and it burns very clean, much better for the environment. They should proably force the big companies to make all diesel at least like B20, if we bought 20% less crude from the middle east we would all be better off. The other thing I have heard but am not sure about is that it supposedly can cause problems with your fuel system because it cleans the tank and all the "dirt" goes through you fuel system and will clog your fuel filter right away, but if you change it after the first tank and stay on B100 you should be good. I don't know enough about it myself, but if the price was cheaper than diesel I would love to run it all the time, do my part for the environment. Hopefully some experts here can chime in on the ups and downs of running B100.

 

[PRout]

Ive been running the B99 from the Marina for about a year now and can say it is excellent fuel. A little more expensive than the ULSD (even right here next to the refineries in Carson) but its worth the drive and the few extra bucks to fill both tanks up with it. Truck runs excellent on it. Can tell the difference when I get cheap and buy this local diesel here in the harbor. Truck gets noisier and loses its rock steady idle it had with the bio.

The neat thing also like you say is its non-toxic. So that means when dropping the fuel tank to deal with adding better pickup tubes, the deteriorating float, or adjusting the sending unit, you dont get sick from having it on you like you can when getting covered in diesel (which has happened in the past).

I read somewhere that its about the same as getting salad oil on you (except for the garlic smell - hehe).

Never had the plugged filter problem some people have dealt with, but I think i may have added some hose to the aux tank circulation system that isnt bio rated because Im starting to get a little drip action. .

Picked up plenty of [FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Parker J1527 spec hose and just have to get out there and change it out "again"
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[MStrain]

Do you know what kind of mileage you are getting on the B99, I have never ran enough to see what it does to economy, but the data sheet they give said like 10 to 20% less.

 

[SHobbs]

The 10-20% you are referring to is the btu/gal. Diesel has around 131,000 btu/gal B100 ( soybean oil ) has 118,000 btu/gal. What that equates to as far power or mileage loss I am not sure.

 

[PRout]

Do you know what kind of mileage you are getting on the B99, I have never ran enough to see what it does to economy, but the data sheet they give said like 10 to 20% less.

Cant really tell you about mileage losses as Ive changed too many things recently to get any "real" estimates. I do not think there is much loss, but there could be some due to the above btu/gallon numbers. Any loss in power can be gained back by adding more fueling since smoke really isn't a problem with bio which is a plus. But that would equate to a loss of MPG. Honestly, I doubt that the loss is a full 10%, but dont have the hard numbers to prove it.

 

[JFaughn]

From my info , the oil companies involvement in bio is the diesel , about 90 processing plants in US with about 90 more on the plan table , the vast majority are small buis , farmer , coop ect. not oil co.
Then with millage , I see 10-30 % variation , with just time & different fuel stations it would seem , I've been running 0-10-35% over the past 2 yrs ,
It seems that the #2 fuel I'm getting has got that much variation , I am using the last of a batch of ethanol processed bio , vs. methanol processed bio , its hard to tell what is causing the lower mpgs , its like I'm getting winter mpgs , but as an individual , its hard to use the time line , truck & 3 different fuels [ #2 , eth-bio , meth-bio ] and know for sure what is doing what .
Anybody els seeing unexplained variation in millage , with the changing of dyno and all the other variables its hard to tell ?

 

[MStrain]

Not too much response on this topic, if we could reliably run our trucks on B99 diesel, wouldn't that be huge. We would reduce our need to buy billions of dollars of oil from the middle east every day and put it in the hands of the american farmers that grow the corn that most biodiesel is made from. Any other info about problems with using B100 or B99 and any info about the benefits of keeping money in the US rather than sending it to OPEC and the shahs and shieks so they can buy more private jets and vacation estates would be appreciated.

 

[PRout]

Im with you all the way there... The biggest thing for me is making sure all or any extra fuel hoses are bio rated. If you do have filter clogging problems, they should only be temporary until the crud is cleared out of the system. .

Oh, theres the gel point problem, and i think it raises the fuel pressure due to being heavier viscosity and in my case the regulator isnt bypassing as much fuel back to the tank which has raised my trucks pressure from 13. 5 to about 20 (which I dont like).

Probably better to cut it 50/50 if you have problems. .

 

[MStrain]

Hey, even if we went B50 as the standard, that would put a hurtin on the middle eastern oil billionaires, might make them think twice about that 3rd roll royce silver shadow for the Las Vegas mansion. Oh yeah, and the huge benefit to the environment is nice too.

 

[SHobbs]

MStrain,



From around April to nearly December my truck gets nothing but B100. The cooler months I switch to B20 to avoid gelling. So far I have run soybean oil, cottonseed oil and now a 50/50 mix of soybean oil and processed chicken fat. One thing I have found is that different oils can be thicker/heavier than others. Soybean oil is similar to diesel as far as flow and cottonseed oil is thicker, I can tell by watching my fuel pressure guage.

 

[Moab4x4]

I am on my first tank of B100 Soybean. Here in Moab it is + $. 10 per gallon over ULSD. Not too bad.

Mine is a smoky 1st gen tweaked and with POD injectors. It still hazes at idle, perhaps a tad worse. Smoke on acceleration seems to be not quite as dark, but if I get on it I still leave a cloud. The cloud just smells better. I wonder if the chemical composition of the cloud is all that different ?



I plan to keep B100 in it, but wonder at what temps I will be risking gell. Experiences?



Thanks

Ken

 

[JoeBioDiesel]

but wonder at what temps I will be risking gell. Experiences?



Thanks

Ken

Take a small sample from the drain on the fuel filter and gel test it in the freezer. Two temps are important... . the temperature that it clouds, and the temp that it clears. Then you can figure out how YOUR fuel gels and thaws. If there's one thing true about Biodiesel, it's that no two sources have the same cold flow properties.

Joe

 

[SHobbs]

Ken,



Last November was the first problem I have had with B100 gelling. The crazy thing about it was that for three years prior to that I always ran B100 with antigel even in the winter. I have had B100 down to 18* two nights in a row with zero problems until last November when it got down to 34* and it gelled. Thats why I run B20 in the winter now to avoid it.

I have yet to figure out why it gelled and the only thing I can think of is my supplier is always changing the fuel. Before the gelling it was always soybean oil and when it gelled I think there was a mixture of cottonseed oil in with the soybean. So far I have used soybean oil, cottonseed and processed chicken fat. Right now its a mixture of soybean oil and chicken fat. If you want to avoid gelling use B20 and antigel below 45*.

 

[KKohagen]

My Bio mileage

Cant really tell you about mileage losses as Ive changed too many things recently to get any "real" estimates. I do not think there is much loss, but there could be some due to the above btu/gallon numbers. Any loss in power can be gained back by adding more fueling since smoke really isn't a problem with bio which is a plus. But that would equate to a loss of MPG. Honestly, I doubt that the loss is a full 10%, but dont have the hard numbers to prove it.

I get my Bio from the same station in Marina Del Rey. I only run a full Bio tank every 4-6 tanks, sometimes 10. I notice a drop in mileage of from about 17. 8-18. 2 down to around 16. 7-16. 9.
I know that my truck gets noticeably quieter when I am running Bio, not to mention the french-fry like smell.
The Bio in Marina Del Rey has been anywhere from $0. 30-$0. 60 a gallon higher than the regular diesel source I use; station near my house.
Most of the time I fill up on the Bio because I am in the area and I didn't plan ahead to fill up near my house. I don't want to tank the tank level too low due to an uncertain time it will take to get home.
The I-405 sure can seem like a 4 or 5 hour commute. To go 49 miles from work to home I have had many 2+ hour commutes, multiple 3+ hour commutes, and the all time record to get me home (no side trips)..... 4 hours 17 minutes. This time measured from when I left the parking lot to when I pulled into my driveway. It was a Thursday, I believe April, I had left work ~4:50 PM and got home a little after 9 PM.
My work has a lot for RV's trailers, with hook-ups, for the employees that work lots of overtime/shutdowns etc... I bought my trailer within a month of that record commute. So now I only travel back and forth every few days instead of every day. If anyone wants the hard numbers I can send them my excel spreadsheet.