15W-40 in everything?

[LMcCary]

Simple rule. Follow the vehicles recomended oil specs esp. when using dino oil. Now syn. oil will flow in colder weather. I have had 318's refuse to turn over in 0 degree weather with 15-40 dino. Had to drain and refill with 5-30 in order to start and go to work. And that is in east Texas back in the early 80's. For northern climates, follow recomended oil.

The old addage that one oil fits all is pure $****. Many modern gassers bearing tolerance is half of the diesel's. Some new diesels have tightened up their tolerances too.



If you are going to use 15-40 in the cold climates, please use a quality Syn. like Mobile one or Valvoline prem. blue. If in doubt about what I say, check the major oil manufactors web sites. They spend millions on testing oil for longtivity, servicability and runability in all climates and engines.

LMcCary

 

[LMcCary]

Ps. Check Caterpillar and all other manufactures failure anaylis studies. There you will find that one type of bearing failure is caused by cavitation (areation) on the bearing surface which is caused by too thick of oil, air leaks in oil pickup piping or over speed.

Also fuel mileage will be effected greatly, esp. in cold weather.

I could spend all night discussing this, but don't care to. I thought that the state of Indiana had smarter people as mechanics than to suggest that one oil fits all. Besides the Viscosity there's the problem with additives etc.

Consult the experts, OEM manufactures and Oil Manufactures.

 

[Missouri Mule]

When in I started to drive in Kansas I used to run 10w30 in the cold months and 10w40 in the warm months.

In Florida years later in my 82 Regal,78 and 88 ford van I ran 20w50 most of the time and would put in 10w40 in if a cold winter was expected.

I run 15w40 in the both my trucks I would not run it in a gasser. I don't believe it meets all gas engine SAE specs.

 

[rbattelle]

The maint. shop here insists on using 15W-40 in everything.

Wait... are they running C-rated (compression-ignition) oil in the gas vehicles?



If so, that sounds extremely bad to me. I don't think the additive packages on a CI oil are appropriate for SI engines (and vice-versa).



Ryan

 

[DPellegrin]

Gentlemen,



This has been an excellent discussion on this important topic, and as you can see there are as many opinions as there are brands and weights of oils. I must say that many of the comments have merit and some are down right unbelievable. Ultimately it's your choice of how to maintain your investment. I have been around Cummins, CAT, and DDC engines for 30 years. I have worked with both Cummins and DDC engineers on many occasions and have even attended a couple of API committee meetings. I prefer the 15W40 in everything approach (BTW there are many 15W 40 oils with both "S" and "C" certs). I live in Minnesota and have started my ISB with Rottella 15W40 at -20F regularly with no problem. I have seen certification test results that show 15W-40 to be superior to 5W's for bearings, piston rings, cams, injector followers. The fact is, because of the stringent heavy-duty diesel engine particulate emission standards in the last few years, more research time and $s have been spent on the development and chemistry of HDEO 15W40 products than any other, save synthetic oil research. I know the engineers that design these engines, some of them sit on API committees. I'm going with what they tell me!



regards,

 

[steved]

Gentlemen,



... (BTW there are many 15W 40 oils with both "S" and "C" certs)...



... I have seen certification test results that show 15W-40 to be superior to 5W's for bearings, piston rings, cams, injector followers...

Couple things... yes, most 15w40s are dual rated for both "C" and "S" ratings, but the "C" oil's "S"-ratings are usually not as "recent" as the true "S" oils... in other words, the 15w40 might have a "SJ" rating, but the newest "S" oil might be "SM"...



I don't understand how a 15w40 is better than a 5w40, when they are both a 40 weight oil?? The only difference the 5 and 15 make is how the oil acts at colder temps (ie. room temperature)... but they are still a API rated 40-weight oil at operating temperature. So if you are comparing a 40 weight to a 40 weight, how can one be better than the other? I could understand this comparing a 15w40 to a 5w20, but in the context it was taken...



steved

 

[LMcCary]

DPellegrin

can you start a gasser with dino 15-40 in the winter morning say -20 or -30?

Doubt it. I know, been there, can't do it.

 

[nickleinonen]

nickleinonen- Assuming your truck is powered by Cummins, I offer the following: 15W40-excellent, 5W40 synthetic-very good, 0W40- not good, not in my Cummins!!

and your reasoning behind your opinion of not good?



40 weight, gives me good idle pressures, good running pressures. oil samples come back good when i get samples burned.



i've got nothing against 15w40 conventional oils. but with the amount of driving i do [or lack of] i am not going to do unnecessary oil changes for winter. and my 0w40 syn flows much better cold than 15w40 conventional oil. in summer they are pretty close to the same



my 0w40 esso xd-3 might very well be the same as mobil delvac1 5w40 just different label on it [mobil/exxon/esso/imperial oil all same company iirc]

 

[DPellegrin]

nickleinonen- If 0W-40 works for you then that's fine with me! However, the last time I checked Cummins lube oil recommendations the only viscosities listed were 15W40 and 5W40, unless there is a recent update that includes 0W40. Also I do not think the xd-3, 0W40 is the same as 5W-40 Delvac 1. However, I understand that the Mobil 5W40 SUV oil is the same as Delvac 1.



Regards,

 

[Ncostello]

I emailed Mobil Technical with the question. I told them we buy their Delvac product and would like to use it in gasoline V8 light trucks.



They advised me against it "if at all possible"... "to use the recommended viscosity and type", even if that means not using their product for the 5W-30.



Not that 15W-40 will cause failure... I think they are just following recommendations as well.

 

[Greenleaf]

My CAT C-7's that have the HUI fuel injection system are calling for 10w-30 as the heavier 15-40 will not flow well at cold temps and casue problems for the high pressure pump that uses engine oil as hyd fluid medium.

 

[DPellegrin]

Greenleaf- According to CAT 2007 engines must use oils certified to API CJ-4 or CAT ECF-3. The only oil that Cat offers on their web site that meets CJ-4/ECF-3 is the 15W40. The 10W30 that they list is not CJ-4/ECF-3. Are the engines you reference 2007s? The major oil companys don't appear to have a 10W30 certed to API CJ-4 as yet.



Regards,

 

[rbattelle]

Greenleaf- According to CAT 2007 engines must use oils certified to API CJ-4 or CAT ECF-3. The only oil that Cat offers on their web site that meets CJ-4/ECF-3 is the 15W40. The 10W30 that they list is not CJ-4/ECF-3. Are the engines you reference 2007s?

Greenleaf must be referring to older engines. Cat doesn't use the HEUI system any longer (as far as I know).



Ryan

 

[steved]

Greenleaf- According to CAT 2007 engines must use oils certified to API CJ-4 or CAT ECF-3.

Ummm, that would be for ON-ROAD engines... OFF-ROAD engines can use both CI-4+ oil and LSD fuel. There is a fine line, but the 2007 EPA emissions only apply to on-road equipment.



Someone told me that Cat is NOT going to offer a on-road engine after 2009 because they can't reliably meet emissions?? Anyone else heard this? I can't even remember where I heard that...



steved

 

[rbattelle]

Someone told me that Cat is NOT going to offer a on-road engine after 2009 because they can't reliably meet emissions?? Anyone else heard this? I can't even remember where I heard that...

That can't possibly be true, especially since off-road engines are supposed to meet the same emissions standards after 2011 (I think).



According to Diesel Progress, Cat is going forward with their ACERT system and SCR to meet 2009 and beyond emissions.



Ryan

 

[nickleinonen]

the label on the bottle doesn't always "match" the characteristics of the oil inside. .

i have done an un-scientific pour test with a bunch of oil that were chilled down to 0°f

in that batch i had some 5w50 castrol syntec and some mobil 1 15w50. . the mobil 1 15w poured much quicker than the 5w castrol syn... so which was being true to their cold number???

 

[DPellegrin]

nickleinonen- I have had similar observations as yours when pouring cold oil out of a bottle! However, I understand that you need the cold start performance that 0W40 gives you. I have not looked them up, but I have to believe that the pour point specs for 0W-40 and 5W40 are pretty close. I'm sure your local Cummins dealer would have a problem using a 0W40. On the other hand the bottom line is your UOAs, if you are satisfied with those then stay with what works!!



Regards,

 

[steved]

the label on the bottle doesn't always "match" the characteristics of the oil inside. .

Could this be a batching issue??? They do have blending QC, but at the same time they can always make mistakes.



steved

 

[Greenleaf]

The engines I am refering to are my Bluebird buses with the C7 engine. They are pre 2007 models that DO NOT require ULS fuel and have NO emissions after treatment. They employ the HEUI injection.



The buses on order will have a boat load of after treatment and require MUCH more maint due to this. #@$%!



One of them will have the new Cummins 6. 7



I use Schaeffer Supreme 7000 Synthetic Blend 15w-40 in EVERYTHING here at the school. All bus engines. All pickup trucks (gasoline) and the Kubota lawn mower diesel.

 

[amsoilman]

The engines I am refering to are my Bluebird buses with the C7 engine. They are pre 2007 models that DO NOT require ULS fuel and have NO emissions after treatment. They employ the HEUI injection.



The buses on order will have a boat load of after treatment and require MUCH more maint due to this. #@$%!



One of them will have the new Cummins 6. 7



I use Schaeffer Supreme 7000 Synthetic Blend 15w-40 in EVERYTHING here at the school. All bus engines. All pickup trucks (gasoline) and the Kubota lawn mower diesel.

I too am working at a School District with over 360 vehicles, of wich 220 of them are School buses. We use 15W-40 in everything, that is Diesel.



Wayne