Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) 2001 ate lift pump, then injection pump!

[JGallops]

Well I am not a happy camper! My 2001 HO has only 31,000 miles on it. The lift pump failed followed shortly by the injector pump.



The local dealer ordered the pumps, so waiting. New 24 valve engines are certainly not as reliable as my old 1996 12 valve engine. It had no problems in over 200,000 miles on it. So much for reliability with the 24 valve engine.



Ordered fuel pressure gauge from Genos, so at least when it is repaired I can keep an eye on it. I was told no fix for the lift pump yet, so I guess I get to repeat this fun at a later time.



JG

2001 6 speed HO stock

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

It's largely a matter of DEALING with KNOWN problems! You seem to be new here - so you might want to read up on lift pump problems and fixes.



IF a person has enough personal reasons to choose a specific vehicle or product, in SPITE of pretty well established and known weaknesses - it only makes sense to then take reasonable steps to head off those known weaknesses! DC has been widely KNOWN to have poor automatic trannies - and a wise buyer who craved one of these trucks for their other admired features THEN has had the option of known and well proven "fixes"...



The early failure of the VP44 due to lift pump failure is hardly an unknown to us - nor are the reasonably reliable "fixes" for that problem. Many of us, rather than crossing our fingers and trusting to luck, have spent the additional time and money to install measures to eliminate or greatly forestall those failures - so far, the fix seems to be an overwhelming success for the vast majority of us.



Yeah - MY old '91 was super-reliable too, but no way would I trade my new '02 for the old one - the FEW weaknesses are VASTLY outnumbered by the advantages!



I hope you problem is quickly fixed, and your opinion of the new truck improves...

 

[Mike Ellis]

Considering he's rather new, maybe you could provide detail on what he should search for as far as fixes to help ease his pain. If he is not a super knowledgeable TDR old timer, he is probably rightfully ticked that DC would put out a $35,000 truck with a lift pump design that can leave it dead on the roadside with little warning - and as a result possibly trash the injection pump too.



I have been reading up on the CTD's for a while now, certainly no expert but I love my truck and drive it enough to feel like I am pretty firmly in the "loyalist" camp. As much as I love it, I think it is inexcusable that Dodge has not stepped up to the plate to fix some of the more common problems with a decent, long-lasting fix IN CHARACTER WITH the ruggedness of the powerplant. Examples: 12V KDP, 5th wheel gear failure. 24V lift pumps. 4WD truck track bars.



Don't worry JGallops, the lift pump can be fixed and the basic truck is pretty darned reliable. If you have problems, get on here and sound off so the rest of us know about them and can help if possible, or at least know to watch out for them. Good luck bud!

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

SURE - simply use the "search" feature on this board - search for "lift pump" or "VP44" and get ready to do LOTS of reading!



Here's MY approach at a lift pump/VP44 fix:



#ad






And, installed down next to the fuel tank:



#ad




That oughta get ya started...

 

[Mike Cureton]

Gary, can you tell me more about the assembly in the picture you sent? Like is this some sort of kit, is it home-grown, is it used in conjunction with the factory lift pump?

I'm pretty much a novice also, and don't really want to be left on the side lines by a pump failure.

Will the addition of a fuel pressure gauge void the warranty?

Thanx,

Mike

 

[tarussell]

Gary KJ6Q----- In response to your first reply to this post --VERY WELL SAID !!! The good far out ways the bad . Thomas

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Mike, I "home-brewed" my own setup - a "pusher pump assembly as they are called. There are several outfits selling the complete setup for around $150 or so (someone will pop in with specific info on sources) - I bought my own Carter pump from Jeg's for $72 - the rest of the required stuff ran the total to about $100... The intent is to provide greater positive fuel pressure to the existing Lift Pump (LP), and extend it's effectiveness and lifespan - It's really no great expense or particular difficulty - and VERY few (*I* don't know of ANY!) owners have had VP44 failures after installing a pusher - and very few have had further stock LP failures either...



Can't answer your question about the addition of a pressure guage - but lots of guys have them, and I haven't personally heard of any warranty issues from their installation - in my case, I've got other mods that have essentially eliminated my warranty - but i want the mods far more than the warranty, so it's not an issue with me...



Good luck, do the search suggest above - it'll be the best reading you could do on the subject, and I'll be glad to provide any additional help you might need after doing some homework...

 

[JGallops]

Hi Gary,



This is in response to your earlier post. I know the intention of the reply may not equate to the words written. However, since we don't know each other, you have done a splendid job of alienating me from the get go.



--->"It's largely a matter of DEALING with KNOWN problems!"



Quite frankly I didn't know there were any problems! My previous '96 had very few problems and never let me down by the side of the road. Yes, it was an automatic and it was pretty poor. I did last me for the time I had the truck so I didn't complain.



The '96 convinced me that I would buy another Dodge, but with a stick in it. I don't or rarely pull anything with ithe '01, but I did build my current house using the truck so its job was to haul lumber, etc. I saw no reason to change it from stock since the '96 was reliable transportation. Please note this is my only vehicle, so reliability is paramount.



It gets well taken care of and has all of its filters changed way ahead of schedule. So my attitude to absolute failure beside the road does not bode very well with me. Will I vote Dodge with my wallet again? I really don't know at this point.



Do I need to protect myself now? Absolutely, so as I said in my original post, I will have to get gages installed to cover my butt.



--->"The early failure of the VP44 due to lift pump failure is hardly an unknown to us "



Well it certainly was to me and I am sure there are a lot people like me that are out there. If you are saying I SHOULD HAVE KNOWN THIS, then you are mistaken. The dealer certainly didn't say anything when I bought the truck nor would they. I was happy with my previous '96 and would have continued to be with '01 too, but now I have to rethink my position and if I trust the '01 to be reliable transportation.



My sentiments closely match the posting of Mike Ellis who said it as well as I could have.



So I am reading into the tone of your posting that I should have known all of this before-hand. Sorry, I am not gifted with divine providence nor the TDR web site at the time I made my purchase.



If this is the way newcomers are treated, then thank you, I shall be leaving shortly. I am not particularly thin skinned, but I don't need to be taken to task for things I am not aware of. I would think the message would be to take more people in to the TDR, not to send them packing because they are not aware of every nuance of their vehicle.



JGallops

2001 6 speed HO stock

 

[Snow man]

JG, Since you got the warranty and you'll have all new pumps,now you know better,and this wont happen again. Now you'll be able to monitor fuel pressure and see it dropping and take action. My dads 01 started losing fuel pressure at only 14K miles,by 19K miles the lift pump was almost dead. I bought Dad a fuel pressure guage for Xmas,and its saved his Vp44 already,its on lift pump #2 at 28K miles,but im convinced his truck would have ate a pump just like yours if we didnt have that guage. I wouldnt distrust the reliability of the 24V,mine has almost 70K on it,it plows,tows,and i hot rod it,it has close to 500hp. It has never left me stranded,or died. Im still on the original Vp44,I have a pusher pump ,and am on lift pump #2.

 

[JGallops]

Snowman,



Thanks for the info. I am learning a lot from this experience. I just want to get my '01 back to being a reliable ride again. Looks like a pusher pump will be in my future too. Gages are already on the way. Figured I may as well get an EGT and a boost gage while I am at it.



JGallops

2001 6 speed HO stock

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I don't intentionally set out to annoy folks - newbies or otherwise - but I *do* reserve the rigt to "respond-in-kind"



"Well I am not a happy camper! My 2001 HO has only 31,000 miles on it. The lift pump failed followed shortly by the injector pump.

(snip)

New 24 valve engines are certainly not as reliable as my old 1996 12 valve engine. It had no problems in over 200,000 miles on it. So much for reliability with the 24 valve engine. (snip) I was told no fix for the lift pump yet, so I guess I get to repeat this fun at a later time. "



YOUR original post came off NOT as one looking for info or assistance - but as a complainer whose only reason for being here was to assault us with your personal complaints as to the poor quality of the same trucks many of US drive...



And *I* responded accordingly - as you can see by following posts on the subject, another fellow DID ask for info on possible fixes - and HE was responded to in keeping with HIS obvious attitude...



Don't enter here with an obvious chip on your shoulder, THEN gripe when you are greeted accordingly... Whether you choose to stay, or leave, will be your own choice - but you can expect to be treated as YOU reveal your own attitude - just as *I* am...





To help reduce the heat in this thread, *I* will no longer contribute...



Cheers...

 

[JR2]

Not everyone has had VP44 failures or lift pump failures for that matter. My Dad's 98. 5 went 86K when the lift pump got weak and he had it replaced. Neither I nor my Dad has had a VP44 fail. I have had two lift pumps on my truck, the first one was getting weak so I replaced it and the second one died so I replaced it... on my third now.



There are lots of options out there to "fix" the lift pump problem, you can run a pusher pump back by the tank (like Garys set up) or you could buy one pump and move it back by the tank. That is what I did and I don't have any problems other than the pumps still die.

 

[Bob Cochran]

JGallops ~ Sometimes some members sound a little to abrasive and I honestly believe by accident. Those that continually do so get a whole ration from others. You will find 99. 9% are freindly, will go out of their way to help anyway they can. Not to say at times some get very passionate about certain issues but is that not human. We certainly are human!!!! As you get a chance to read more and post you will find the site and it's members of tremendous value.



I am lucky so far with 46,000 and no LP or VP44 replacment. Now where is that wood to knock on!!! Should not have said that more than likely. By the way welcome to TDR I don't believe anyone has welcomed you yet.

 

[bschmidt]

JG,I own a 2002 3500 HO with 15,000 miles on it. I am on lift pump #4,with still no answer why they keep failing. Talk about being afraid to drive an hour from home,I carry a spare pump with me. Thats a great feeling to have when you own a new truck. One more time and DC better be ready to buy this one back or I am going through Lemon Law. The list does not end there,two other smaller problems so far- leaky clutch master cylinder and reverse light switch. With a grand total of 23 days out of service. The shame of the whole matter is that I love this truck. I just wish they could figure this pump issue out. Well good luck with yours I hope things get better.

Brandon

 

[JGallops]

Hi Bob,



Thanks for the welcome!



However, Gary is right, I was and probably still am steamed over this whole thing. Has nothing to do with the TDR, more as an informational chalk another one up to the lift pump failures. Fortunately the dealer is doing their part. However, I was not thrilled by their reponse that there was no fix for the lift pump.



The '01 is supposed to be fixed on Monday once they get the parts in. So I have to wait.



Contrary to Gary's belief, I searched the TDR web site before I made the posting. I saw there was a load of failures. Went to the dealer armed with the information and basically dumped on them. There was no contest from the dealer. They called STAR and that was that.



Thanks!!



JGallops

2001 HO stock

 

[swalls]

Gary, that's a pretty clean install. What pressure is that Carter pump regulator set at? Is it adjustable, and do you have the Jegs part number?

 

[Snow man]

With that loop around the carter i would think it couldnt build much pressure at all,just enough to feed the vp44 without it having to suck for the fuel.

 

[rweis]

I to am a "new" guy. Almost 7200 miles on my 2002. Been working on and thinking about and planning gauges first. Have read VOLUMES on the lp and transmission threads, the rest of the CTD seems to work pretty well.



The only thing I can add is the DC engineering is really weak in a couple of spots. I did not know this either when I bought mine either, and kinda wish I had, MIGHT have been a different decision. However if you really dig into the Duramax and the Power Stroke you will find there are some significant shortcommings there as well. At least due to the TDR the shortcommings are fairly well identified and there are as many "fixes" almost as there are members,lol.



What I do is read a WHOLE bunch and see how the different "fixes" are working. On the Lp there is a retailer selling a ??????? 4100 LP that comes in several different pressure ranges and seems to be a REALLY good TRUE fix. It seems like a WELL manufactured heavy duty precisly made to do the job RIGHT. There is a whole thread about it listed under "Let's take a poll of who has replaced a LP" I think the wording was. BE CAREFUL and read about overpressuring the VP44 input pressures. Not sure if this is a problem, but would seem like it could be.



Welcome to TDR, what an outstanding place this is!



Bob Weis

 

[jzaremski]

SURE - simply use the "search" feature on this board - search for "lift pump" or "VP44" and get ready to do LOTS of reading!

guess what? If you're not a member, you're not allowed to search the forums. And it's folly to think that every diesel Ram owner is a TDR member.



My lift pump failed at 38,000 miles, taking the inj. pump with it as well. I certainly wasn't aware of a problem (silly me, I thought the dealer would let me know about this TSB).

It's largely a matter of DEALING with KNOWN problems!

Known to you. not everyone posts here, not everyone has a good dealer to work with.

The early failure of the VP44 due to lift pump failure is hardly an unknown to us

emphasis mine.

have spent the additional time and money to install measures to eliminate or greatly forestall those failures

time and money which shouldn't have to be spent on a young, >$30,000 truck. But hey, if you as a customer find it accpetable to have to engineer solutions to design flaws yourself, then more power to ya. I personally find it unacceptable.

 

[diesel DOG]

I panick every time I read this pump stuff. I have 18,000 on my truck. Welcome to TDR