A few more 04 details

[Matt S]

I sure hope that isn't the case. I'm buying an 04 so I don't have the emissions. I just might be in the market for a used 03 if that is the case.

 

[nickleinonen]

oh man... all this talk about egr's made my stomach churn and drop like a stone. i am scared to order a 2004. when it arrives and if it has an egr, it'll be like being told that you have cancer or something [at least to me]. it is something that will need surgery to remove to allow the host to survive... oh my oh my... i sure hope there will be no cancerous egr systems on these fine engines until 01. 01. 2004

 

[DLeno]

I'm not convinced yet that the cummins EGR is as vile as some folks are saying, although I agree that I would prefer not to have it -- it doesn't benefit me. I will say that I have very low confidence in these two dealers and I'm suspicous that they were trying to unload their 03 inventory. think about it: how can the peak HP go up if the peak torque goes down? the answer: only with a corresponding rpm increase, since HP is proportional to rpm x torque.



something doesn't sound right to me about this so I wouldn't put too much credence into a salesman's flapping lips. If you ask me, the current speculation that Dodge will not introduce EGR (due to cost) until they have to makes more sense to me. Indeed, with the pricing in on the new 2004s I see basically no price increase over the 2003 (I think it was $400 for a loaded vehicle). EGR and VGT together are substantial cost increases if I understand correctly, and cannot be contained within a $400 price increase. So that my speculation - that having seen the 04 price list I don't think EGR and VGT is in there.



As for introducing EGR without VGT I don't think that sounds right either. Cummins introduced them at the same time in 2002 on the commercial engines. All indications I have are that they would be introduced at the same time, since VGT offsets some of the issues with EGT.



So I'm with the "no EGR in early 04" camp, but I'm just speculating as well, and proof of the pudding is in looking at the first 04s that hit the lot.

 

[RankRam]

I agree with DLeno, You have made some very good points.



When you think of it from the money standpoint they can't make the EGR changes for that kind of dough.



But then again maybe they found other ways of cost cutting. Instead of having to buy rear fender liners and wanting a hood liner for an 03.



On the 04 you will need to buy rear fender liners AND front fender liners and maybe the rearseats and carpeting will all be purchased at the parts counter!

 

[LightmanE300]

That made my stomach churn too, yikes. I wish someone could get some concrete info on the damn EGR. Don't any TDR members have contacts that work at DC??

 

[nickleinonen]

no answer from cummins either....

i wrote cummins an email asking them about the introduction of the egr system, and got back a reply, but they asked daimler and got shot down.

We have asked our Dodge account team as to the availability of the HO engine for CARB states (CA, ME, MA), the exact hp rating for the HO engine in these states and also when/whether EGR will be added. We also asked about future engine ratings for the Dodge Ram trucks.



The Dodge response is: "We cannot discuss future model years as to how they will be equipped and spec'd.  Therefore, when Daimler-Chrysler defines their product plans for future product and makes them public, we then can share that information with Dodge and Cummins customers.



Since we build the diesel engines for Dodge and they supply all the other components to build the trucks, we are not in a position to advise you on the truck systems, components or Dodge application information on their product line. Any announcements on driveline and applications issues must come from the chassis or vehicle manufacturer.



Cummins builds many different engine models with many different horsepower, rpm and torque ratings for many different customers. Cummins OEM equipment manufacturers then decide which engine models they will design into their vehicles. Cummins may make application suggestions for the engine but the vehicle manufacturer decides which engine models they want to use in their products.

 

[Blu-meanie]

Re: Re: A few more 04 details

Originally posted by KCJackson

Ewwww I hate those things with a passion. I am perfectly capable of turning a key in a lock. That must mean the passenger's side front door loses its lock cylinder as well.



When you have to drive/park in a questionable area, the last thing you want to do is give a crook a couple seconds headstart to jump in the door before you do, all because he's listening for a chirp or click of locks opening.

Smith and Wesson makes an excellent cylinder lock that can be employed in "questionable" areas.

 

[Blakers]

Re: no answer from cummins either....

Originally posted by nickleinonen

i wrote cummins an email asking them about the introduction of the egr system, and got back a reply, but they asked daimler and got shot down.

Why all the worry about EGR? It's not like we haven't modified everything else on CTDs. Just disconnect the darned thing! Or, someone will certainly make a bombing modification to sell for it.

 

[LightmanE300]

Well Blakers, it's a federal offense to modify emissions equipment in a way that would increase emissions. Most likely disconnecting the EGR will trip a check engine light of some sort, and may throw off other settings. I sure hope the first half of the 2004's don't have EGR. I will definitely order one. Can't wait till the first trucks hit in August so we can see for sure. Looks like DC and Cummins surely aren't going to tell us anything

 

[Posm]

From what I'm reading the Duracrack will not get its emissions updates until Jan 1. I do not expect the Cummins to have it before they have to either.

 

[Blakers]

Originally posted by LightmanE300

Well Blakers, it's a federal offense to modify emissions equipment in a way that would increase emissions.

Well... duh! You do know you're on the TDR, don't you? There's more bombing going on here than in Baghdad.

 

[MCummings]

Raised emissions... What are you talking about ??!



#ad






Think I should retrofit EGR?



Merrick Cummings Jr

 

[LightmanE300]

Originally posted by Blakers

Well... duh! You do know you're on the TDR, don't you? There's more bombing going on here than in Baghdad.

I was trying to be PC. My TDI has had it's EGR completely removed and replaced with a DieselGeek Race Pipe, for 'off road' use , but of course!!



Removing the egr wont be hard or pulling the vacuum hose. It's killing the Check engine light that will prove so difficult. Also I doubt the aftermarket 'bomber' companies will provide ways to kill it since the mod is illegal. I could be wrong. I just hope they dont come on the first batch of 04's.



Damn those are some serious black clouds comin out of those stacks!! Looks cool, but I have too much of a conscience to pollute that much . Impressive nonetheless. By the way mcummings, your comments had me rollin!:-laf You're probably a serious candidate for biodiesel!! Watch your soot/smoke reduce by 50% with a low blend of bio, and increase power with the higher cetane!

 

[DLeno]

Originally posted by LightmanE300

Most likely disconnecting the EGR will trip a check engine light of some sort, and may throw off other settings.

yea, not to mention another 10,000 lines of code in the ECM to manage all that hocus pocus, which will require an illegal re-flash to get around. But not to worry, DD and Edge have been working with EGR already on the Fords. Lawrence told me that EGR isn't the issue -- its the variable geometry turbos that are causing issues for performance boxes -- the turbos react too slow. If you want power "right now" and you mash it, by the time the turbo acheives its larger geometry, its already toasted. So I think we can expect the fueling boxes for VGTs to be rather slow in responding.



Hopefully, Holeset does better.