Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) 24V dowel pin...

[blacksheepdiesel]

Because I had to remove the timing gear case cover to remove a stuck injection pump gear I took advantage of the opportunity to eyeball the infamous "Killer Dowel Pin". Having bought a jig from CPFF and used it on several 12 valves and early 24V I had never used the tool on Black Sheep as I was convinced that by 2001 the new "stepped" gear case was installed on all engines. Black Sheep does indeed have the stepped case. However, I began to wonder if the dowel pin had moved during the previous 662,xxx miles. So I grabbed a hammer and punch and "smack", sure enough, the pin drove back into the bore about 1/8". Which means Cummins did nothing to prevent the pin from wiggling loose, but rather kept it from falling out where it could do damage. The interesting thing is that it appears the dowel has vibrated against the step enough to wear it back. Does anyone have a measurement of step depth? I am going to measure mine before re-assembly and would like to know if the pin is actually wearing out the aluminum step.



Godspeed,

Trent

 

[Fishin Guide]

Dunno the answer to your query. But the KDP struck my dad's truck. Bone stock late '02... .



Dave

 

[blacksheepdiesel]

Dave,

How many miles did he have on it when it happened?

Godspeed,
Trent

 

[Fishin Guide]

Dave,



How many miles did he have on it when it happened?



Godspeed,

Trent

Let me see if I can find the file and I'll try to post it.



Dave

 

[Fishin Guide]

Here it is.



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Dave

 

[Coalsmoke]

Just wanted to say thanks for posting about the 02 with the KDP. It's proof that all 24 valves should be checked.

 

[SPearson]

I guess that answers my question about whether I should be worried about my early '99 24 valve! I have to replace the VP44 so I'll have to do the KDP at the same time. Do I need to buy the kit, or can I just fabricated the tab that holds the pin back? I know I need to replace the seal on the crank. If I'm not mistaken, the 24 valve doesn't use the gasket, just the sealant on the cover? Do I need to replace the pin too or just drive it back it? Sorry for all the questions, still new to these engines.

Stuart

 

[Joe Mc]

R & R of the VP doesn't require removal of the timing cover, just the breather to see the timing mark, access the gear nut to VP shaft and insert puller to push pump shaft off of gear.



As for KDP = I had a small leak on the timing "case" just below the water pump and decided to pull it all apart to inspect the dowel pin situation. Anyway, since I had the cover off I got the KDP tab thru Geno's and installed. By the way the dowel pin on my 99 24V w/180k was firmly in place - tabbed it anyway = cheap insurance.

 

[CWright]

KDP question?

Can I tell externally if my truck has the stepped case? It is a 201. 5 HO 6speed. Thanks for any info.

Clayton

 

[Highfinance97]

R & R of the VP doesn't require removal of the timing cover, just the breather to see the timing mark, access the gear nut to VP shaft and insert puller to push pump shaft off of gear.

Read it again, I believe he had an issue and knows of that

Because I had to remove the timing gear case cover to remove a stuck injection pump gear

 

[DCreed]

dont quit at the KDP! the other timing cover bolts (behind the gears) are just as dangerous and need to be cleaned and locktited in place.
Trent- the factory "fix" for the KDP was a stepped case, but its ONLY job was to ensure the pin didnt fall out. it has no specs for movement and all had slop.

 

[SPearson]

Kdp

dont quit at the KDP! the other timing cover bolts (behind the gears) are just as dangerous and need to be cleaned and locktited in place.



Great info! I didn't know there were problems with the bolts too. I'll loctite the Lil' Rascals in! I saw the KDP kit on Geno's site and will order it monday. I knew just the breather needed to come off for the VP44 replacement, I just figured since I was working on the engine in that area I would just get both things done at the same time. Thanks again for sharing the info and experience with me! I can't afford to find these things out the hard way.

Stuart

 

[DFerverda]

Stuart, be careful don't over tighten the bolts inside the timing cover, i think it is 18 ft lbs. I used brake clean to clean out the holes, blow out with air and use good quality locktite . The tab on the oil pump will snap off if you torque it too tight,(my $200 mistake. )
My 98. 5 had the kdp out about 3/8 of an inch, i think it had about 160k on the clock when i fixed it.
Also make sure you have the batteries disconnected when you do the vp, (when you unplug the apps) it didn't like it, and i started having problems with it shortly after the vp. I just put in a new one this morning. Thanks Timbo... ... ... .
Good luck
Dirk

 

[blacksheepdiesel]

CWright,

No. Stepped case vs. non-stepped look the same AFAIK.

DCreed,

Yes, I realize the "step" was simply to keep the dowel pin from getting into the gears when it came out of the bore. What I would like to know is the depth of the "step" as I think my dowel pin has vibrated against the step and worn it, leaving the possibility it could still fall into the gears.

Godspeed,
Trent

 

[BDaugherty]

So, exactly what all parts are required to tab a 24V KDP? There's the "tab" itself, a crank seal, what else? Is the crank pulley a press fit, or will it come off pretty easy? I need to remove my radiator for cleaning and it sure would be easier to pull the front cover with the fan, shroud, and radiator out of the way.

 

[DCreed]

Trent- it would have to be worn pretty bad. There is no pressure to push the pin out, the old ones simply fell out due to vibration and heat cycles of the different metals. If you are sweating losing the pin, tab it and sleep better knowing it CANT move.

 

[DCreed]

So, exactly what all parts are required to tab a 24V KDP? There's the "tab" itself, a crank seal, what else? Is the crank pulley a press fit, or will it come off pretty easy? I need to remove my radiator for cleaning and it sure would be easier to pull the front cover with the fan, shroud, and radiator out of the way.

balancer bolts on. 4 bolts. only tricky part is getting the fan hub off, you'll need a "thin" 10mm box end wrench for one of the bolts.

PS- I forgot to mention this, Please note: some trucks will have the cam gear "walk" off the end of the cam! it is not common w/24v but does happen and can destroy the motor if it does!! there are "bolt-on" cam gear kits and most aftermarket cams have them already to prevent this.

 

[blacksheepdiesel]

Take a grinder to a 10mm box end and make it fit.

Godspeed,
Trent

 

[Wyomingcowboy]

balancer bolts on. 4 bolts. only tricky part is getting the fan hub off, you'll need a "thin" 10mm box end wrench for one of the bolts.

PS- I forgot to mention this, Please note: some trucks will have the cam gear "walk" off the end of the cam! it is not common w/24v but does happen and can destroy the motor if it does!! there are "bolt-on" cam gear kits and most aftermarket cams have them already to prevent this.

Yep, my helix came with a bolt... might just as well do a cam while you are in there and have the radiator out!

 

[Joe Mc]

Read it again, I believe he had an issue and knows of that

I read it again, didn't see anything about a stuck gear at least in this post. No worries - it's all good.