A couple towing questions

[magothy1]

I have a 2016 3500 Tradesman, with the 48RE trans, and pull a 25’ PJ gooseneck to take a Deere 5055 tractor to the dealership for repairs. I’m wondering about what towing rpm to try to maintain, secondary roads, running 50 mph, 3.42 rear .The truck seems happy enough in 5th gear, altho rpms seem a little low to me. Running the 50-52mph it’s around 1600-1700. It doesn’t feel as tho it’s lugging on a little uphill. This is in southeast South Carolina, fairly flat. I’m using the tow/haul setting. I seem to recall reading or hearing that towing in 6th isn’t a good idea, I can understand that.

Does anyone else have a PJ gooseneck ? I’m having trouble with getting a “check trailer brake wiring” on the readout. Where would you start to look for that problem ? I cleaned the truck end female plug, and cleaned the trailer plug as well. It works fine when I start out but after a bit or road time, and some bouncing, the notice comes up. I guess there’s no end of possibilities.

Thanks for any help.

Steve

 

[NIsaacs]

I assume you mean 68rfe. When I am in tow/haul @50-52 my '21 will stay in 5th, 3.73's. At about 55 it will up shift to 6th. 16-1700 rpm should be fine. At 50-52, sixth will be lugging with that load.

I have a PJ gooseneck dump, but no problems with electrical yet. Generally, a wiring problem is ground related. Do all lights and brakes work fine? Do you have an in bed plug, or are you using the bumper plug? Is your trailer plug molded to the cord or is it an add on?

Late model PJ's use this style plug, it is rare to have issues with them. The double contact one on the left. The single contact style can be problematic, right hand one.

 

[sag2]

Just put it in drive and let the truck decide what gear it wants to be in. If the low RPM bothers you it is easy to lack out a higher gear.

 

[magothy1]

Thanks for the idea on the ground, I’ll look around at those connections. I do have the double tab plug. I folded sandpaper to a thickness where it would work on both side of the tabs and cleaned them like that. The lights are very bright, all work well. The trailer plug might be an add on, I’ll check. The truck has two spots to plug in, on the bumper and in the bed. Both do the same thing as far as showing the message about check trailer wiring.

 

[Ozymandias]

The rpm range of these new engines is much wider and goes down much lower then the predecessor.
They pull fine almost down to a thousand rpm if the load isn't to heavy.
You can not lug the engine with the auto Trans, it will downshift if it doesn't like what you are doing.
As long as it stays I gear, all is good.

 

[bcbender]

Check trailer I've had many times,. usually hit a bump and the cord loses connection even for a second and it says that. I upgraded the cord on my 5er due to this annoyance.. as for the trans and RPM, as all have said,.. run TH mode and it'll be happy and fine, just sit, steer and enjoy!

 

[AH64ID]

Late model PJ's use this style plug, it is rare to have issues with them. The double contact one on the left. The single contact style can be problematic, right hand one.

View attachment 138338

You are not supposed to use the dual blade style 7-pin connectors. I would swap it over to a single blade and see if the issue remains.

https://www.ramtrucks.com/BodyBuilder/service/ViewSpecification?specificationId=2192&fileName=Ram_All_Trailer Conn Compat_All.pdf

 

[NIsaacs]

You are not supposed to use the dual blade style 7-pin connectors. I would swap it over to a single blade and see if the issue remains.

https://www.ramtrucks.com/BodyBuilder/service/ViewSpecification?specificationId=2192&fileName=Ram_All_Trailer Conn Compat_All.pdf

Yes, I have heard/seen some discussion about this. If they are in good shape, not damaged, they work fine. I have both with no issues.

These are both factory plugs. They both work fine on all my trucks.

 

[NIsaacs]

Thanks for the idea on the ground, I’ll look around at those connections. I do have the double tab plug. I folded sandpaper to a thickness where it would work on both side of the tabs and cleaned them like that. The lights are very bright, all work well. The trailer plug might be an add on, I’ll check. The truck has two spots to plug in, on the bumper and in the bed. Both do the same thing as far as showing the message about check trailer wiring.

How old is your trailer? You might have a bad breakaway battery. I would check it and maybe replace it. Also, jack up the axles and turn each tire while someone hits the brake and make sure each one is working. If one or more are not, I would start there.

 

[slowmover]

Figure breakaway a replaceable item at 3-5/years. Same as tires.

Main harness also gets old.
https://ezconnector.com/

Full wire upgrade:
https://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/23470880.cfm

 

[AH64ID]

Yes, I have heard/seen some discussion about this. If they are in good shape, not damaged, they work fine. I have both with no issues.

These are both factory plugs. They both work fine on all my trucks.View attachment 138349 View attachment 138350

It’s still the wrong plug for the receptacle Ram uses, and as mentioned in the document I posted the dual style can damage the OEM receptacle. I’m not sure that’s worth saving $10 to just swap them out to the correct plug.

 

[NIsaacs]

It’s still the wrong plug for the receptacle Ram uses, and as mentioned in the document I posted the dual style can damage the OEM receptacle. I’m not sure that’s worth saving $10 to just swap them out to the correct plug.

I disagree and don't buy it. The Bargman two contact plug works as designed. The truck plug oem or aftermarket on my trucks are identical to the naked eye and all work fine.

Bargman started in 1931 making electrical connections for the Military, I trust them completely. There are numerous companies now making the same plug.

 

[AH64ID]

I disagree and don't buy it. The Bargman two contact plug works as designed. The truck plug oem or aftermarket on my trucks are identical to the naked eye and all work fine.

Bargman started in 1931 making electrical connections for the Military, I trust them completely. There are numerous companies now making the same plug.

It’s easy for me to see how they aren’t designed for each other, as they are in slightly different locations relative to the plug. I’m not sure what there isn’t to buy. Damage isn’t likely, but they are two different designs despite both being 7 pin. I’ve used both on my Rams without issue as well, sometimes there isn’t an option, but I also convert my trailers to the correct plug.

None of that means the Bargman stuff is bad, it’s simply the wrong part. It doesn’t matter how good something is if it’s the wrong part.

 

[NIsaacs]

It’s easy for me to see how they aren’t designed for each other, as they are in slightly different locations relative to the plug. I’m not sure what there isn’t to buy. Damage isn’t likely, but they are two different designs despite both being 7 pin. I’ve used both on my Rams without issue as well, sometimes there isn’t an option, but I also convert my trailers to the correct plug.

None of that means the Bargman stuff is bad, it’s simply the wrong part. It doesn’t matter how good something is if it’s the wrong part.

You are picking little black specs out of pepper. How is it the wrong part? Slightly different locations, by how many thousands? The truck plugs probably differ by a few thousands also.

The truck plug has a folded tapered tip, double contact, spring loaded sorta. The plug has a double contact, open tapered, spring loaded contact. How are they not compatible? They are hand and glove.

I don't buy it because it is not logic.

If you don't like/want them, that is fine. You have even said, you have used them without issue, but to say it is the wrong part??

 

[AH64ID]

I posted the document that says it’s the wrong part, so
I’m confused on how you can argue its validity.

Looking at the truck receptacle and looking at the dual blade plug it’s obvious, at least to me, that they are designed differently. The single blade plug is the correct plug to use, that’s all there really is to it.

Its obviously a big enough issue that Ram published that document to save some warranty claims.

Yes you will get contact with the dual blade, but it’s not the proper connection and that’s all the really matters when troubleshooting like the OP is. The first thing he needs to do it’s get the correct plug.

 

[NIsaacs]

I posted the document that says it’s the wrong part, so
I’m confused on how you can argue its validity.

I guess I find it strange that Ram is using a vehicle plug they claim is different. That plug socket is the same from numerous manufacturers. The 7-way has been a standard for ages. Pollak (Ram oem) is just one of a dozen standard trailer plug sockets.

Ram needs to contact Bargman and PJ trailers and have them install tags in big red letters on their plugs..."does not fit Ram trucks"...

 

[Ozymandias]

They could as good install a standard SAE J2863 plug to their Trailers instead of "something".

 

[AH64ID]

I guess I find it strange that Ram is using a vehicle plug they claim is different. That plug socket is the same from numerous manufacturers. The 7-way has been a standard for ages. Pollak (Ram oem) is just one of a dozen standard trailer plug sockets.

Ram needs to contact Bargman and PJ trailers and have them install tags in big red letters on their plugs..."does not fit Ram trucks"...

Ram is using a SAE J2863 standard plug, doesn’t seem that strange. It’s not a Ram standard, or Ram issue, it’s a difference in designs.

Does the dual blade plug have a SAE standard?

 

[NIsaacs]

Ram is using a SAE J2863 standard plug, doesn’t seem that strange. It’s not a Ram standard, or Ram issue, it’s a difference in designs.

Does the dual blade plug have a SAE standard?

From what I can glean from the SAE-J2863, it is just a minimum standard relating to the tow vehicle, in that it provides 7 way use.

Most trailer manufacturers are NATM compliant, works for me.

Wikipedia:

Full Description
This SAE Standard provides the minimum requirements for automotive or RV, seven position, self-draining trailer tow connector interface. The procedures included within this specification are intended to cover the test methods, design, and performance requirements of the electrical interface of the seven-position trailer tow connector in low voltage (0 to 20) road vehicle applications.

7-pin round blade connector (SAE J2863)[edit]
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7-pin blade connector (Towing vehicle side)
This is common for RVs and other large trailers which have additional loads beyond the basic for tail lights and brake/turn signals. The standard is defined by SAE J2863.

 

[Ozymandias]

Yes, the design is part of the standard. And like John said, this connector is for the last 20 years the standard connector on all vehicles that leave the factory with a 7-pin.
Maybe maybe it is about time for the trailer manufacturers to adapt that standard too and deliver their Trailers to the customer with a plug that fits all vehicles out there younger then 20 years? Just asking..
Right now it looks pretty stubborn to me to hold on to something that is outdated.

It reminds me on Europe some twenty years back when some manufacturers tried to push a connector different then the back then new standard ISO 11446 13-pin connector.
It took them sure ten years to realize that they don't do a favor to their customers with this because everyone either needed to buy an adapter harness or simply cut off this useless plug and put on a proper one.