6 speed vs Auto

[ClifSeward]

Drove a 2005 diesel with a auto and thought the truck felt sluggish, almost like the motor was de-fueling. It sure did'nt feal like 325/610 to me. Is the 6 speed any better? I cant seem to find one to test drive.

 

[SAvery]

I have driven both and I definitely feel like the auto is sluggish until about 2000 rpm. I have an 01 auto which feels even more sluggish. I would say that if you hate that sluggish feel , that it is only slightly better in the 3rd gens. It's still there, I just think that the motor pulls harder once the converter engages. The 6 speeds pulls harder , but the shifting gears slows the truck a little. I like the "direct" feel of the manual more (no sluggishness that is) so that is why I am going from an auto to a manual this time.

 

[TSpecht]

I just picked up my 2005 1 ton SRW a couple of days ago, and it has the NV5600. This truck can be described as anything but sluggish. I tend to pick a gear that keeps me around 1600rpm's or so, and when you punch the throttle it'll push you back in your seat... It revs so surprisingly quickly you need to really watch yourself on some of the lower gears so as to not overrev it, that needle hits red pretty quick...



I too thought the automatic equipped trucks had less impressive power than the manual when I was test driving. Right off the line it seems like it might have been a little quicker with the auto but after that the manual takes right over...



I haven't towed anything with it yet so I cannot report on that. The build sheet lists it as 325/610 ft lb.



Still on my first tank so no calculated mileage figures, but not babying it too much the overhead is reading in the 16's to 17's, with about 218 miles currently on it...

 

[klenger]

IMHO, they all feel a bit sluggish till you get a few miles on them.

 

[tschwab]

Not trying to start an auto vs 6 spd war, but I actually thought the auto felt faster around town in stop & go driving.

 

[SAvery]

Not trying to start an auto vs 6 spd war, but I actually thought the auto felt faster around town in stop & go driving.

I agree that the auto is faster, but from a dead standstill, I feel it is a little more hesitant than a manual. A lot obviously has to do with the turbo lag and the rest has to do with the mushy converter that they use to protect the transmission from the torque of the cummins. I like the 48RE better than the 47RE, I will admit it feels a lot more solid at transferring the torque. I think that you could eliminate a lot of the lag in the converter by raising the line pressure with a transcommand. To answer things from my perspective, I would suggest that that he drive both the manual and auto before taking our words for it. $35-40K is a lot of money when make the wrong choice. Best of luck.

 

[CTA]

When I ordered my truck I ordered it w/the 6-speed manual. I too had some difficulty in finding a manual to drive because they are basically found in work/stripped trucks unless you order your rig that way. Despite what anyone will tell you as to how DC has improved and "beefed" up their automatic transmissions, they are likely among the worst when it comes to reliability and durability when it comes to handling the torque from the mighty Cummins. Quite honestly the larger gas engines eat them up too, over and over and over again!

Do yourself a favor and opt for a manual transmission, even if you have to order it! After having had my last automatic transmission replaced once and rebuilt a second time ... never again!

 

[Snellville-Dave]

What might help Dodge is to get a 5speed auto with features similar to the Ford or Chevy. Dodge seems to be laging behind in the Auto Trans dept. Maybe the Dodge engineers need to convince the German Bosses they need to up date the transmissions to be competitive with the compition.

 

[tschwab]

There are many Auto's out there with NO problems that tow alot, mine, my brothers, my dad and both uncles to name a few. There are also a lot of people who don't know how to tow with an auto to protect it.



You should always tow out of OD. You should also put your truck in nuetral when waiting at a long stop light. You should never let your trans shift back & forth between gears or between OD and 3rd, cuases tremendous heat. Trans oil (including draining the torque converter - have it pumped out) and filter need to be done on a regular basis AND if you heated your trans oil up too high, it is now worthless and will cause your trans to fail early.



Most people don't maintain their transmissions properly and don't know how tow with an auto and then bash the manufacturer when they fail. If you practice what I mentioned above and don't turn up the power (leave it stock), you should not have any problems.



The 48RE's are showing very few problems, much less than ford & chev.

 

[tschwab]

What might help Dodge is to get a 5speed auto with features similar to the Ford or Chevy. Dodge seems to be laging behind in the Auto Trans dept.

Wrong answer and mis-information about the 5 spd. It is not needed with the low reving hight torque of the Cummins.

 

[CTA]

There is a possibility that "some" folks have ended up with a "good" but rare automatic from DC that has not failed "yet". The previous failure I noted with my last automatic was on a Ford F-2sissy. W/the exception of shifting into neutral when at a stop light, all the precautions you noted were taken, and then some. The transmission was flushed annually, an inline transmission filter was installed, a temperature guage "and" twin cooling fans in addition to the oversized transmission cooler. Lastly the transmission was being asked to tow less then half of it's rated capacity. The bottom line was it never should have failed, either time. The "regular" trannys in the GM products (all but the Allison) are just as unreliable. A Die Hard Chevy friend of mine had his rebuilt 3x in less then 40k and when he traded it in, it was having problems again. He had taken all the same precautions I had. It is good to hear they are not "all" garbage and I encourage you and others to keep a close eye on them. The stats right now give the Allison the best ratings right now and I imagine the TorqueShift in the Ford will likely be comparable or at least second. DC needs to get with the program and design/manufacture an entirely "new" transmission for the HD trucks because they simply don't cut it.



Know three other guys w/Rams, all with automatics, one (gas) of them has never hauled anything and his has been rebuilt once already, the other (gas) did tow a camper and he is on his second and the third (H. O. 325) ... his was on an '04 3500, failed within two weeks of picking up the brand new truck.

 

[Bertram65]

Based on information posted on this board from the hundreds of members with 3rd gen trucks there have been very few problems with the 48RE automatic. Seems like the majority of the failures we hear about are not on members trucks and are very short on details, makes you wonder how accurate the information is, or they are on a truck that has been modified and now has 300 more ft/lbs of torque. Those always bashing the 48RE how about backing it up with some facts. Another thing to keep in mind is that vast majority of Dodge diesel trucks sold are automatics, so there are going to be less failures on the standards, but I would bet percentage wise to the number of each sold the faulure or problem rate is comparable, and they are both pretty low.

 

[tschwab]

CTAndersen, I dis-agree, if DC's auto's were junk, nobody would buy them. the "Allison" is not a real Allison just has the name and the problem/failure rate is higher on them that the 48RE. I know the head diesel tech at the dealer I go to, the 48RE has been a very reliable transmission. Ford's torque shift & Chevy's Allison by name only get all the rave, because they are a 5spd, whoopee, that doesn't mean jack to a Cummins low revving motor... . in other words - a five spd auto is not needed and the 48RE has at least as good a track record of the torqueshift and allison if not better.

 

[CTA]

Points well made ... However one fact that is not in the equation is that neither the Allison or the TorqueShift can even come close to comparing in "numbers", meaning quantity that is. DC transmission has been around much longer then either of the other two so the track record of the other two is short lived vs. that of the DC transmission. Also correct that the majority of the trucks sold by DC are automatics as most don't like shifting or the inconvienance of the same. Oh, all the trannys mentioned previously, were not on modified trucks, all stock, w/the one exception of the Chevy mentioned.

Hey, numbers can't be wrong, if the majority of the Dodge owners on TDR have had few problems by comparison, simply must be I know more folks that have had problems vs. those who have not. You know what they say about bad news vs. good news.

Didn't mean to rattle anyone's cage or "dis" DC automatic, just adding my . 02 from personal experience. Like I noted previously, have had too much bad experience with automatics and "I" personally wouldn't buy another in a truck application again, despite the fact I hate shifting myself but would prefer the reliability vs. the convienance!

Pleasant Motoring Fellas.

 

[Snellville-Dave]

I don't know about wrong answer? Was just reading a article in a magazine and evern the Nissan Titan has a 5 sp auto.

 

[jnelson]

You should always tow out of OD.

I always towed in OD with my '01. If a truck cant tow in its tallest gear - It aint worth having.



Heres a little history in my 47re n my 2001 -

New TC and VB at 88,000 miles.

New TC and 2nd gear band at 281,000 miles

Sold truck at 433,300 miles with the original transmision.



This trucked towed a 36ft flatbed gn almost everyday. the heaviest load towed was 56,000 lbs+-.



People can bash the dodge transmission all they want - With the proper upgrades - its a great transmission



. 02

 

[tschwab]

I always towed in OD with my '01. If a truck cant tow in its tallest gear - It aint worth having.

Well - It probably would have lasted even longer if you towed out of OD! If I'm on a flat, depending on my speed, I may put in in OD while towing.



A very wise performance transmission builder (who is famous amongst us diesel enthusiast's) is the one who told me you should tow out of OD as the TC does not lock while in OD, which causes heat and fluid shearing.

 

[DGStrate]

Well - It probably would have lasted even longer if you towed out of OD! If I'm on a flat, depending on my speed, I may put in in OD while towing.



A very wise performance transmission builder (who is famous amongst us diesel enthusiast's) is the one who told me you should tow out of OD as the TC does not lock while in OD, which causes heat and fluid shearing.

Not trying to start a war, but I think you may be misinformed...

I can feel and tell by the RPM difference that my TC definitely "locks" while I am in OD on my 2004. 5. My 2001. 5 (with 47-RE) also would lock in OD.



Please explain why/who said they did not?



Note: you do have to be past a certain speed for the TC to lock, but it is only between 45-50 mph...

 

[TCDiesel]

You can buy the DC/cummins 48re for close to $5,000. 00 less than any Ford/TQ or Duramax/Allision combo,UP grade trans for $3,000. 00 ,$2,000,00 for Mods ,So for the same cost , YOU will have A great engine/trans combo.

 

[GFritsch]

Here is a thread that examines in ridiculous detail the technical debate of auto vs. manual.



http://turbodieselregister.com/forums/showthread.php?t=109711



Personally I like my six speed. If I were wanting an auto I would wait until the new 5 speed comes.



As klenger mentioned the Cummins needs a couple thousand miles before it will wake up, and 10k or more to reach peak economy and power.