4-Wheel ABS is Useless!!!

[Steve St.Laurent]

I'm an ABS hater as well. I have driven cars with GREAT ABS systems (Corvette for one) that there is no way you could outbrake it (Formula 1 cars have ABS BTW), but the truck systems suck. I also got in an accident with an S-10 because of the ABS, I would have been stopped in time but put slightly too much pressure on the brakes and locked a tire for a second and bingo - no brakes (that system took about 1/4 second to reapply them - just long enough to hit the car). Here's some posts I made on an old thread about this ( https://www.turbodieselregister.com/ubb//Forum4/HTML/003079.html ):

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Personally I can't stand ABS. I've yet to find an ABS system on any truck that I couldn't outperform in any conditions. On my last truck (a GMC Sonoma 4x4), I could beat it by 20% on dry pavement and by over 60% on snow. I hooked up a switch to disable it on that truck. I would have just removed it but I wanted to have it at resale time (liability reasons) and also the cruise control worked off of the same fuse, so I'd turn it on when I wanted to use the cruise. Car systems are another story, I drove a Vette that there's no way I could have beaten the ABS system. JMHO
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I've gone over the schematics in my '98 manual and it looks like fuse 11 in the PDC (underhood fuse box) runs the ABS controller. If you pull that fuse you should disable the ABS brakes. You will set off the ABS light on the dash and it might set a code (I'm not sure about the code). One solution for the ABS light is to just remove that bulb. You could also put a relay and a switch on the Red/Dark Green wire coming off of that fuse so you could disable it when you wanted to (this was what I did on my GMC Sonoma). I can't find where there's anything else that runs off of that circuit in my manual. I don't have 4w ABS on my truck so I can't really test it, but I did pull it with my rear wheel ABS and I didn't get any bells going off. If you decide to do this make sure you let anyone know that drive's your truck that the ABS system is disabled.
-Steve


DISCLAIMER: If you decide to try this you do so at your own risk. I am not recommending that you disable this system. I take no responsibility for anything that might arise from this
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[This message has been edited by Steve St. Laurent (edited 03-27-2001). ]

 

[SA Law]

rmrc

We use Ford Crown Victoria's for our police cars down here in San Antonio, and part of our training every year is high speed starting and stopping on dry and wet pavement. These cars come with abs and I have never experienced any problems after travelling at 80+ mph and then slamming on the brakes. Most people are taken off guard at the fact that the brake pedal begins to vibrate when abs kicks in. This is normal and do not mean it's broken. For most abs systems, the easiset way to disable them is to, beleive or not, pump your brakes. What people usually do in accidents is forget they have abs and begin to pump the pedal, which disables the system and causes the tires to lock up. Ive seen alot of fatal accidents where this has occured. I think that abs would be more effective if the general public was aware of its function and proper use. Just my $. 02

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Brian
2001. 5 2500 4x4 lwb, forest green, camper group, trailer tow group,travel convenience group, cass/cd/equal, 5spd,slt,LSD,3. 54,Shift-on-the-fly, Line-x bedliner, nerf bars

 

[rmrc]

SA Law

Thanks for the responce. I was always under the impression that you would be able to stop in a shorter distance if you lock your brakes as long as you know how to control your skid. The only way I could make a true comparision would be to drive the same vehicle, (one with ABS and one without) and put them into the same braking situations. Your job, IMHO, makes you a bit of an authority on the subject. I'll give your statment and your experience a great deal of weight when the time (or truck) finally arrives!!!!

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No truck at present. Waiting to see what the 2003 model year has to offer in the Ram 2500.

 

[MHindman]

do you have 4wd on your trucks? That would cause the truck to take longer to stop. I dont know if this is true, just a thought i had... if you are in 4wd, and the abs is working, it would be hard to control the braking, since the front and back wheels are connected. When my truck is in 4wd the rear abs doesnt work. but in 2wd it works fine. so maybe thats part of the problem. take the truck on wet roads, going about 60mph, slam them on and let me know how much better abs are. Try it with the abs first, since you will probably shoot off the road without them... Just my 2cents

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(Silver Bullet)1999 Ext Cab 4X4 5SPD, All options. Power Max 3(adjustable), K&N Filter, no muffler, Pyro,Fender Flares, Toolbox, bedrail covers, 450 watt Kenwood Sub, 33 12. 50 16. 5's, 3. 54's... Soon to have: 4inch, DDIII's, Southbend clutch.

 

[Nemies]

For everyone's ABS experiences, have you been loaded or unloaded? I, too, feel like the ABS takes forever to stop me when I'm unloaded. However, the one time I did emergency braking while towing, I would say it helped quite a bit. I floored the brakes and felt the trailer brakes kick on. When they started sliding, I felt the trailer start to push me, and that's when ABS in the truck kicked on. And that seemed to slow me down in a big hurry.

Seems like they were designed to be used while the truck was loaded up... ?


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Kees C.
99, 4x4, 2500, 5spd, HD, LSD, SB, QC, Sport, Forest-Green, Cab-Lights
Rhinoliner, toolbox, dual Firestiks

[This message has been edited by Nemies (edited 05-08-2001). ]

 

[Ray J]

I was recently going down a very steep hill in my neighborhood (unloaded)... early in morning before any sanding was done after one of our ice/snow storms. The bottom of the road intersects with a heavily-used secondary road. Half way down I tapped the brakes and immediately started to slide.

Left fuel alone and just jumped hard on the ABS. Slid all the way down the hill in a perfectly straight line with the pedal "vibrating" all the way. Stopped at the bottom with my nose sticking out just a tad into the intersection.

My balls just shriveled as I saw the intersection coming up, but the ABS worked just fine. Was in 4WD high.

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01 2500 Sport, QC, LWB, Auto, 4. 10, 4x4, Camper Pkg, Tow Pkg, Geno's muffler eliminator pipe, rest is stock for now.
62 T-Bird

 

[95REDRAM]

As I remember it from physics class and driving school, a sliding wheel moves faster than a wheel that is just before lockup. Who has driven a non ABS vehicle and had the rear brakes lock while the front ones were still turning? If you stay in that type of skid for any length of time the rear end starts to come around and wants to pass the front end. The reason, the rear axle is now moving faster than the front axle. My 4 wheel ABS system works fine and I'm convinced it helped me avoid a collision when a big ol Pontiac lead-sled pulled out in front of me with no warning. I climbed on the brakes hard and it looked like the Pontiac was going to take it right in the driver's door. Just in time he realized his error and stopped his car. I steered around the front of him with the brakes still on full. Very few drivers could do that without ABS. As far a washboard roads go, I can't take the beating that you get when going anywhere near speeds that could involve tricky braking situations. Just slow down a little. Hell, life ain't meant to be rushed through. ABS isn't perfect but I like mine.

 

[HC]

I think 4wABS varies from vehicle to vehicle

On the nose, John!
Anybody notice how many of the folks reporting problems had GM systems? (Add me to the list, 1992 'burb. )
All those who think it is just poorly trained drivers or failure to understand, come on down my way and let's go for a test drive. I think you'll be singing a different tune if you do... (no offense intended, but I'm kind of tired of ABS fans telling me that the problem is I either don't know how to drive or just don't "understand" the system)
I believe those who say some systems are great; I just don't believe ALL systems are great. And it sounds like the Dodge truck is "average" at best.

 

[Ross]

I don't know about the Dodge (mine has 2-wheel ABS), but a friend of mine has a chevy 4X4. He is EXTREMELY disappointed with the 4-wheel ABS. He off-roads a lot, and going down steep inclines, the ABS kicks in, and swoosh! down the hill he goes, bounding over boulders and hoping to miss trees and other obstacles! He is selling the truck because of this feature. I told him just disable it, but he is pi**ed about the vehicle. He says it's a town car, not a 4X4. I think he's looking at the Dodge!

 

[Lordsman]

I had a '95 chevy 4x4 before I started buying Dodge/Cummins and ABS worked good. I was driving up LaVeta pass in a blinding snowstorm and at the top cars were stopped or sliding everywhere. I hit the brakes hard,
felt ABS kick in, drove through/around the whole mess w/ no problems. I only have rear abs on my '99 Dodge. I would take your rigs for adjustment if they don't work as they should.

 

[Timinator]

Mine just saved me an insurance claim today. As I approached an intersection an started to slow down, some butthead cut me off and forced me to brake harder. The entire intersection was ice. I was able to stop short of the butthead. I could hear/feel the ABS working.
I agree that it stinks on washboard roads.

 

[Ray J]

Originally posted by Ross:
I don't know about the Dodge (mine has 2-wheel ABS), but a friend of mine has a chevy 4X4. He is EXTREMELY disappointed with the 4-wheel ABS. He off-roads a lot, and going down steep inclines, the ABS kicks in, and swoosh! down the hill he goes, bounding over boulders and hoping to miss trees and other obstacles! He is selling the truck because of this feature. I told him just disable it, but he is pi**ed about the vehicle. He says it's a town car, not a 4X4. I think he's looking at the Dodge!

It sounds like he's not using 4 Low and low gear and letting compression slow him down. Its tough to imagine "bounding" over anything in that mode.