Archived 1994 No Intake heater

[DieselMinded]

I tested the cables from the battery -12V



I tested the 4 trigger terminals -12V



I jumpered one relay and the grid was heating , Are the relays bad ??? Can I put a toggle switch in there place ?



Is there a IAT on a 12V ?? Could it have something to do with it ?



Help Truck wont hardly start in the morning.

 

[Joe G.]

What are the temps like? The truck should start in the 30s or high 20s just fine without the grid heater workings.

 

[DieselMinded]

Its only about 50* but its smoking like mad and missing ,,,,when its fired up



And you have to keep cranking it to get it started



Either way shouldnt the heaters be hot when the key is turned on and the engine is below operating tempature.



?

DM

 

[Joe Mc]

Yes they should heat based on air temps supplied to the IAT until I think 15 mph. If something is wrong until you diagnose to find it / repair it - It might help start up if you plug it in overnight??? I use a timer and set it to come on 3 - 4 hours before I get up and go off 15 minutes before I go to work just incase it's wet out . . .



It's worth a try until you get it fixed at least.

 

[Joe G.]

Regardless of the heaters working or not it should start fine at 50°. Does it run ok once it's warmed up? Does it start ok if you give it a little pedal?

 

[DieselMinded]

No you have to pump it big time and it still just barly starts ,,,,im not trying to limp it with the block heater i would like to know if the intake heaters are bad or if its the IAT or anywhere else I should be looking

 

[Devan Manis]

here is a diagram of the 12v.

 

[DieselMinded]

Ill clean the IAT and if that dont work wheres a good place to get the Dual Relays ,,,,,if there alot of $$$ ,,,this is the Budgit Bomber after all,,,, Can I hook up a heavy duty Toggle switch and you can just flip the switch for a min before firing it up ? Truck cannot be plugged in at work. Need to have this fixed by tommarow... .....



DM

 

[Joe G.]

DM,



Pumping a diesel is just exercising your foot. There is no accelerator pump. In fact pumping the pedal may just be confusing the governor. Hold a little steady pressure like a quarter throttle and see what happens. I always start my truck that way even with the idle at 800. According to your first post you are concerned about it being hard to start because of the heater grid. At least, that is what it looks like your concern is. So it seems that the first thing you need to do is find out why it is hard to start. You may have more than one thing wrong for all we know. At 50° it should start easy even if the grid heaters were home in the garage.



If we are talking about two problems, one is that it is hard to start and the other is that the grid heaters may not be working correctly then you want to try to solve them separately. If I remember correctly the grid heaters come on for any temp below 59°. If that is correct, they your control unit may be a little off so it comes on at temps somewhat lower than 50°. You may have a bad grid heater relay. Or corrosion at the connectors. You may have a burned out heater grid or bad connections. You have to check all this stuff before deciding that the control is bad. If you would like to discuss how to go about trouble shooting the heater grid email me.



Remember the idle should be at least 750 RPM in gear with the AC on. 800 is better. If the idle is too low it will act just like you describe.

 

[DieselMinded]

Thanks Joe ,,,,



I already tore it all apart the little rubber elbows used on the relay trigger wires were about half stripped out ..... I cut all 4 of the ends off and wires them right on there terminals ,,,, As well as cleaning all connections and di-electrical greased them , we are never sure if the grids ever have worked just got the truck in spring and its been ragged and tagged , Killer KDP fix W/ Jb weld and permatex ,,,, you get the idea ,,, were getting it in top notch fashion tho, trying to do it W/O going broke , hints the budgit bomber Name :>



How Ever when the temps starting cooling off out here we took out the Power Block and became reliant on the grid heaters ,,,,, well there not working ,,,reguarless if we have other issues that we didnt have last week ,,, I would like to atleast get the heaters working then move on to the next thing .



I'll clean the IAT im sure its never been touched and go from there ,,, if I still have issues ill Email ya'



Thanks Again Joe,



DM

 

[paccool]

How does it run after it starts? Is the power low and does it run rough for a bit? I suspect there is a fuel issue or air in the lines after seeing what you have to do to get it started. Have you ran any Biodiesel through the engine recently? If so, have you changed the fuel filter. Might also be good to check the fuel pressure from the lift pump.

 

[DieselMinded]

Smokes White smoke BIG TIME !!! at fire up and till the motor is up to operating tempature ,, it will just set at idle and blow white smoke ,,, never had any issue at all till it started cooling off out here.



NO BIODiesel



Once it warms up all is well



DM

 

[Devan Manis]

could the timing be off?

 

[Joe Mc]

DM - Not to be insulting but, I didn't notice in any of the threads if the grid heaters were ohmed out to see if there is resistance or not? Sorry not sure of how what ohms they should read. Easy to check though - I could ohm mine out and get back to you w/the results. At lease it would eliminate the question is it the grid or ???? Also not to be insulting but, not sure if you know to disconnect the wires @ the grid, so as to read only thru the grid not the rest of the wiring and controls??



Sounds like all is well once fire is lit and warmed up, seems like it's more of a hard to start issue which shouldn't be related to the grids working or not. Understand you can't plug it in @ work but, did you try it overnight and if so did it start any easier today?



You mentioned it was not very well looked after is it possible that you are having fuel pressure problems???

 

[KWentling]

If you determine the relays are bad, you can get a heavier duty relay for way less than the dealer at newarkinone.com

. The part number is 120-902 and their stock number is 50F3663. I paid $30. 84 for the pair. It takes a little modification of the bracket to mount them.

You can use an ohm meter to check the relay coils. I don't know what the resistance should be but if they are open they are bad. Contacts could also be bad. I believe the ECM provides ground to the relay to trigger them. Use you're volt meter at the relay on the big terminal going to the grids and turn the key on and see if you get 12 volts. If not, you need to verify if the relays are being triggered. Use the voltmeter between the two small terminals on the relays (don't use a seperate ground point) and see if you get 12 volts when the key is turned on. You could also test them by disconnect the wires to them and using jumpers to supply 12 volts to them. There is also a fuseable link in the big wires feeding the heaters but I think you allready verified that you had 12 volts to them.

The resistance of the IAT sensor at 50 F. should be 17,990 to 21,810 ohms.

Kim

 

[DieselMinded]

Thanks guys ... ... ... ... ... .



DM

 

[DieselMinded]

Cleaned the IAT all seems well



DM

 

[Cooker]

The IAT rarely goes bad and needs replacement.



I'm with Joe, if your truck is running that rough at 50 after a cold start there is certinly an underlying problem that I would personally be more concerned about that a ill functioning grid heater system. JMHO

 

[DieselMinded]

Its starting up and running fine now .



DM

 

[Willys]

Thats it. Just clean the IAT and all is well? Wow...



How did you clean it?