2003 engine question

[Sregorb]

Saw the article on the new ISB. Talks about 275 HP and 80% quieter. I wonder if there an associated benefit (like significant mileage increase). Or if this is engine is being remodeled strictly as an appeasement for marketing and environmentalists?

Don't mean to step on toes or start a flame war. Just want to know projections before I jump into a 2002 and seal the deal and have a vehicle for the next 10 years. My nightmares consist of buying my 2002 and finding out later that the 2003 is the "silver bullet" fix to all the problems ever experienced by Dodge Rams... ... .

The EGR decreases emissions and burns cleaner, but does that necessarily translate to less fuel and increased mileage or is it the opposite because of increased effort to recycle?



Brian

 

[McDowra]

hope these helps

The common rail fuel system is more efficent than the fuel system now used on the cummins. So the new dodges should be get better fuel mileage.

 

[RustyJC]

The rationale for the new common rail ISB for the 2003 model year is primarily new EPA emissions regulations that take effect October 1, 2002. Yes, the new ISB will be cleaner, quieter and somewhat more powerful (stock) if that's what you're looking for. For me, the noise wasn't an issue, I can get the same or more power with an Edge EZ (if they ever get the box available for the 2002), and I really didn't want to be a guinea pig for a new truck and engine design in 2003.



Good luck whatever you decide!



Rusty

 

[TomGolden]

Besides, what right minded diesel enthusiast wants quiter If someone really wants quiter, buy a FlowderChoke or Durawax



Me, I love the sound of a Cummins doin' it's thing! That's the one thing I am jealous of the 12 valvers for. My H. O is too quiet for my tastes.....



Tom

 

[Bad340fish]

12V Louder??

My 24V truck is louder than any 12valve truck I have ever heard. Have you had yours when its 20* outside yet... LOUD lol

 

[Archive]

From what I have heard CaseIH has been running a version of the 5. 9 Cummins common rail fuel system for a few years. I have not been around the red tractor to really notice the engines. Just thought maybe someone could check one out, I do not know the size tractor they are in... I'm a DEERE Man...

Bryan

 

[yogibear]

Hey Bryan, do you know why they painted the John Deers Green??



So they could hide in the weeds when Big Red comes by!!!!!!

 

[Stroke This 24V]

Not so Yogi



It's to hide the green when it is pulling the red, make the red go when it is broke. Optical Illusion!!! LOL!!!

 

[redneckdr]

gotta love green!

i've noticed that lots of tractor companies get bought out by somebody else, or go under. ford, international harvester, allis, etc. green just keeps on keepin on. must be due to somethin... .....

 

[danandamy]

Re: hope these helps

Originally posted by McDowra

The common rail fuel system is more efficent than the fuel system now used on the cummins. So the new dodges should be get better fuel mileage.

I bet when this new whiz-bang design common rail system comes out and the dust all settles my 12 valve STILL gets better milage



Dan

 

[Bob Wagner]

Cummins sez

http://www.cummins.com/na/pages/en/....cfm?uuid=D51BA827-073E-11D4-985C0004AC33EA57

 

[4020Deere]

I work for the "green" and although there's been runors in the past of the "green" being bought out by someone else, no such thing. It's been interesting in the last 15 years or so all the buy-outs and mergers in the ag equipment industry. With the industry basically conisiting of the "big 3" (CNH, Agco, Deere), all of them have become global companies. I don't think Case/IH is using a common rail fuel system on any of the ISB's yet. The government is requiring Tier III emissions compliance for off road applications in 2003, and that's when you'll see most diesels using common rail injection. The Tier II requirements are due for 2002, and many manufacturers, including Cummins, are already there.

 

[Floor It]

Hey guys, I talked to a guy that is my inside connection at cummins, when I asked him how the new engine was doing in the test truck we all saw pictures of here of the 4 door version, I asked him how it did on mileage, all he had to say was it met the E. P. A emissions. When I asked him to explain with out actually telling me- they really cant talk about it untill it's released- he said in a round about way that to met the tougher emissions we all have to give up something and that included mileage. As the conversation went on it sounds like to me after further talks with him mileage is worse than the current ISB engine. He also said the E. P. A is working on new and tougher regulations for the year 2010. No exact data yet but from his understanding you can almost count the diesels extinct! If we all dont stand up to the E. P. A and all the tree huggers we can say, by by to are diesels!

 

[redneckdr]

green

4020:

i guess there are two paths being followed in this thread... tractors and diesel engines... ..... have you seen the Lamborghini tractors?? cool looking tractors. if i could afford one, i'd buy one, just to claim braggin rights to... ... yeah, i drive a Lamborghini... .....

 

[jeepit]

I am not sure which way to go. Wait for new 4 door and new motor or get a 2002. A quieter cummins?I want a diesel that sounds like one, not one that sounds like a ferd. 4 door is only thing holding me back at this point.

 

[SteveAZ]

I stopped in at the local dealer to see the 3rd gen ram. They had a fully loaded 4 door white sport model, 4x4 w/ the factory 20" wheels. All the bells on this one.



If it wasn't a 1500 5. 9 gasser, would have been in my driveway now!



When I first saw images of these trucks here and elsewhere on the net, it was sure an eyebrow rasier. (What in the heck is that??)



But now that I've seen them up close, I love it! (To think that only 3 years ago I was a die hard F*** Truck person. Even though I worked for Chrysler at the AZ proving grounds years ago, never liked the Dodge trucks. In fact looking back then, I didn't like much of anything they had).



Anyway... ... The friendly, but possibly not fully informed salesman stated that in late 02 to mid to late 03 is when the conversion to the 3rd gen body style will take place for the "deisel" 2500/3500 4x4 (4 door) will take place... . in other words LAST of the fleet conversion. No big deal there, they did the same thing with the 2nd generation conversion.



However, he went on to state that he didn't know if Cummins would be offered as the only desiel choice. Saying there has been heavy talk about Mercedes engines going in along with Cummins engs.



Firstly, rumors and talk are cheap! And we can't (nor shouldn't) believe anything until it happens for sure.



But does anyone know anything about which Mercedes eng would be used IF that were the case? And if so how would that compare to the ISB? (Inquiring minds want to know, duhh)



Secondly, and most important: I love my 99', only 45K miles and not broke in yet. Might just keep it until I drive the negative equity out of it. And if that's a long long time, even better

 

[Sregorb]

jeepit and all-I've done so much research and soul-searching over the past 3 months it's ridiculous. I to was really wanting to hold out for the 2003 because of the 4 door issue but after alot (and I mean ALOT) of pros and cons I decided it wasn't worth the convenience of the 4 doors (and consequently 3 addl inches in the backseat) in exchange for a newly designed and unproven engine configuration. (IMO, I know the engine itself is great! It's just the reversing and pulling driven components on the rear that has me wondering about servicability down the road)

Anyway, the backseat is only going to be used by my kids and the infrequent guest skiier/hunter/etc who generally doesn't complain about as long as the ride gets them from point a to b so I consider the 'proven' end of design 2002 the way to go for me (read-most/all of the bugs worked out). Unfortunatly I understand that a couple bells and whistles have already been pulled off the trucks since 00-01 (downsizing suppliers or some such thing) but the engine/drivetrain/etc is still refined to be the one I'm after.

Now to just find that megabucks rebate period... ... ... ... ...



Brian

 

[jeepit]

Unbelievably I am also considering an F350 4 door. I have looked at all the pros & cons and will need to do a test drive on one. I know, I know. You guys will come back and save me from the abyss before I make any decisons, but for piece of mind I need to look at all options.

 

[SteveAZ]

I too looked at the SD PSD Crew cab recently and back in late 98'.



I have always liked them, thought that was the way to go. even before the current super duty model came out.



I was in the mood to buy one, but came home with a Dodge instead. The reason is pretty silly actually. Had abosolutely nothing to do with drivetrain. All I knew at the time was both Ford and Dodge made a truck with a good diesel engine, both had the same or simular warranties. And GM didn't make a good diesel (Back in 98' and I'm being kind). The GM dealers even admitted that.



What I also knew, and this seems to be true even today is that the options, color selection and availablity on the dealer lots is much better at Dodge.



It came down to this: All I wanted was the mini trip computer, even a basic one that had the temp and compass on it. That's it!



To get one simple goofy thing like that in the Ford I had to buy it as an add on or special order (to be added later - I don't think so = PITA) or upgrade to the Lariat (Leather Seats, etc).



The second downfall was lack of choice regarding colors.



The same night driving home thinking about where's the next Ford dealer, I drove past a Dodge dealer. I stopped in, and this was my first time hard look at a Dodge (Had a dakota years before, but that doesn't count, not the same animal).



First impression: WOW, they have what I want, when I want it (NOW) and all I have to do is pick a color and which one in that color.



I know, I know not the smartest way to buy, they know they had me and I didn't care.



To date: Abosutely ZERO regrets.



And it fits in my garage and just about all public parking garages too.



I still feel that each truck has its merits along with equal number of gripes. Both will fall apart around the engine (IMO).



Then I discovered TDR (Actually from a PSD guy refueling on the other side of the fuel pump from me). He said nice truck, easy and less $$ to modify than his. I asked what do you mean? His reply was, didn't you know there's a club for you Cummins drivers?



The next week I had a membership to the TDR.



That's my story and I'm sticking to it! hehe