A twist on Dieselgate aka The VW disaster.

[Wayne M.]

And Mr. Wilson comes up for air

I didn't even touch on the export kit for these trucks- a hacksaw and a thumb drive.......

Mike, have you seen "Dura-fit" brand aftermarket DPF filters?

Motorhead, CNG/ LPG is very viable, but not friendly in some markets. In the Northeast, the infrastructure just ain't there.
We're playing with another alternative fuel- DME- https://www.aboutdme.org/index.asp?sid=48 . This sounds promising, but here again, it's not part of our free country's playbook. The FDNY is scared of it, and as of now, not permitted in NYC. They're working on a deal, and my zone just may get a DME fueled truck to test. I'm excited about that.

 

[mwilson]

I have been approached by Dura Fit but I prefer to stick with my OEM suppliers because of warranty and accountability. Bake and blow cleaning processes are ruining DPF's and causing devalued core credits when a customer does finally go with a reman DPF.

 

[mwilson]

Funny you bring up CNG vehicles, the CFO and I were discussing that very thing today. We would to construct an explosion proof shop out by itself before we could even think about working on them. LNG is fine with a few precautions.

 

[Motorhead]

I do know that in metropolitan areas that even the UPS package cars are either CNG or they are now using all electric for routes that are close to the UPS depot and are in dense areas where the package car sits in a loading zone and the driver walks/hand trucks a lot of the stops. This is used in a downtown retail area.
Many guys I know in the trucking industry are predicting that diesel power will be replaced soon by natural gas fueled engines. Even long haul.

 

[Wayne M.]

I have been approached by Dura Fit but I prefer to stick with my OEM suppliers because of warranty and accountability. Bake and blow cleaning processes are ruining DPF's and causing devalued core credits when a customer does finally go with a reman DPF.

I thought Dura Fit was a new OE equivelant. They've been working for us.

 

[jhenderson]

If the USA was truly sincere about punishing VW they'd bar them from selling new vehicles here. Rather than that they plan to confiscate funds and dole them out to friends of the current administration. Kind of like the way thy treat Tobacco. Don't use it. It'll kill you. But we don't make it illegal, we fund our pet projects with exorbitant taxes placed upon it. It's all about the money, not the outcome.

 

[JR]

A stop sale order has been in effect on all TDI's for over a year now and will remain that way until they figure out how to pass the same tests everyone else is required to pass. Banning a perfectly compliant vehicle "just because" would be rather tyrannical. Dont think any of us want big brother goin there.

 

[Wayne M.]

If the USA was truly sincere about punishing VW they'd bar them from selling new vehicles here. Rather than that they plan to confiscate funds and dole them out to friends of the current administration. Kind of like the way thy treat Tobacco. Don't use it. It'll kill you. But we don't make it illegal, we fund our pet projects with exorbitant taxes placed upon it. It's all about the money, not the outcome.

Excellent.

 

[AMink]

My wife and I have a 2014 Passat SE. We like the car a lot, minus a few annoying rattles, especially the 50mpg on the highway. I was at the local VW dealer (getting snow tires for our Mini with the $500 VW card) and they said for the cars with the DEF already on board the fix would be a flash/reprogram that would drop mileage a few MPGs. He didn't say anything about drivability or longevity. The fix for the non-DEF cars isn't in the pipe yet. I'm torn between keeping the car and the 45 potential MPG and getting a gasser. Unfortunately, I have yet to find a gasser that gets more than 40 combined, has the room of the Passat, and is actually fun to drive. Guess we'll wait and see what others find out. I really don't like car shopping but I'm hoping there will be some incentives from VW and other manufacturers to spend our sell-back $$$.

 

[jhenderson]

A stop sale order has been in effect on all TDI's for over a year now and will remain that way until they figure out how to pass the same tests everyone else is required to pass. Banning a perfectly compliant vehicle "just because" would be rather tyrannical. Dont think any of us want big brother goin there.[/

Didn't quite get my meaning, did you?

 

[JR]

OK I'll bite. Please tell how you would feel if both scenarios in your post were to play out.

One, an entire manufacturers compliant vehicles were banned from the US based on the infraction of two engines, and two, the govt starts banning personal lifestyle choices just because they are "bad" for us IE tobacco. See the problem with your comment is if they would actually outlaw something like tobacco what else would they deem "bad" for us? Alcohol? Anything with cholesterol? Motorcycles and ATV's? How bout chainsaws? A case could be made for a whole lot of stuff that could potentially be "bad" or "dangerous" for you. It's not their job to determine what's bad for me. That's my responsibility. I don't agree with how dependent our govt has become on taxation but in the same token I don't think any of us want them going where you suggest.

 

[jhenderson]

I was right, you don't get it. I don't want them to ban VW. The point is, it's all about the big lie. Our Govt cares more about the money than the pollution. Just like they care more about tobacco taxes than the resulting medical cost. They see VW as a cash cow to be milked, not a cheater to be punished. Follow the money. Did you read the link? The fines will in part go to keep Tesla afloat. That's because without our tax money they'd have gone under years ago. They live off special legislation, not profit on cars sold. Keep your eye on the magician's quiet hand and it's easy to learn his tricks.

 

[BigPapa]

See the problem with your comment is if they would actually outlaw something like tobacco what else would they deem "bad" for us? Alcohol? Anything with cholesterol? Motorcycles and ATV's? How bout chainsaws? A case could be made for a whole lot of stuff that could potentially be "bad" or "dangerous" for you. It's not their job to determine what's bad for me. That's my responsibility. I don't agree with how dependent our govt has become on taxation but in the same token I don't think any of us want them going where you suggest.

I was in the motorcycle business when the CPSC "outlawed" three wheelers. Right after the CPSC got that done they went after hair dryers saying that people were being electrocuted while trying to use them in the bath tub.....

 

[Wayne M.]

Actually ALL of this is going on at once, fellas. The Gov is attacking things they deem bad for us- that paves the way for enforcement and overbearing regs. Tobacco, a little at a time has been endlessly attacked, and now taxed. A pack of smokes in NYC is almost $13. NYC unfairly taxes tobacco.
Years ago Manhattan was to have a street gran prix similar to Monaco and other cities around the world. It was gonna be huge. The ads were drawn up and everything. IRL was to repave the entire area below Chambers st. Then all of a sudden the council put the K-bosh on it- why? The title sponsor- MARLBORO. No other reason.
This is just one example I know the details of.

Meanwhile, I found a story that may explain why VW did what they've done. The meat is in a FT piece, but it's behind a paywall. I'll repeat my stand that any car can be made to fail if driven a certain way (or even normally). It's a huge game and I still feel VW was ambushed.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...a31233/eu-diesel-emissions-testing-before-vw/

 

[JR]

Did you read the link?

I quit when I got to the part where he stated "Cars like the diesel-powered VW Jetta and Golf and Beetle cost thousands less to buy than a hybrid like the Toyota Prius"

Not only is a baseline Prius slightly less than a baseline TDI (as of 2015) the operating fuel is also cheaper. Thats coming from a TDI owner so no bias involved. Everybody likes to paint pictures with whichever slighted brush suits them best. Aside from that authors brush being on the opposite end of the spectrum he's pretty uninformed to boot.

So your upset VW is being forced to invest in low emission/ zero emission tech toward our future. I suppose they could do nothing, and one day when the US is flirting with population numbers similar to China we could end up like this.

That's a recent picture btw. The US is one of the very few places on earth that doesn't have unhealthy levels of smog. They didn't get there by doing nothing.

 

[JR]

Here's another example of the "crooks"behind the scenes of the clean air and water act. It wasn't long ago you couldn't eat fish out of Lake Erie or its streams. There were days the pollution was so bad they would shut the beaches down for days or weeks at a time. Our area was one of the worst because of all the industry in the area dating back to WWII era that discharged directly into streams or the lake. Today thats all changed. Once in a while they will post warnings about bacteria counts from algae blooms but I can't remember the last time they shut a beach down and it's been over a decade since I've seen an advisory on eating your catch.

Politics aside (because that's really not the point of any of my posts) ya gotta admit they've done a pretty good job at cleaning our country up.

 

[Wayne M.]

I quit when I got to the part where he stated "Cars like the diesel-powered VW Jetta and Golf and Beetle cost thousands less to buy than a hybrid like the Toyota Prius"

Not only is a baseline Prius slightly less than a baseline TDI (as of 2015) the operating fuel is also cheaper. Thats coming from a TDI owner so no bias involved. Everybody likes to paint pictures with whichever slighted brush suits them best. Aside from that authors brush being on the opposite end of the spectrum he's pretty uninformed to boot.

So your upset VW is being forced to invest in low emission/ zero emission tech toward our future. I suppose they could do nothing, and one day when the US is flirting with population numbers similar to China we could end up like this.

View attachment 97187
That's a recent picture btw. The US is one of the very few places on earth that doesn't have unhealthy levels of smog. They didn't get there by doing nothing.

I know the prius. Well. I am forced to, due to the "green" nature of my agency. I'm telling you now that when it comes time to salvage these cars, any enviro plus the Prius has given will be taken back at that time. reclaiming the HV battery alone will be a nightmare. The TDI will be no different than any other conventional vehicle- when it's time comes. I'm sure most TDIs could be running long after most Prius.
Net cost, I feel the TDI is a more enviro friendly vehicle even with the cheat. Politics say different.
One would have to prove to me that the cradle to grave cost (in all aspects) of all alt vehicles vs. conventionals is not much different.

JR, I am proud of the steady accomplishments we have netted by being enviro responsible. We have made huge strides in the last 30 years. If we could get the rest of the industrialized world up to par, we'd be doing better than leaning on us further.

 

[mwilson]

The Chinese are smogging up the planet making goods that we buy. Meanwhile here in Maine the northern portion of the State is dying. Our paper mills are gone, victims of the EPA and NAFTA. The mills had cleaned up their act but the Enviro wackos were still not satisfied. Don't get me wrong, I remember the Androscoggin River running brown and foamy in the late '60s, something needed to be done and it was. But there needs to be some sort of balance between a healthy economy and a healthy planet.

So we shift the smog to another country and suffer here. I don't quite get it......

I hear that Mack may not make the newest round of emissions. You can plant flowers in any GHG14 engine's tailpipe right now. Is that not good enough for a little while???

 

[mwilson]

I can't give you figures but I order endless DPF's, SCR's, Sensors, Harnesses, DEF pumps, etc.....when these puppies are out of warranty a common man will not be able to afford the upkeep. That applies to ALL makes of engines and trucks.....Then toss some road chemicals into the mix........one green terminal somewhere can cost thousands of dollars to find.

We (The USA) are doing our part but at a very high cost.

 

[Wayne M.]

I hear that Mack may not make the newest round of emissions. You can plant flowers in any GHG14 engine's tailpipe right now. Is that not good enough for a little while???

Mike, can you give me a hint about your Mack lead? PM me if you must.
You are very on point with the rest of your statement. The world needs a balance of production and responsibility.