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2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission 2k rust
- Thread starter Jim S
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Idaho Native
TDR MEMBER
Jim,
Can't believe the timing of your post! I washed my '99 today (bought brand new in Nov '98; 56K miles on it now)... I'm very anal about how clean I keep the thing, inside and out(just ask KatDiesel)
. I was wiping the inside of the bottom of the doors and noticed a spot on the bottom of my driver's door. Upon closer inspection, I found that the bottom of the door was rusted all the way through along an 8 - 10" section!!!
Looks like the place where the outer door skin and inner panel are rolled over each other was the start of the problem. I looked very closely at the passenger's door and it is just like new on the bottom.
The stealer is going to "fix" it free of charge under the 5yr/Unlimited outer panel rust warranty, but it'll never be "fixed" in my opinion. My father-in-law had his own body shop from about age 25 until he died a couple of years ago, and he would never "fix" a rust problem. He said the only fix was an entirely new panel, in this case, a whole new door!! Even if they cut in a new patch, it'll never be as tight as it was when new. Hope they seal the back side of the welds with something. The salt here in Nebraska will eat the paint off of anything.
As a side note, I was so pi$$ed off that I went and drove a new VW Jetta TDI for the fun of it! 50MPG sounds pretty darn good about now. Of course, I'm have second, third and fourth thoughts about it
Loren
Can't believe the timing of your post! I washed my '99 today (bought brand new in Nov '98; 56K miles on it now)... I'm very anal about how clean I keep the thing, inside and out(just ask KatDiesel)
. I was wiping the inside of the bottom of the doors and noticed a spot on the bottom of my driver's door. Upon closer inspection, I found that the bottom of the door was rusted all the way through along an 8 - 10" section!!! Looks like the place where the outer door skin and inner panel are rolled over each other was the start of the problem. I looked very closely at the passenger's door and it is just like new on the bottom.
The stealer is going to "fix" it free of charge under the 5yr/Unlimited outer panel rust warranty, but it'll never be "fixed" in my opinion. My father-in-law had his own body shop from about age 25 until he died a couple of years ago, and he would never "fix" a rust problem. He said the only fix was an entirely new panel, in this case, a whole new door!! Even if they cut in a new patch, it'll never be as tight as it was when new. Hope they seal the back side of the welds with something. The salt here in Nebraska will eat the paint off of anything.
As a side note, I was so pi$$ed off that I went and drove a new VW Jetta TDI for the fun of it! 50MPG sounds pretty darn good about now. Of course, I'm have second, third and fourth thoughts about it
Loren
I would not have 2nd thought about the Jetta TDi, I have one, and my truck 
In 110,000 miles on my 98 Jetta, I replaced the timing belt 2 times (about $50. 00 parts my cost each time) and one oil pan gasket under warranty. 4 glow plugs and a temp sensor ($100. 00), plus normal oil and filters and tires. (note: The TDI REQUIRES $ynethic oil)
In 80,000 miles on my 98 Dodge, I put 2 lift pumps on (one I paid for), one cruse control servo (under warranty) and one steering wheel (leather cracked, under warranty) plus normal oil and filters and tires (tires cost a lot more then the Jetta).
I traded the truck in for a 2002 3500, but keep on driving the Jetta.
But I would never trade my truck for a Jetta, unless I did not need a truck. Never going to "not need" a truck.
In 110,000 miles on my 98 Jetta, I replaced the timing belt 2 times (about $50. 00 parts my cost each time) and one oil pan gasket under warranty. 4 glow plugs and a temp sensor ($100. 00), plus normal oil and filters and tires. (note: The TDI REQUIRES $ynethic oil)
In 80,000 miles on my 98 Dodge, I put 2 lift pumps on (one I paid for), one cruse control servo (under warranty) and one steering wheel (leather cracked, under warranty) plus normal oil and filters and tires (tires cost a lot more then the Jetta).
I traded the truck in for a 2002 3500, but keep on driving the Jetta.
But I would never trade my truck for a Jetta, unless I did not need a truck. Never going to "not need" a truck.
Originally posted by Idaho Native
Jim,
As a side note, I was so pi$$ed off that I went and drove a new VW Jetta TDI for the fun of it! 50MPG sounds pretty darn good about now. Of course, I'm have second, third and fourth thoughts about it
Loren
I thought I was the only one with a rusty door! Plan on having a friend that does high end muscle car body work do the repair eventually. Sucks, but I am not given up that Cummins for nothin.
I have heard that we are suppose to knock the plastic plugs out of the bottoms of the doors to let the water out that makes it down between the side glass. I live in Kalifornia, so I have yet to do this.
Idaho Native
TDR MEMBER
I'll take a look for the plastic plugs you're talking about... I hadn't heard that one. If it wasn't for the fact that mine is paid off and has otherwise been a pretty flawless (one lift pump) truck! Trouble is that I have too many toys... 99 Dodge; 95 Impala SS and an 01 Durango. Still making payments on the Durango. Will likely trade when it's paid off. I'll always be in the mode of needing a truck
Having done a lot of body work myself (father-in-law had his own body shop), I know the only way to really fix the door is to replace it entirely, but Dodge won't have any of that. They're "fixing" it this week under warranty by cutting and patching the panels.
Kat, I'll let you know how the fix turns out.
Having done a lot of body work myself (father-in-law had his own body shop), I know the only way to really fix the door is to replace it entirely, but Dodge won't have any of that. They're "fixing" it this week under warranty by cutting and patching the panels.
Kat, I'll let you know how the fix turns out.
Idaho Native
TDR MEMBER
Matt,
There is a 5yr/unlimited mileage warranty on "outer panel" rust- through on these trucks. I'm making a leap and assuming it is transferable to new owners. That's where mine is rusted also, but it had spread to the outer sheet metal just above the bottom of the door. I did find the two plastic plugs in the bottom of both doors that were still in place The guys in the dealer body shop said that these should have been removed... but didn't say that it was a dealer prep kind of thing. If the fix for the rust is something that will come back in a year or two (and I suspect in our case that it will), then DC supposedly will replace the entire door! Time will tell. I'll post the results.
Loren
There is a 5yr/unlimited mileage warranty on "outer panel" rust- through on these trucks. I'm making a leap and assuming it is transferable to new owners. That's where mine is rusted also, but it had spread to the outer sheet metal just above the bottom of the door. I did find the two plastic plugs in the bottom of both doors that were still in place
The guys in the dealer body shop said that these should have been removed... but didn't say that it was a dealer prep kind of thing. If the fix for the rust is something that will come back in a year or two (and I suspect in our case that it will), then DC supposedly will replace the entire door! Time will tell. I'll post the results. Loren
I may be getting motivated again. I'm thinking of pulling the plugs and shooting some Waxoyl in there to further rust proof the bottom of the door.
Bill-
For frames and large metal surfaces, which can be painted, I would use something like POR-15 (http://www.por15.com/). However for places that are less accessible, applications of products such as Waxoyl seem more appropriate because they can be sprayed into enclosed areas without the worry of "painting" vital parts. Waxoyl has long been a favorite rust prevention system used among auto restoration enthusiasts (especially old British cars). I'm sure that we could also remove the door panels and give the inside bottom edges of the door a good painting. Waxoyl is a little harder to find as it is made overseas but sometimes can be found through specialty shops. I have seen it sold at Moss Motors and in Hemings Motor News. It is basically just a paraffin mineral spirits mixture which leaves a waxy film over the applied area. A while back I found a couple of recipes online (I can't recall the author to give him thanks) for making your own. I'll print it as follows:
Recipe #1
Take a ½ kilogram of paraffin wax or candle making wax and grind it up with a cheese grater. Soak it in 2 liters of mineral spirits/ Paraffin/ Kerosene/ lamp oil/ Diesel until all of the wax is dissolved. It might take a couple of weeks. Stirring will cause most of the wax to dissolve, but soaking should take care of the rest, heating the mixture in hot water (no open flames) will add in the quick dissolving of the wax. Generally try to dissolve as much wax as the mineral spirits/ kerosene/ paraffin/lamp oil/ Diesel will hold. Pour one liter of mineral oil/ non-detergent motor oil into the dissolved mixture. If the mixture is too thick for spraying you can thin it further with more mineral spirits until it is of a spray-able consistency.
Recipe #2
Here is a recipe for homemade "Waxoyl". It's an old fashioned rust treatment / undercoating:
2 1/2 quarts turpentine
12 oz. beeswax / candle wax
1 quart light machine oil
With a cheese shredder, cut the wax into the turpentine, stir until the wax has dissolved, (takes a long time; you can use very low heat (a warm room) to aid but be careful) and thin with the machine oil to a brushable / sprayable consistency. Apply liberally. You can use a hand spray bottle to get into closed-off sections if you have a small access hole.
Please be sensible when you make this stuff; don't go breathing the fumes or applying heat and burning down your house. If you have any doubts about it, err on the side of caution and just buy a commercially available product.
For frames and large metal surfaces, which can be painted, I would use something like POR-15 (http://www.por15.com/). However for places that are less accessible, applications of products such as Waxoyl seem more appropriate because they can be sprayed into enclosed areas without the worry of "painting" vital parts. Waxoyl has long been a favorite rust prevention system used among auto restoration enthusiasts (especially old British cars). I'm sure that we could also remove the door panels and give the inside bottom edges of the door a good painting. Waxoyl is a little harder to find as it is made overseas but sometimes can be found through specialty shops. I have seen it sold at Moss Motors and in Hemings Motor News. It is basically just a paraffin mineral spirits mixture which leaves a waxy film over the applied area. A while back I found a couple of recipes online (I can't recall the author to give him thanks) for making your own. I'll print it as follows:
Recipe #1
Take a ½ kilogram of paraffin wax or candle making wax and grind it up with a cheese grater. Soak it in 2 liters of mineral spirits/ Paraffin/ Kerosene/ lamp oil/ Diesel until all of the wax is dissolved. It might take a couple of weeks. Stirring will cause most of the wax to dissolve, but soaking should take care of the rest, heating the mixture in hot water (no open flames) will add in the quick dissolving of the wax. Generally try to dissolve as much wax as the mineral spirits/ kerosene/ paraffin/lamp oil/ Diesel will hold. Pour one liter of mineral oil/ non-detergent motor oil into the dissolved mixture. If the mixture is too thick for spraying you can thin it further with more mineral spirits until it is of a spray-able consistency.
Recipe #2
Here is a recipe for homemade "Waxoyl". It's an old fashioned rust treatment / undercoating:
2 1/2 quarts turpentine
12 oz. beeswax / candle wax
1 quart light machine oil
With a cheese shredder, cut the wax into the turpentine, stir until the wax has dissolved, (takes a long time; you can use very low heat (a warm room) to aid but be careful) and thin with the machine oil to a brushable / sprayable consistency. Apply liberally. You can use a hand spray bottle to get into closed-off sections if you have a small access hole.
Please be sensible when you make this stuff; don't go breathing the fumes or applying heat and burning down your house. If you have any doubts about it, err on the side of caution and just buy a commercially available product.
Rust Fix
Heres the most popular solution that our body shop uses. All 94 and new Rams are affected with this problem as we have ordered dozens of premade door bottoms. We drill a hole in the door frame between the latch and where the door frame starts to roll underneath. Squirt used oil in the door bottom, pull the fuse for interior lights and leave doors open to drain. You can find plugs at any hardware store. If you dont want to drill a hole remove the door panel, peel back the plastic and squirt oil through access holes. Same deal if you have and extended or quad cab. This is THE most effective solution that we have found since the oil is absorbed into the metal and does not coat it. Rust can still form under coated metal and dont let anyone tell you different. I have repaired truck after truck with the spraycan rustproofing and the stuff in a bottles in the doors. Factory amber coating is ok because it contains more oil and rarely dries out, but is still inadequate. Body shops may use a drip check sealer, which is pretty much the same stuff the factory uses. If any moisture is in the door when putting rustproofing on you have trapped the moisture underneath. Spray can coatings can dry out and separate from the inner panel. Once moistre gets in the cancer will spread. This is why we have found oil to be the best solution. If nothing else use some WD-40 or something similiar. Oiling is even more important after having a door bottom replaced. Exposed welds and seams can rust over a short period. Any welding will burn off factory metal treatment. If adhesive is used it is less of an issue but still important. I oil my '01 doors, bedsides, rockers, and cab corners every spring and fall. Now you have something to do with that 2. 5 gallons of used oil from every change!!!
Heres the most popular solution that our body shop uses. All 94 and new Rams are affected with this problem as we have ordered dozens of premade door bottoms. We drill a hole in the door frame between the latch and where the door frame starts to roll underneath. Squirt used oil in the door bottom, pull the fuse for interior lights and leave doors open to drain. You can find plugs at any hardware store. If you dont want to drill a hole remove the door panel, peel back the plastic and squirt oil through access holes. Same deal if you have and extended or quad cab. This is THE most effective solution that we have found since the oil is absorbed into the metal and does not coat it. Rust can still form under coated metal and dont let anyone tell you different. I have repaired truck after truck with the spraycan rustproofing and the stuff in a bottles in the doors. Factory amber coating is ok because it contains more oil and rarely dries out, but is still inadequate. Body shops may use a drip check sealer, which is pretty much the same stuff the factory uses. If any moisture is in the door when putting rustproofing on you have trapped the moisture underneath. Spray can coatings can dry out and separate from the inner panel. Once moistre gets in the cancer will spread. This is why we have found oil to be the best solution. If nothing else use some WD-40 or something similiar. Oiling is even more important after having a door bottom replaced. Exposed welds and seams can rust over a short period. Any welding will burn off factory metal treatment. If adhesive is used it is less of an issue but still important. I oil my '01 doors, bedsides, rockers, and cab corners every spring and fall. Now you have something to do with that 2. 5 gallons of used oil from every change!!!
DPugh-
The waxoyl is an oily application for the very reasons you indicate. Notice that the main ingredient is machine oil. The oil IS aborbed into the metal, but, because of the wax, it also resists being washed off. I definitely agree about coatings trapping moisture.
The waxoyl is an oily application for the very reasons you indicate. Notice that the main ingredient is machine oil. The oil IS aborbed into the metal, but, because of the wax, it also resists being washed off. I definitely agree about coatings trapping moisture.
David,
Your coating should work well too, it sounds similiar to factory sealer. I was just wanted to give an alternate solution that I know will work and not cause anyone the misery of seeing their door bottoms rust away. The only thing I think I'd watch is that the holes, since they are so small, dont plug up, as I have seen this with spray can stuff. I think either one would be an good choice to prevent rust.
Your coating should work well too, it sounds similiar to factory sealer. I was just wanted to give an alternate solution that I know will work and not cause anyone the misery of seeing their door bottoms rust away. The only thing I think I'd watch is that the holes, since they are so small, dont plug up, as I have seen this with spray can stuff. I think either one would be an good choice to prevent rust.
Anyone know where to find any documentation on the warranty. I KNOW these guys are gonna balk. Better yet anyone know of a dealer in the Northeastern maryland area or Baltimore vicinity that handles this stuff well. I really would like my truck fixed for nothin.
Thanks
Thanks
Idaho Native
TDR MEMBER
Tractorface,
I found the documentation in the warranty booklet that came with my pickup... I'm assuming that you're the original owner. If I remember correctly, it was about the third bar graph down on the warranty coverage sheet.
By the way, I called the dealer this morning and found out that they are putting a whole new door on my pickup. I'm very happy about that.
I'll also be squirting some of the homemade waxoil -- thanks to dresslerd and dpugh for the ideas. Since my passenger door appears to be in excellent condition, would it hurt to squirt it in there, if there's a chance of some surface rust already in place? I have had the bad experiences with the "rustproofing" in a can drying out and cracking or as stated, just covering the problem and possibly making it worse. Sounds like the waxoil idea might at least stave the spread of the cancer if it's alread there to some degree. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
Loren
I found the documentation in the warranty booklet that came with my pickup... I'm assuming that you're the original owner. If I remember correctly, it was about the third bar graph down on the warranty coverage sheet.
By the way, I called the dealer this morning and found out that they are putting a whole new door on my pickup. I'm very happy about that.
I'll also be squirting some of the homemade waxoil -- thanks to dresslerd and dpugh for the ideas. Since my passenger door appears to be in excellent condition, would it hurt to squirt it in there, if there's a chance of some surface rust already in place? I have had the bad experiences with the "rustproofing" in a can drying out and cracking or as stated, just covering the problem and possibly making it worse. Sounds like the waxoil idea might at least stave the spread of the cancer if it's alread there to some degree. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
Loren
Thanks Idaho Native
I am not the Original owner but I have the booklet and will check it out. A whole new door is very impressive. Way to go DC
I am not the Original owner but I have the booklet and will check it out. A whole new door is very impressive. Way to go DC
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Issue 128 – Digital Version
Digital Magazines
FREE!
TDR Test Drive - Digital Edition
Renew
Subscribe
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Back Issues
Subscription Status
Address Change Form
Buyer's Guides
Ram Diagnostic Trouble Codes
The Perfect Collection
The Perfect Collection Vol. II
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Dodge/Cummins Historical Overview
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What Makes Us Tick?
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